Empire of the Sun - DesertWolf101 (J) vs Andy Mac (A)

[DesertWolf101]

An update on the Empire's borders:

[DesertWolf101]

November 8-9, 1942

Allied activity and movement has increased in India, looks like Andy might finally be ready to go for the offensive in the subcontinent?

Meanwhile in the USSR, Japanese troops are tightening the circle around the Mogocha pocket and are moving up to the Chita frontline. I also carried out a surprise flanking maneuver in the Ulan Bator sector and destroyed the Soviet 1st Motorized Rifle Regiment in the process. I don't expect too much from this move but anything that could make Andy uncomfortable here is a good thing.

[DesertWolf101]

The fun little operation in the far northeast corner of the USSR has concluded as well with the successful capture of Magadan.

[GetAssista]

ORIGINAL: DesertWolf101
The fun little operation in the far northeast corner of the USSR has concluded as well with the successful capture of Magadan.

What was your approach to amphib landings? Every one of Soviet coastal bases (excluding Okha IIRC) has a pesky CD fort included, that can maul anything up to and including CAs. So all that mopping up is pretty painful

[DesertWolf101]

ORIGINAL: GetAssista

ORIGINAL: DesertWolf101
The fun little operation in the far northeast corner of the USSR has concluded as well with the successful capture of Magadan.

What was your approach to amphib landings? Every one of Soviet coastal bases (excluding Okha IIRC) has a pesky CD fort included, that can maul anything up to and including CAs. So all that mopping up is pretty painful

I landed troops at Anadyr (no coastal forts there) and from there I paradropped to take Markovo and Seymchan. I then airlifted two infantry regiments to Seymchan from where they marched down to take Magadan. It was an excellent plan bar the fact that I really screwed up when I unloaded too early in the middle of nowhere and triggered the war a full five days before I was planning.

[RangerJoe]

You are seeing the effects of this early start in Central Siberia and Outer Mongolia. Up to five days of your movements, uncontested by the Soviets, could have seen a lot more damage to the Soviet units, if not they were not cut off completely then to be destroyed.

[DesertWolf101]

November 11, 1942 - Battle of the Arabian Sea

Making maximum use of radio intelligence, I was able to trace significant Allied ship traffic originating all the way from the West Coast, through the Panama Canal, onwards through the Atlantic to South Africa and around the eastern side of Africa to the Arabian Sea. I positioned the Kido Butai accordingly and today I reaped the benefits. That's the good news, the bad news is the weather was atrocious - I was lucky some of the KB's aircraft took off at all and unfortunately there was no afternoon strike.

Here is the deal. I am wondering if it is worth keeping the KB around and maybe even surge destroyers forward to intercept. I would normally go for this, but look at the map below - Andy is hugging the edge of the map and I imagine he will probably be able to simply slip off map. Is that assumption correct?

[Alfred]

Your opponent has made a routing mistake.  The TF should have come on map from Mombasa with Karachi as destination and then, when on map, immediately changed destination and home port to Aden.  From Aden travel off map to Abadan,  Then from Abadan the short on map jump to Karachi under air cover.
 
Alfred

[RangerJoe]

ORIGINAL: Alfred

Your opponent has made a routing mistake.  The TF should have come on map from Mombasa with Karachi as destination and then, when on map, immediately changed destination and home port to Aden.  From Aden travel off map to Abadan,  Then from Abadan the short on map jump to Karachi under air cover.

Alfred

+1

Not to mention having apparently having no Naval Search or surface pickets to see any potential threats to this large and important convoy.

[DesertWolf101]

ORIGINAL: RangerJoe

ORIGINAL: Alfred

Your opponent has made a routing mistake.  The TF should have come on map from Mombasa with Karachi as destination and then, when on map, immediately changed destination and home port to Aden.  From Aden travel off map to Abadan,  Then from Abadan the short on map jump to Karachi under air cover.

Alfred

+1

Not to mention having apparently having no Naval Search or surface pickets to see any potential threats to this large and important convoy.

Before we judge too harshly, let me add some context to the story.

Too ease him into a sense of security, I had pulled out my submarines from the area and weakened my naval search for about ten days beforehand. His ASW forces had the run of the area and found no subs and were not intercepted. He also ran two test convoys beforehand which I detected with my recon flights over Karachi. He reinforced the CAP, has extensive naval search, and brought in naval bombers.

The reason he didn't pick up the KB was because it was hiding beyond the range of his nav search and darted in at flank speed for the intercept.

[DesertWolf101]

I finalized everything in the turn but still have to decide what to do in the Arabian Sea area.

Right before the KB darted in I sent forward a picket line of subs and they are now getting into position. I also have a decent number of G3M3 in position and hopefully enough naval escorts to guard the KB. The risk with sending the destroyers forward is that I am convinced he now has Soviet torpedo bombers in addition to whatever surface combatants could surge out.

I could insulate the destroyers better if the KB remained or even entered within range of his land based bombers but that is quite a risk, especially if he could just duck out off map!

[RangerJoe]

Well, that was a nice ambush for you. Not so much for the pixelated troops and seamen, however.

[DesertWolf101]

ORIGINAL: RangerJoe

Well, that was a nice ambush for you. Not so much for the pixelated troops and seamen, however.

Either Zeus really likes them and sent in his storms or Poseidon does NOT like them and did not want to have too many enter his kingdom. Either way, it was not as good a result as I had hoped.

[RangerJoe]

I see four of eleven sunk, many others appear to be in a sinking condition.

[Ambassador]

I finally managed to catch up, but I’ve had to jump over the middle part, I think I missed a major carrier battle, so I’ll have to find that part. Tahiti looks like a weird place to accept a carrier battle... Anyway, here are my thoughts...

With all due respect to Andy, I have to say I’m a bit surprised by certain errors he’s made, the last of which is indeed the routing of this convoy KB just hit. Even if lulling him in a false sense of security, given the reach of your invasion of India, he should never venture any ship from Mombasa/Cape Town to Karachi directly. The detour by Aden or Abadan, skirting the coast of Somalia, drastically limits the risks of interception. And escorting a CVE with a YMS ???

The extent of your victory in China, and the speed you achieved it, is also surprising. Congrats on that ! I found your opening moves, with KB striking Australia, to be quite gutsy. I do believe though that you overestimated the effect the losses will have on the Allied buildup.

As for the Soviet, I concur with the opinions that the heavy fighting hasn’t started yet. The heaviest usage of supply I saw was during the various sieges of strongholds, and during the protracted battles. A lot of supply is also lost to push it further north on roads. Taking Komsomolsk (and Nikolaev) is a good way to provide a supply hub, to push enough supply along the rail lines. The major flaw of your strategy, IMVHO and according to the experience I conducted, is that fielding a decent-sized force (and yours is really big) for a push towards Lake Baykal so far from the rail lines will make them suffer from lack of supply after one or two days of a big battle. As Andy seems to have retreated a lot of forces up there, you’re bound to have a big battle, and I found it easier to supply the Soviet in Ulan-Bator than the IJA.

You have seen what the Soviet artillery is capable of - but this was on the field. Beware the sieges, with heavy forts. Bringing the artillery in the open is risking its destruction - sure, there are replacements, but not enough to reconstitute more than one brigade per month.
However, he’s had nearly a year of replacements to accumulate, including over 4000 infantry squads. The losses the Soviet have taken until now are good VPs, but can’t put a heavy dent in the stockpiles. Additionally, remember that Soviet Rifle squads upgrade in ‘43 - with the 600 replacements/month, given how upgrading squads work, he’ll have most of his divisions upgraded by February at the latest. It might make a northern battle much more expensive, as those ‘43 squads have 50% more firepower than the IJA squads. And if he upgrades the Vladivostok defenders (will depend on his supply level I guess, but I would at least let the high XP units upgrade), this will hurt too.

For Sakhalin, from memory, a trickle of supply may travel overland, but you will have to take at least a week between each assault once besieging Okha, and to drop a lot in the souther ports.

In my game, MiG-3 trashed the Tojos. You might have the edge in pilot XP & skill, as well leadership. By now, he should have many more, enough for several squadrons, so maybe he’s been hoarding some to equip a squadron or two of elite pilots later.

[Alfred]

ORIGINAL: DesertWolf101

ORIGINAL: RangerJoe

ORIGINAL: Alfred

Your opponent has made a routing mistake.  The TF should have come on map from Mombasa with Karachi as destination and then, when on map, immediately changed destination and home port to Aden.  From Aden travel off map to Abadan,  Then from Abadan the short on map jump to Karachi under air cover.

Alfred

+1

Not to mention having apparently having no Naval Search or surface pickets to see any potential threats to this large and important convoy.

Before we judge too harshly, let me add some context to the story.

Too ease him into a sense of security, I had pulled out my submarines from the area and weakened my naval search for about ten days beforehand. His ASW forces had the run of the area and found no subs and were not intercepted. He also ran two test convoys beforehand which I detected with my recon flights over Karachi. He reinforced the CAP, has extensive naval search, and brought in naval bombers.

The reason he didn't pick up the KB was because it was hiding beyond the range of his nav search and darted in at flank speed for the intercept.

It isn't a case of judging too harshly. It was a straight out mistake.

Whether the Allies had picket ships out, or concentrated naval search on, or were lulled into error by your own actions, none of it is particularly relevant. A simple fact trumped all this; the whereabouts of the Japanese carriers was unknown. For years I have said that Japan can only attempt to impose an effective blockade of Karachi if it uses the KB. Knowing this and that the flank speed of the KB allows it to be out of Allied detection range (especially when Bombay et al are under Japanese occupation) means that the prudent play is to assume that the "hidden" KB is able to intercept any convoys destined for Karachi. Especially when it is an important convoy bringing in troop reinforcements.

Alfred

[Alfred]

ORIGINAL: Ambassador

I finally managed to catch up, but I’ve had to jump over the middle part, I think I missed a major carrier battle, so I’ll have to find that part. Tahiti looks like a weird place to accept a carrier battle... Anyway, here are my thoughts...

With all due respect to Andy, I have to say I’m a bit surprised by certain errors he’s made, the last of which is indeed the routing of this convoy KB just hit. Even if lulling him in a false sense of security, given the reach of your invasion of India, he should never venture any ship from Mombasa/Cape Town to Karachi directly. The detour by Aden or Abadan, skirting the coast of Somalia, drastically limits the risks of interception. And escorting a CVE with a YMS ???

The extent of your victory in China, and the speed you achieved it, is also surprising. Congrats on that ! I found your opening moves, with KB striking Australia, to be quite gutsy. I do believe though that you overestimated the effect the losses will have on the Allied buildup.

As for the Soviet, I concur with the opinions that the heavy fighting hasn’t started yet. The heaviest usage of supply I saw was during the various sieges of strongholds, and during the protracted battles. A lot of supply is also lost to push it further north on roads. Taking Komsomolsk (and Nikolaev) is a good way to provide a supply hub, to push enough supply along the rail lines. The major flaw of your strategy, IMVHO and according to the experience I conducted, is that fielding a decent-sized force (and yours is really big) for a push towards Lake Baykal so far from the rail lines will make them suffer from lack of supply after one or two days of a big battle. As Andy seems to have retreated a lot of forces up there, you’re bound to have a big battle, and I found it easier to supply the Soviet in Ulan-Bator than the IJA.

You have seen what the Soviet artillery is capable of - but this was on the field. Beware the sieges, with heavy forts. Bringing the artillery in the open is risking its destruction - sure, there are replacements, but not enough to reconstitute more than one brigade per month.
However, he’s had nearly a year of replacements to accumulate, including over 4000 infantry squads. The losses the Soviet have taken until now are good VPs, but can’t put a heavy dent in the stockpiles. Additionally, remember that Soviet Rifle squads upgrade in ‘43 - with the 600 replacements/month, given how upgrading squads work, he’ll have most of his divisions upgraded by February at the latest. It might make a northern battle much more expensive, as those ‘43 squads have 50% more firepower than the IJA squads. And if he upgrades the Vladivostok defenders (will depend on his supply level I guess, but I would at least let the high XP units upgrade), this will hurt too.

For Sakhalin, from memory, a trickle of supply may travel overland, but you will have to take at least a week between each assault once besieging Okha, and to drop a lot in the souther ports.

In my game, MiG-3 trashed the Tojos. You might have the edge in pilot XP & skill, as well leadership. By now, he should have many more, enough for several squadrons, so maybe he’s been hoarding some to equip a squadron or two of elite pilots later.

You need to remember that Andy Mac has only recently taken over this game. He was handed a dead Allied side, one where there is nothing Andy Mac can do to prevent a Japanese auto victory on 1 January 1943, and probably the same on 1 January 1944. The Allied position inherited by Andy Mac is far deader than the famous Norwegian dead parrot. It doesn't even have the plumage of that dead parrot.

Alfred

[DesertWolf101]

ORIGINAL: Ambassador

I finally managed to catch up, but I’ve had to jump over the middle part, I think I missed a major carrier battle, so I’ll have to find that part. Tahiti looks like a weird place to accept a carrier battle... Anyway, here are my thoughts...

With all due respect to Andy, I have to say I’m a bit surprised by certain errors he’s made, the last of which is indeed the routing of this convoy KB just hit. Even if lulling him in a false sense of security, given the reach of your invasion of India, he should never venture any ship from Mombasa/Cape Town to Karachi directly. The detour by Aden or Abadan, skirting the coast of Somalia, drastically limits the risks of interception. And escorting a CVE with a YMS ???

The extent of your victory in China, and the speed you achieved it, is also surprising. Congrats on that ! I found your opening moves, with KB striking Australia, to be quite gutsy. I do believe though that you overestimated the effect the losses will have on the Allied buildup.

As for the Soviet, I concur with the opinions that the heavy fighting hasn’t started yet. The heaviest usage of supply I saw was during the various sieges of strongholds, and during the protracted battles. A lot of supply is also lost to push it further north on roads. Taking Komsomolsk (and Nikolaev) is a good way to provide a supply hub, to push enough supply along the rail lines. The major flaw of your strategy, IMVHO and according to the experience I conducted, is that fielding a decent-sized force (and yours is really big) for a push towards Lake Baykal so far from the rail lines will make them suffer from lack of supply after one or two days of a big battle. As Andy seems to have retreated a lot of forces up there, you’re bound to have a big battle, and I found it easier to supply the Soviet in Ulan-Bator than the IJA.

You have seen what the Soviet artillery is capable of - but this was on the field. Beware the sieges, with heavy forts. Bringing the artillery in the open is risking its destruction - sure, there are replacements, but not enough to reconstitute more than one brigade per month.
However, he’s had nearly a year of replacements to accumulate, including over 4000 infantry squads. The losses the Soviet have taken until now are good VPs, but can’t put a heavy dent in the stockpiles. Additionally, remember that Soviet Rifle squads upgrade in ‘43 - with the 600 replacements/month, given how upgrading squads work, he’ll have most of his divisions upgraded by February at the latest. It might make a northern battle much more expensive, as those ‘43 squads have 50% more firepower than the IJA squads. And if he upgrades the Vladivostok defenders (will depend on his supply level I guess, but I would at least let the high XP units upgrade), this will hurt too.

For Sakhalin, from memory, a trickle of supply may travel overland, but you will have to take at least a week between each assault once besieging Okha, and to drop a lot in the souther ports.

In my game, MiG-3 trashed the Tojos. You might have the edge in pilot XP & skill, as well leadership. By now, he should have many more, enough for several squadrons, so maybe he’s been hoarding some to equip a squadron or two of elite pilots later.

Thanks for the feedback!

Noted on the supply flow in the USSR. In fact that is something that I have been grappling with as a problem from the start of the campaign, and like you mentioned, is especially an issue in the Ulan Bator sector. Nevertheless, the problem is not big enough in my view for me to abandon my offensive efforts in the Lake Baikal area, at least for now. You also make some really good points on what is likely to come when the siege efforts actually start as well as the threat of the Soviet 43 squads, etc.

Do squads/devices actually consume supply when they upgrade? That would be a very useful thing to conclusively find out. Undoubtedly a question that Alfred knows the answer to if he could chime in!

[DesertWolf101]

ORIGINAL: Alfred

ORIGINAL: DesertWolf101

ORIGINAL: RangerJoe




+1

Not to mention having apparently having no Naval Search or surface pickets to see any potential threats to this large and important convoy.

Before we judge too harshly, let me add some context to the story.

Too ease him into a sense of security, I had pulled out my submarines from the area and weakened my naval search for about ten days beforehand. His ASW forces had the run of the area and found no subs and were not intercepted. He also ran two test convoys beforehand which I detected with my recon flights over Karachi. He reinforced the CAP, has extensive naval search, and brought in naval bombers.

The reason he didn't pick up the KB was because it was hiding beyond the range of his nav search and darted in at flank speed for the intercept.

It isn't a case of judging too harshly. It was a straight out mistake.

Whether the Allies had picket ships out, or concentrated naval search on, or were lulled into error by your own actions, none of it is particularly relevant. A simple fact trumped all this; the whereabouts of the Japanese carriers was unknown. For years I have said that Japan can only attempt to impose an effective blockade of Karachi if it uses the KB. Knowing this and that the flank speed of the KB allows it to be out of Allied detection range (especially when Bombay et al are under Japanese occupation) means that the prudent play is to assume that the "hidden" KB is able to intercept any convoys destined for Karachi. Especially when it is an important convoy bringing in troop reinforcements.

Alfred

Fair enough, I can't argue with that!

[Alfred]

ORIGINAL: DesertWolf101


...Do squads/devices actually consume supply when they upgrade? That would be a very useful thing to conclusively find out. Undoubtedly a question that Alfred knows the answer to if he could chime in!

Yes.

There should be older posts of mine that expand on the details.

Alfred