OT: Corona virus

[BBfanboy]

ORIGINAL: Chickenboy

ORIGINAL: Canoerebel

Ouch. That's a difficult combination. Since my mom is 90 and in assisted living, the vulnerability of her age group is always in mind.

How is it that you have an aunt in Canada?

My mother is a first generation American, having been born and raised with her two sisters in Montreal. I'm 50% French- Canadian by blood.

I have a favor to ask the Canadian readers of this thread. Can you please point me towards the latest restrictions on Americans on travel to Canada? Last I heard, Canada was allowing Americans to travel there, but with a mandated 14 day quarantine upon arrival. Is that still in effect?

I need to think about travelling there within two weeks.

Sorry to hear about your Aunt/Godmother. Quebec has certainly mishandled many things in their response to the pandemic (health care is a provincial responsibility). Their regulations of private Seniors Care Homes have been more lax than most provinces and they use a lot of recent immigrant labour - people who have not had training about health care precautions and work long hours for little pay. When the first cases in Care Homes came up the owners kept the news under wraps by forbidding family visits - but still accepted new 'clients'. Only when they ran out of places to hide the bodies did the media pay attention to what was happening in Care Homes.
I mentioned my concerns about Care Homes and Reservations some time ago on this forum and I am not happy about having them confirmed. The Federal Government has called up the Reserves (militia) to assist the Care homes through the crisis, but long term the owners of these facilities (who were getting very rich on the fees they charge vs. the care they give) should be made to create sustainable facilities and staffing.

As for Canadian regulations, the 14 day quarantine rule applies to everyone, including Canadians and the migrant workers (mostly Mexican) who come here to work in Agriculture, getting new crops started, tending them and harvesting the results). Those workers are able to get financial help to pay for their quarantine costs because we need them to do their thing afterwards.

There may be an exception for attendance at funerals, but most funerals are limited to something like 10 persons attending with social distancing. I will try to find the info.

EDIT: CB - PM sent.

[AW1Steve]

ORIGINAL: RangerJoe

ORIGINAL: Chickenboy

ORIGINAL: Canoerebel

Ouch. That's a difficult combination. Since my mom is 90 and in assisted living, the vulnerability of her age group is always in mind.

How is it that you have an aunt in Canada?

My mother is a first generation American, having been born and raised with her two sisters in Montreal. I'm 50% French- Canadian by blood.

I have a favor to ask the Canadian readers of this thread. Can you please point me towards the latest restrictions on Americans on travel to Canada? Last I heard, Canada was allowing Americans to travel there, but with a mandated 14 day quarantine upon arrival. Is that still in effect?

I need to think about travelling there within two weeks.

I always like to ask people who claim that they are French Canadian. Are you French? Or are you Canadian?

That said, at least one of my ancestors did live in France for awhile. [8|] There are still people living there with that same last name is y understanding.

I AM AN American. My ancestors were Canadian. And French before that. And Normans before that. And before that, some kind of viking. That's them. I'm and American , and always have been. [:D]

[BBfanboy]

ORIGINAL: AW1Steve

ORIGINAL: RangerJoe

ORIGINAL: Chickenboy




My mother is a first generation American, having been born and raised with her two sisters in Montreal. I'm 50% French- Canadian by blood.

I have a favor to ask the Canadian readers of this thread. Can you please point me towards the latest restrictions on Americans on travel to Canada? Last I heard, Canada was allowing Americans to travel there, but with a mandated 14 day quarantine upon arrival. Is that still in effect?

I need to think about travelling there within two weeks.

I always like to ask people who claim that they are French Canadian. Are you French? Or are you Canadian?

That said, at least one of my ancestors did live in France for awhile. [8|] There are still people living there with that same last name is y understanding.

I AM AN American. My ancestors were Canadian. And French before that. And Normans before that. And before that, some kind of viking. That's them. I'm and American , and always have been. [:D]

Quebec has the largest group of French-speaking people outside France, and their language and culture are precious to them. The French were the first to explore Canada and establish communities here in the early 1500s. As part of our heritage, and in recognition of their contributions in repelling American invasions, the French have been granted special treatment in many ways. Provinces have been encouraged to include French language instruction in their school curricula, although there was a lot of resistance from provinces that were jealous of Quebec's special treatment. Thankfully, younger generations who have had the opportunity to travel to Quebec with an open mind have come to realize the value of that culture and language. If you wonder about this, take a trip to Quebec City in summertime.

So when a person is French-Canadian, they have divided emotions. They are Canadian so long as Canada respects their language and culture but have considered separating if the rest of Canada threatens to try and make Quebec an Anglophone province. Canada has been learning how to do multi-culturalism for some time and we can handle it - no need to make everyone conform to whatever one group thinks it should be.

[Lowpe]

ORIGINAL: MakeeLearn

ORIGINAL: Lowpe

Here in Pennsylvania, a lot of funny things are going on. County Coroner's from rural areas say zero deaths from Covid, and but the state is attributing many deaths due to covid to them.

Here is a picture of our State Sec of Health along with other members of our leadership.

Maybe... just maybe... it's because some Coronaviruses identify as a flu.

CR, seems the numbers have been revised. This local article is a bit political so be warned:

https://thefranklincountyjournal.com/20 ... h-figures/

[RangerJoe]

ORIGINAL: Lowpe

ORIGINAL: MakeeLearn

ORIGINAL: Lowpe

Here in Pennsylvania, a lot of funny things are going on. County Coroner's from rural areas say zero deaths from Covid, and but the state is attributing many deaths due to covid to them.

Here is a picture of our State Sec of Health along with other members of our leadership.

Maybe... just maybe... it's because some Coronaviruses identify as a flu.

CR, seems the numbers have been revised. This local article is a bit political so be warned:

https://thefranklincountyjournal.com/20 ... h-figures/

And another question is, does this test actually mean Sars2 or could there be another corona virus such as the ones that also cause the common cold.

[CaptBeefheart]

I mentioned before about the two patients receiving plasma transfer therapy at the missus's hospital. For you medical professional types like Cap and ChickenBoy (and curious others), here's the research paper: Use of Convalescent Plasma Therapy in Two COVID-19 Patients with Acute Respiratory Distress Syndrome in Korea

Our news continues to be good here. Here's the latest: S. Korea reports 6 more cases of new coronavirus, total now at 10,708

Restaurants and bars seem to be pretty much back to normal (maybe 80%), subway ridership is about 70% of normal but picking back up, and taxis are still fairly easy to get, so we're not completely back to normal yet. My daughter started preschool on Tuesday and regular schools are expected to re-open on May 6 (although no announcement yet). I plan to take advantage of the Buddha's Birthday holiday and head out of town for an overnighter with the family next Thursday. Domestic travel is going up quickly as people want to get away from home but avoid the scary world out there.

Cheers,
CB

[RangerJoe]

ORIGINAL: CaptBeefheart

I mentioned before about the two patients receiving plasma transfer therapy at the missus's hospital. For you medical professional types like Cap and ChickenBoy (and curious others), here's the research paper: Use of Convalescent Plasma Therapy in Two COVID-19 Patients with Acute Respiratory Distress Syndrome in Korea

Our news continues to be good here. Here's the latest: S. Korea reports 6 more cases of new coronavirus, total now at 10,708

Restaurants and bars seem to be pretty much back to normal (maybe 80%), subway ridership is about 70% of normal but picking back up, and taxis are still fairly easy to get, so we're not completely back to normal yet. My daughter started preschool on Tuesday and regular schools are expected to re-open on May 6 (although no announcement yet). I plan to take advantage of the Buddha's Birthday holiday and head out of town for an overnighter with the family next Thursday. Domestic travel is going up quickly as people want to get away from home but avoid the scary world out there.

Cheers,
CB

Thank you.

[Canoerebel]

I don't think we've heard from John Dillworth in a week or two. One reason could be that he is worn out from fighting on the front lines. Hopefully he's well.

[Canoerebel]

Thanks, Capt. Your ridership, bar patronage, etc. estimates indicate that people continue to act with some restraint, even these many weeks after the real crisis passed in Korea. That seems prudent and is better than everybody suddenly flocking together in dangerous ways.

Some businesses in Georgia are eligible to reopen tomorrow, with others set for Monday. They have to comply with countermeasures. Some will find meeting the guidelines difficult and expensive. Some will proceed. I think people will mostly cautiously resume patronage at places like restaurants.

Churches may be eligible to re-open sometime around May 20 subject to social distancing. That'll be challenging too, but the leaders of my church are meeting Monday evening to discuss.

I thought it would be another week or ten days before GA would take any steps. The early easing of countermeasures is a surprise but I understand the various rationales that went into making this decision. No doubt the most important thing is to keep the elderly/infirm in assisted living and nursing facilities safe. That's the vulnerable population.

Seeing how things go here should help other states evaluate their own options. I'm hopeful that things might go well - that we might be issuing Captain Beefheart reports from here in six weeks. But a flop would be a terrible thing to endure.

[CaptBeefheart]

I think the reason it's gone fairly well here is people have been more or less free to handle this in their own way. As I've said many times, there have been no government-mandated shutdowns in Korea other than for government-owned properties (schools, museums, hotels in national parks, etc.). Privately-owned businesses, with only a few exceptions such as nightclubs, have been left alone to sort their own way through this mess (with guidelines, of course).

Out of a sense of community, mainstream churches went to video services a while ago. Some churches (or cults) with a martyr complex went ahead and held services, and one did stupid things designed to spread the virus. Other businesses and organizations, fearful of a PR backlash, cancelled meetings, instituted work from home, started doing Zoom meetings, etc. The whole point is it's been voluntary and a sense of shame and the risk of bad press outcomes has kept people and businesses in line. The last few weeks I've seen people going beyond the guidelines, and I'm sure I have myself (I don't actually pay a lot of attention to that stuff beyond what my missus tells me), but to me the lack of an oppressive government has meant people are more likely to follow the social distancing guidelines than not. If this had happened during the years of military dictatorship (say 1960-88), I think we'd have seen mass protests and we'd be in a lot worse shape.

Personally, I tend to believe people are smart enough to handle liberty just fine. I have never felt the need to tell people how to live their lives and I don't understand politicians who seem to think they have to treat citizens like children.

Cheers,
CB

[wdolson]

I've had complaints about the political tone on this thread. Please dial it back. I know it's difficult to discuss the pandemic without discussing the political decisions that led to particular outcomes, but please try to keep politics out of it or I'll have to lock the thread.

Bill

[Alfred]

ORIGINAL: Macclan5


...The oil glut and the corresponding decrease in energy prices is a massive - generally non inflationary - global economic stimulus. It feeds through the entire supply chain. Parts produced in Mexico - shipped to Penn - assembled - shipped California. Think of ~ 6 - 12% every step along a chain - not necessarily 1 step at consumer delivery (??)

Everything is touched by energy / oil - at least until Mr Elon Musk has a 80% Market Share in locomotives, semi-trucks and cars.

Disagree.

The collapse in oil prices is a major deflationary episode which if sustained, will have three direct international adverse consequences:

(a) reduce global aggregate demand

(b) foster civil unrest

(c) destroy the North American fracking industry

Not all major oil producing countries have sizeable financial reserves which can cushion, for a limited time, the loss of oil revenues. The few that do have them, such as Saudi Arabia, will eventually be forced to do two things; (i) cut back on their importation of non essential Western products such as their massive weapon purchases, and (ii) cut back on their foreign labour force which will not be able to send remittances back home. Their reduced demand will feed into world reduced demand.

Countries without substantial financial reserves (such as Iran, Nigeria, Venezuela, Libya) tend to not rely on a foreign workforce. In their case the reduced demand will be predominantly limited to local consumption. However they face civil unrest domestically, which could easily spill over their borders and consequently impact on demand elsewhere.

It isn't just that the cost of production of fracked oil is much higher than that of "natural" oil production, it is the incredible level of indebtedness of the industry. There is very little equity in the North American oil fracking companies. They are very vulnerable to collapse. I wouldn't want to be a bank heavily exposed to this industry.

Alfred

[fcooke]

Seems like Alfred knows about a bit of Finance on top of his WIPAE expertise.....

The Russia OPEC thing will have to come to a close soon. Saudi can afford it more than Russia. I still cannot fathom why they went down the road they did.

Perhaps some civil unrest in those countries would benefit the world over the long term.

As a sad shareholder of one of the NA fracking companies, Alfred has hit the nail on the head on the debt challenge.

But I do think oil will come back, if I had a few bucks in reserve I might be buying into it. But sadly there are many investment opportunities right now.

Just try to support your local biz to the extent you can safely/financially do.

[HansBolter]

Chickenboy,

Hope all is well with your family.

Saw this headline this morning:

Top DHS Official: Coronavirus Dies Fastest In Sunlight, Heat, Humidity


These are three things Florida has in abundance.

Have to find some peace of mind wherever we can.



ps: sent a PM to Bill asking if we are allowed to complain about the people complaining.

[Ian R]

ORIGINAL: HansBolter



Top DHS Official: Coronavirus Dies Fastest In Sunlight, Heat, Humidity

This interests me.

As at 3:00pm on 24 April 2020, there have been 6,675 confirmed cases of COVID-19 in Australia. There have been 14 new cases since 3:00pm yesterday.

Of the 6,675 confirmed cases in Australia, 78 have died and 5,136 have been reported as recovered from COVID-19. More than 482,000 tests have been conducted across Australia.

Testing here is basically now available to anyone who puts up their hand and says "I felt a bit hot last week".

Edit - free testing, in the sense that our universal tax office collected national health insurance scheme pays for it.

The sooner we get the 'marker' test so cleared persons can get back to work, the better.

[Ian R]

ORIGINAL: Zorch

It's time this thread was locked.

If you are trying to incite a level of argument that would see that happen - perhaps being more subtle would help?

[MakeeLearn]

De Blasio’s social distancing tip line flooded with penis photos, Hitler memes
April 21, 2020

https://nypost.com/2020/04/21/de-blasio ... scenities/

"Mayor Bill de Blasio’s critics let him know how they really felt about him ordering New Yorkers to snitch on each other for violating social-distancing rules — by flooding his new tip line with crank complaints including “dick pics” and people flipping the bird, The Post has learned."

[MakeeLearn]

Nearly all COVID-19 patients placed on ventilators died, study says

Many of the patients placed on ventilators also had preexisting conditions.
Apr 23, 2020

https://thehill.com/changing-america/we ... -placed-on


"New health care data suggests that almost half of all coronavirus patients placed on ventilators die, first reported by CNN.

The data was gathered at Northwell Health, New York state’s largest hospital system. It revealed that about 20 percent of COVID-19 patients passed away, and 88 percent of those placed on ventilators died.

The study, published in the Journal of the American Medical Association (JAMA) examines 5,700 patients hospitalized with coronavirus infections in the New York City region, with final outcomes recorded for 2,634 patients. The average patient age was 63 years old."

[Canoerebel]

In easing countermeasures, Georgia is allowing certain business to re-open today (salons, bowling allies, and some others). Restaurants can re-open Monday.

Here's an excerpt from our local newspaper today, describing how some businesses planning to re-open are handling things (p.s. - no new cases reported yesterday, and the case level has been basically flat the past week):


Some local businesses are cautiously getting ready to get things back to something like normal.

Kim R*****, owner of the ****** *** Salon, has left a voicemail on her telephone informing customers that she will reopen slowly. She asks her regulars for patience as they have over a month’s worth of appointments to try to reschedule.

“If you have an appointment we are requesting that you wear a mask, stay in your car and text your stylist to let them know you’re here,” the voicemail says. “They will let you know when to come in. We have to watch our numbers.”

Salon ***** will also reopen Friday.

Owner Cindy T***** has gotten a laser thermometer to check the foreheads of customers as they return. Anyone with a temperature over 99 will not be permitted inside the salon, she said. The shop was cleaned professionally Thursday prior to the reopening. One of the reasons clients are being asked to wait in their cars is to give the stylists a chance to clean thoroughly following each appointment. The waiting area will not be used for the time being.

“We are not allowing anybody to bring extra people to the appointment,” ****** said. “We’re not going to have mom and dad and three kids coming in all together. That goes over our limit of people we can have.”

Bart K******, who operates both of Rome’s bowling alleys, said he plans to open Friday — but will limit activity to every other pair of lanes. He said that is well beyond the 6-foot social distance rule.

“We will have someone taking names at the door and counting people,” K****** said. “People will have to wait outside in their cars and as lanes become available we will call them in.”

Employees will be cleaning the alley seating area, bowling balls and public access areas frequently as turnover takes place.

[MakeeLearn]

“It's easier to fool people than to convince them that they have been fooled.”
― Mark Twain