WITP: Logistician's Edition - Linus (J) vs Xenxen (A)

[ITAKLinus]

ORIGINAL: RangerJoe

Canoerebel

Erik likes to use the KI-83 to sweep, the preferred role that you gents alerted me to when it first showed up. This sweep gets the best of my guys and opens the shipping to enemy strikes.

fb.asp?m=4529779

Thanks! [&o][&o][&o][&o][&o]

[ITAKLinus]

ORIGINAL: Lowpe

Lots to respond here... and you have acknowledged a lot of what I will say. First and foremost is that the game is scenario 1 and no plan survives first contact with the enemy. Stay flexible.[:)] With stacking limits taking out China should be very easy.

India is too much, most likely. Certainly, you won't be making any progress there mid 43 or later unless you cordon off Karachi by taking Socotra in very early 42 or even 41. Allied superiority in TOE is just too great. Landing there very early though is key...but will Allies cooperate? That doesn't mean don't go for it...if yo can grab supplies and fuel there and perhaps put the nail in China all the sooner to boot.

You can't deplete the Commonwealth or Australian forces enough. Most are restricted, and if you go fight them where they are restricted you are simply giving the Allies political point freedom to spend elsewhere. The enemy is always the USN, Marines and US Army....they are almost always only three invasions away from bombing Honshu.

The decisive battle in the Pacific theory is flawed in this game. You can crush all five starting Yankee Carriers and still lose....and you can win without a decisive CV clash in 1943. Allied production is simply insane...

The Allies will most likely be in position to bomb Honshu in very early 1944 and maybe sooner. Constant meat grinder warfare in India will drain you of supplies, and fuel...unless you take and hold the industrial bastions well past Calcutta.

Sending troops to India is not a complex situation for the Allies. You will have to figure out how to pocket and destroy those troops...which is by far more difficult than destroying them on a one island hex with no retreat.

I have never expanded armaments, and I never turn them off. Generally, I convert one of them to vehicles though. Naval shipyard expansion is very interesting to me...but you need to account for it somehow. Always increase vehicles asap.

In 1943 plan on losing 3K to 3.5K Franks and or Georges countering the P47. If you are fighting with A6M5 something, Tojo and Oscar plan on losing twice that at least or ceding all air operations within Jugs ranges. Mr. Kane got the Ki94 in late 1944, and was a bit disappointed in its performance....but you do need a late war fighter.

You will have a tough time countering the P38 in 1942.

You will have a narrow window, in 1944 sometime, where the Sam might make a CV clash very winnable.

Of course the greatest variable is understanding the Allies and watching how they evolve....the great unknown. Also, every game the initiative at some point swings...usually in 1943. With 4 George, and 7 Frank, I fear you might not have the fighters early enough to keep the initiative...

Good luck, you have a plan and a purpose!

PS: I have played a game where Japan was starved for resources...and I shipped heavily from Nauru.

PPS: Depending upon HR, you definitely need to address the night fighters. Only 21 Sentai can go NF, and some of the best get withdrawn.

PPS: Well done on sinking a CV![:)]

Thanks for the message and for the relevant insights.


Yeah, flexibility is a must. I have a general grand strategy and that's it, nothing more, nothing less.

From my perspective, India can be entirely conquered. My biggest asset in this game is the fact that I already conquered the entire place in a Scen01 and I do believe that experience with the theater plays a huge role in defending/attacking it.
Admittedly, I've been lucky in that PBEM, but sometimes luck is all you need to accomplish something great.

Depleting Commonwealth/Australian forces is relatively impossible if they do flee. If they make a stand, it's highly probable that they are depleted.

The PBEM in which I got India ended in April '44. Then I restarted it from 01/01/1944 but playing the allied side with a new opponent substituting me as the Emperor. Commonwealth pools are just... Done for good. Basically impossible to put together a meaningful force.
Now, I don't say that's easy to accomplish or that I will for sure do such a damage in this game, but my general aim is to deplete them as much as I can.


I have somewhat badly explained my "decisive battle theory". My logic is this: I cannot really force the US to fight anywhere if they don't want to. Still, they will push at certain point. And here the "decisive battle theory" kicks in: I want to do a relatively short-lived campaign in which I throw everything at the enemy, hoping to damage him enough to slow down the inevitable. That's mostly why I want to smash India and China: more assets to be thrown in the key campaign.

Clearly, this theory is flawed in case the opponent is smart enough to ditch any project of deep invasion and decides for grinding his way to Onshu. In the aforementioned match, I simply started grinding from the Salomons, playing in 1944 a 1942 campaign. High tempo is the key and so far I have been quite successful (we're now in late April 1944).




My calculations can be wrong but I have counted a minimum of 8 weeks for the first US reinforcements in India. More likely 10-12 weeks if we take into account a realistic situation.
Pocketing them is a complex task, but can be done. It depends on how the opponent plays and reacts. Also, it strongly depends on how seriously he does take my initial move on India.



Regarding the initiative: you're right, but what can I do? Clearly, adding more George/Frank factories into the equation is a good solution. My understanding is that I will leave the initiative in the Pacific from January '42 and keep it in India/China.
Bottom line is this: if I can prevent a move into DEI from Perth axis of advance, I am relatively safe in the Pacific until I keep the KB there in a central position and I have some strategic reserves available.
My industrial planning is tailored to carrier superiority. Without going too much into detail, I have planned to have the trio Judy/A6M5/Jill for when Hellcats arrive and to mantain a carrier numerical superiority (CV+CVL vs CV+CVL, so no CVE taken into account) well into '44. CVEs are one of the most relevant assets the allies have, but I am quite prone to think they don't play such a big role in '43. 1944 is another beast, but I can't do much about that. My big investment on the Sam is basically an attempt to compensate a little bit the massive CVE presence in early '44.
Again, there isn't much I can do. Hell, I've even decided to produce the cr@ppy Shinano.


PS. Thanks for the info about Nauru.

PPS. Yeah, I read "NF" as "Nightmare Fighter". Is there any general consensus on which NF should researched and produced? I think I've always messed up with them.

PPPS. Thanks again! Luck has been on my side [8D][8D]




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So far we're still in the early game. I'll post a summary after the next turn, when Singapore should fall (unless 77AV can resist over 1.800AV...). I've just played the 19th Dec turn.
I won't post many combat reports, since I think they somehow hamper the reading. Also, and especially, I prefer just writing what happens around the map.

With the fall of Singapore and the pocketing of the whole commonwealth army in Malaya, it looks like I will be able to keep my original schedule of a mid-January landing in India.

In the PBEM in which I conquered it, I have messed up immensely many things (it was my second PBEM): I hope to have learned the lessons.

The plan itself is fairly simple.
A very generalistic and broad description: landing in Diamond Harbor with 4 divisions which will seal Calcutta. I cannot really prevent the enemy from redeploying in the city, but I can hope to encircle it.
I'll keep a blocking force in Calcutta itself, while the rest of the army moves toward Jessore and Asansol. Jamshedpur-Howrath area is crucial to the allied player if he wants to keep a LOC with Calcutta. If he does so, the better. I'll try to fragment and destroy his forces there and cut the LOC.
I do not plan an attack on Calcutta. Probably, I won't have the forces to do so. If instead I can grab it somehow, I'll change my plans and go for it directly.
Many tanks will be present in the first wave. They have a very simple task: running everywhere far behind the enemy lines. The idea is to cut railways, spread the panic and gain railway terminals far away from the Calcutta area.
Patna, Darjeeling, Ranchi, Benares and eventually even Raipur are the initial targets.

After the initial wave, a second wave of 4 divisions is scheduled to arrive a little bit later (anything between 3 and 4 days later). These divisions will seal the fate of the Jamshedpur-Howrath line and the troops there.
Cocanda and Vizagapatnam will be invested as well by a small force. Its aim is to reach Bezwada. Bezwada is a key base since it gives a very good position to threaten both Madras and Hyderabad. Also, it potentially opens the road toward Bellary and Goa, sealing India's tip (not that it would matter much).
Logic behind this move is to dilute enemy's defences a little bit in case he decides to defend Madras and Hyderabad or to oblige him to leave me one of the two. From Calcutta area, troops can be sent via railway without major delays. There is the horrible Cuttack, which needs to be taken and is not on the sea, but I am confident that a mix of extremely heavy air bombardments and paras can do the trick. Hope so.


The third wave is scheduled to arrive much later, roughly in mid-februrary. There are various reasons for this. A) lack of sealift (I can have it, but I don't want to reduce the allocation of ships to other operations such as Java); B) I cannot tell yet what's going to be the allied answer to my move.
Basically, I want to keep the 3rd wave as an exploitation force. F.ex., grabbing Madras with the forces landed at Cocanda and friend, is impossible. But if the enemy decides not to defend it, I can grab it bringing 4 divisions in the area.
Most likely, I will land the forces in either Cocanda&co area or in Diamond Habor.
There is also the not-so-dumb-as-it-looks-like option: a landing on Surat, but I'd really have to organise it properly in terms of ships and, especially, cover force.


Keeping the naval traffic in the Bengala Gulf at the bare minimum is the key. I don't want to have a stream of ships going back and forth in the area, so most of the support units will be landed together with the 1st or 2nd waves.
I'll have to be careful with tanks, since in the "Indian PBEM" I had a production of 300 and they still weren't enough. On the flip side, allied pools are very thin.

I still have to decide about the naval cover force. I think the first wave will be with a very little air cover force and I'll employ the KB for the second. Seems mad, but surprise is on my side. I expect a reaction to the second wave, especially if the allied player sees that my air cover is not that great. That's when I'll employ KB, which will initially open the dances with a strike on Celyon. I have to grab Oosthaven in order to make it pass trhough the strait, though. Once I've sailed past Oosthaven to the WEST, I hope to get off the radars, refuel and strike Colombo.
I don't imagine I'll find anything meaningful in the place, but hopefully it will bring into the area the few air assets the brits have. In any case, it will clarify the enemy that Colombo is and should remain offlimit for ships.


Final considerations are devoted to a couple of operations I'll do in the meanwhile: Java and Darwin. Darwin will be plastered by BBs and that's it. Java will happen roughly at the same time as the assault on India. Not too many troops are available, but my reasoning is that I mostly want to establish a solid foothold on the island and conquer it as soon as reinforcements are available. Landing is the complex task, rather than bringing reinforcements. I just conquered Makassar, so I have a decent AF from which start to put some pressure on the place. The guys who will go in Sumatra will take care of the northern part.
The Pacific (including Wake and PM) is already in my hands and I do not plan to expand further. I'll take Horn Island at certain point, but I really cannot tell when I'll have the forces to do so; in line of principle I have troops available now, but my air presence is weak: Kaga + 2xCVL + 1xCS. A big TF with CAs, BBs and DDs has been attacked by a sub EAST of Fiji, so I suspect the opponent is bringing his naval assets from PH to SoPac in order to put pressure on my deployment.
KB is in sight in front of Makassar, so there is a window opportunity for him to strike (provided he has bought the 2 remaining CVs). I have around 100Eng in Rabaul and I hope to have it AF lvl4 soon. AirHQ and fancy Betty/Nell will arrive. Toghether with my little naval force, they should be more than enough to counter the threat of the 2 US carriers.

[Bif1961]

Good luck with your contest, it sounds like you have great respect for your opponent and that is the way it should be. The Sara was a torpedo magnet but not 3 at once, so you are off to a good start vis-a-vis early war carrier strength.

[PaxMondo]

Francesco, Salve!

So, you have a plan. Any plan is better than no plan, so you have a great first step.

As Lowpe suggests, be prepared to augment/adjust the plan as your contact with your opponent moves along.

I am also a strong advocate of fighter RnD; given the lack of LCU firepower compared to the allies that increases as the war progresses, once the allies are able to wrest control of the air, they will own the initiative. Delaying that control can be a key part of an IJ victory and that is only done with fighters. This is not to suggest that you don't build other aircraft, but that your RnD focus should be on fighters, key fighters that can dominate for a decent length of time. Finally, you need to decide if you will go for final fighter, and if so which one(s) (Ki-94, Ki-83, J7W are the choices)

[mind_messing]

Going to cherry pick a few quotes to comment on from recent discussions:

Biak-Manado-Mindanao are relevant. Together with Palau/Babeldaob and Peleliu. I generally create a forward strong base in Nabire, which has a very healthy georgaphical position, being able to strike in Arafura Sea from its AF lvl6. Key element here is that it's safe from naval bombardment and relatively easy to resupply.
I also like Lolobato, which makes for a safe AF if you minimally develop/protect Galeia and Morotai.
Saumlaki and Selaroe are relevant bases as well.

I'm mostly concerned with an attack throguh the Arafura Sea axis, because it would create a huge salient in my positions: I would have to defend too many places since he could do whatever from there (Mindanao/Timor/Celebes/etcetc).

An alternative proposition is to strongly develop Buna and Hansa Bay to level 9. With some supporting airbases, they can interdict the Torres Strait.

Yeah, the Oscar is great because of the MVR. Still, my point on speed stands: as far as I know, the higher the delta in speed and the more the MVR decreases. I am too lazy to look for Alfred's or developers' posts about that, but I think you are almost certain of a -50% if there is a delta higher than 80mph (here memory can make bad jokes, but I recall these numbers).

Not quite - fb.asp?m=4036178 (post 16)

I see the advantages of the Patsy. My question is: how can I do R&D on it in any meaningful manner? I have a limited amount of industries. The only thing that crosses my mind is to redirect some industries after they have done their R&D, but that's quite a big supply investment. Do you think it's worth? I've never had the occasion to have it, sadly.

You would need to plan from the start IMO to make the most use out of it.

I've never had the chance to use it in a grand campaign either, but I do see its potential in a number of areas thanks to its long range.

For me, the selling point is that massive 36 hex range. That's a lot of ports and airbases (inc. B-29 bases!) that you can hit from the (comparative) safety of the Japanese home islands. I also think they have an interesting application as kamikazes - the range would let them be staged far behind the frontline to supplement shorter range kamikaze aircraft.

Frances. I think there is a typo: the first one has a SR of 4 and the second of 2. I found the SR=4 not that terrible in the end. But I wasn't using it for anything other than strikes from large AF where I could ship out eventually damaged planes. The additional speed and range seemed to amply compensate the atrocious SR.

I think for regular operations, SR4 is too high and the speed/range difference is fairly mild to make it worthwhile. I am comfortable with fairly high SR for defensive planes, but less so for offensive planes (and the Frances is absolutely one of those.

A more minor consideration is that the P1Y2 gets radar, which is attractive for night-time anti-shipping operations.

Depleting Commonwealth/Australian forces is relatively impossible if they do flee. If they make a stand, it's highly probable that they are depleted.

Diligent Allied play can mitigate large losses through careful control of devices. In a pinch, units in Australia and New Zealand can be disbanded to provide tanks and artillery for Indian units.

A very generalistic and broad description: landing in Diamond Harbor with 4 divisions which will seal Calcutta. I cannot really prevent the enemy from redeploying in the city, but I can hope to encircle it.

I think going for Calcutta initially is a mistake - your second wave operation is a much more appealing prospect.

A landing at Cocanda and Vizagapatnam, with a rapid paradrop at Bezwada will give you a position to advance in virtually any direction in India and force the Allies onto the back foot. Calcutta and Madras can be cleared out later (and may even be abandoned if the Allied player loses his nerve at a large IJA force pushing towards Karachi from Central India.

Final considerations are devoted to a couple of operations I'll do in the meanwhile: Java and Darwin. Darwin will be plastered by BBs and that's it.

It's fine to leave Darwin, but I would absolutely detach a small force to capture the rest of the Northern Australian coastal bases - they're nifty floatplane bases and worth denying to the Allies if possible.

[ITAKLinus]

ORIGINAL: Bif1961

Good luck with your contest, it sounds like you have great respect for your opponent and that is the way it should be. The Sara was a torpedo magnet but not 3 at once, so you are off to a good start vis-a-vis early war carrier strength.

Thanks! [:)]

[ITAKLinus]

ORIGINAL: PaxMondo

Francesco, Salve!

So, you have a plan. Any plan is better than no plan, so you have a great first step.

As Lowpe suggests, be prepared to augment/adjust the plan as your contact with your opponent moves along.

I am also a strong advocate of fighter RnD; given the lack of LCU firepower compared to the allies that increases as the war progresses, once the allies are able to wrest control of the air, they will own the initiative. Delaying that control can be a key part of an IJ victory and that is only done with fighters. This is not to suggest that you don't build other aircraft, but that your RnD focus should be on fighters, key fighters that can dominate for a decent length of time. Finally, you need to decide if you will go for final fighter, and if so which one(s) (Ki-94, Ki-83, J7W are the choices)

Yeah, I'm a strong proponend of a fighter-focused R&D. Since the marginal gain for additional factories sharply declines, I have very few heavy investments (A7M2 and Ki94II). Could (and probably should) have invested more on the George and Frank, but I think I can deal with their relatively late arrival.

[ITAKLinus]

Answers in red:

ORIGINAL: mind_messing

Going to cherry pick a few quotes to comment on from recent discussions:

Biak-Manado-Mindanao are relevant. Together with Palau/Babeldaob and Peleliu. I generally create a forward strong base in Nabire, which has a very healthy georgaphical position, being able to strike in Arafura Sea from its AF lvl6. Key element here is that it's safe from naval bombardment and relatively easy to resupply.
I also like Lolobato, which makes for a safe AF if you minimally develop/protect Galeia and Morotai.
Saumlaki and Selaroe are relevant bases as well.

I'm mostly concerned with an attack throguh the Arafura Sea axis, because it would create a huge salient in my positions: I would have to defend too many places since he could do whatever from there (Mindanao/Timor/Celebes/etcetc).

An alternative proposition is to strongly develop Buna and Hansa Bay to level 9. With some supporting airbases, they can interdict the Torres Strait.


My plan is to place the 3rd AirDivHQ in Nadzab, which should cover indeed both Buna and Hansa Bay. Nadzab itself is well suited to be a good AF if I can keep the Vitiaz Strait mine long enoguh to supply it through Saidor. The fact that it's inland is a major plus from my perspective.

Yeah, the Oscar is great because of the MVR. Still, my point on speed stands: as far as I know, the higher the delta in speed and the more the MVR decreases. I am too lazy to look for Alfred's or developers' posts about that, but I think you are almost certain of a -50% if there is a delta higher than 80mph (here memory can make bad jokes, but I recall these numbers).

Not quite - fb.asp?m=4036178 (post 16)

I see the advantages of the Patsy. My question is: how can I do R&D on it in any meaningful manner? I have a limited amount of industries. The only thing that crosses my mind is to redirect some industries after they have done their R&D, but that's quite a big supply investment. Do you think it's worth? I've never had the occasion to have it, sadly.

You would need to plan from the start IMO to make the most use out of it.

I've never had the chance to use it in a grand campaign either, but I do see its potential in a number of areas thanks to its long range.

For me, the selling point is that massive 36 hex range. That's a lot of ports and airbases (inc. B-29 bases!) that you can hit from the (comparative) safety of the Japanese home islands. I also think they have an interesting application as kamikazes - the range would let them be staged far behind the frontline to supplement shorter range kamikaze aircraft.

Ouch, you're completely right about the mph delta! And think that I quoted that precise post no longer than 3 weeks ago for another AAR... I guess I'm getting old [:D]

I see the advantages of the Patsy, but I still don't buy it. Great plane, yeah, but at what cost? And to do what? Any reasonable allied player would have his B29 major AFs covered with both FlaK and old/training/R&R fighters.
The 2x100Kg payload means basically nothing. The 2x250Kg at 29hex is just the same as the Nell with 3 more hexes. Even on otrageously overstacked AFs with little FlaK and no air cover, I've always done very little damage with Lilies (which do carry the same payload in extended) if not massed. And then, producing great quantities of Patsies, plus equipping many squadrons, is not really something I would be confortable with.
Don't get me wrong, I do agree with your analysis, but I'm simply not convinced in heavily investing over the Patsy in terms of R&D. I think the Nells will do basically the same, just much worse but with a better overal industrial price.
Also, there is another cost-opportunity related to it: I do welcome more Peggy(T)s and Lilies DB, rather than producing less of them in exchange of the Patsy.

Frances. I think there is a typo: the first one has a SR of 4 and the second of 2. I found the SR=4 not that terrible in the end. But I wasn't using it for anything other than strikes from large AF where I could ship out eventually damaged planes. The additional speed and range seemed to amply compensate the atrocious SR.

I think for regular operations, SR4 is too high and the speed/range difference is fairly mild to make it worthwhile. I am comfortable with fairly high SR for defensive planes, but less so for offensive planes (and the Frances is absolutely one of those.

A more minor consideration is that the P1Y2 gets radar, which is attractive for night-time anti-shipping operations.

Roger.
On a side note: have you ever had any meaningful success in night anti-shipping operations? As Japanese, I've never had any, sadly.

Depleting Commonwealth/Australian forces is relatively impossible if they do flee. If they make a stand, it's highly probable that they are depleted.

Diligent Allied play can mitigate large losses through careful control of devices. In a pinch, units in Australia and New Zealand can be disbanded to provide tanks and artillery for Indian units.

A very generalistic and broad description: landing in Diamond Harbor with 4 divisions which will seal Calcutta. I cannot really prevent the enemy from redeploying in the city, but I can hope to encircle it.

I think going for Calcutta initially is a mistake - your second wave operation is a much more appealing prospect.

A landing at Cocanda and Vizagapatnam, with a rapid paradrop at Bezwada will give you a position to advance in virtually any direction in India and force the Allies onto the back foot. Calcutta and Madras can be cleared out later (and may even be abandoned if the Allied player loses his nerve at a large IJA force pushing towards Karachi from Central India.


I see your point, but I don't think the allied player can lose his nerves so much. I think he could, should I run for Bombay, but not for Karachi. He knows he gets a good amount of decent ground reinforcements and especially SpitVIIIs. He would welcome a move toward Karachi. So, it's a threat with an unloaded gun from my perspective.

Now, I do not plan to get Calcutta. I plan to encircle and bypass it. The two landings are basically equivalent. There is a big plus in Diamond Harbor for the very reason that it solicits an answer from the Allied player, who can somehow decide to commit his forces in the defence of Calcutta. I would welcome that. I suspect that a landing in Cocanda as first assault would instead make him withdraw and reorganise rather than sending everyone to the frontline. The timing of the second landing might very well be changed precisely for this reason (and it will depend on how he does respond): if he embarks troops on trains and rushes them to the frontline, I want them to arrive in Calcutta area and unload from trains. It might take more than a week.
Basically, I agree with you that the Cocanda et al. landing is the main one, but I see the first landing as a feint, with the added benefit of trapping the Burmese defenders.

Final considerations are devoted to a couple of operations I'll do in the meanwhile: Java and Darwin. Darwin will be plastered by BBs and that's it.

It's fine to leave Darwin, but I would absolutely detach a small force to capture the rest of the Northern Australian coastal bases - they're nifty floatplane bases and worth denying to the Allies if possible.

Absolutely right. I will check ASAP what can I send there. Not much, but I'll find some "volunteer".

[mind_messing]

Ouch, you're completely right about the mph delta! And think that I quoted that precise post no longer than 3 weeks ago for another AAR... I guess I'm getting old

I see the advantages of the Patsy, but I still don't buy it. Great plane, yeah, but at what cost? And to do what? Any reasonable allied player would have his B29 major AFs covered with both FlaK and old/training/R&R fighters.
The 2x100Kg payload means basically nothing. The 2x250Kg at 29hex is just the same as the Nell with 3 more hexes. Even on otrageously overstacked AFs with little FlaK and no air cover, I've always done very little damage with Lilies (which do carry the same payload in extended) if not massed. And then, producing great quantities of Patsies, plus equipping many squadrons, is not really something I would be confortable with.
Don't get me wrong, I do agree with your analysis, but I'm simply not convinced in heavily investing over the Patsy in terms of R&D. I think the Nells will do basically the same, just much worse but with a better overal industrial price.
Also, there is another cost-opportunity related to it: I do welcome more Peggy(T)s and Lilies DB, rather than producing less of them in exchange of the Patsy.

Any Allied airframes performing rear-area CAP are airframes not performing frontline CAP. The Patsy is a lever to keep the Allied player on his toes (and harvest easy VP's for you if not). The other aspect is encouraging "click fatigue" that sets in with any game of AE that reaches the late-war. Ideally, you want to maximise the effort the Allied player has to put into "routine" operations to increase the chance of unforced errors elsewhere.

It's not just airbase attacks either, but port bombing and anti-shipping too. A bunch of ships disbanded in port, or a xAK convoy too close to the front won't be concerned if the holes in their ships are 100kg or 250kg.

It has similarities with the Nell, but it's IJA - a larger number of squadrons to convert, and adds a lot of capability to the masses of IJA bomber pilots that you will have in the reserve when the airframe arrives.

The problem with using Nells instead is that your IJN pilot pool is too pressured to train enough pilots with sufficient skills. The GrnB/NavB/NavT skillset is under a lot of pressure from IJN carrier squadrons, IJN land-based single-engine squadrons and IJN land-based twin-engine squadrons. The Nell is also outrageously slow. The Patsy being an IJA airframe gives you more flexibility, and it's easier to train GrdB/NavB (LowNav may be better to double as kamis though...) in bulk.

It's an airframe which, if you can get it en masse, can really cause the Allies headaches.

Roger.
On a side note: have you ever had any meaningful success in night anti-shipping operations? As Japanese, I've never had any, sadly.

Nope, but the primary purpose of night raids is to waste the AA ammo of Allied task forces. An Allied task force without any ammo for the 5 inch guns (or better yet the 40's) has notably less bite. Also feeds in to my point above about click fatigue.

[ITAKLinus]

A brief update about the general situation.

I've played this morning turn 23/12/1941.

22 - DECEMBER - 1941

CHINA THEATER

Here everything goes more or lees smoothly. I defended Ichang, which has not been invested (due to heavy bombing runs over his troops since day-1?).
I lost Sinyang due to a dumb setting, but it's not a problem getting it back.

My move is quite obviously an encirclement of the Loyang area and a subsequent push toward Sian if anyhow possible.

The theater itself is quite stagnating currently. I've been very busing shuffling garrisons around.


DEI

I've landed on Mersing on 7th Dec and I I conquered Singapore on the 20th Dec. I've lost very few man in terms of disablements and destroyed squads. Currently, there are over 2.000AV in Singer itself and more incoming.

They will rest few turns and then move against India. The Allied LCUs north of Singers are 350AV trapped Malaya Army guys. They'll all die there soon.

Palembang has a good amount of LCUs as far as I can tell. He has been diligent in airlifting the units in Singapore.
I am keeping the AF damaged but I cannot really close it, due to the lack of suitable AFs. Currently, I have Singers (AirSupp arrives tomorrow and almost fully repaired) lvl6 + Johore Baru (almost fully repaired and operational) lvl4 and Mersing, which I developed from 0 to 4 in few days. Kuantan is gonna be attacked tomorrow and should provide another lvl4 AF in range of Palembang.

Very limited naval traffic in the area. He has fled with everything long ago, only few short-legged auxiliaries remain.

KB is not visible in the image, but you can guess where she is: the red icon at the bottom corner S-E of Kendari. I have covered a big SCTF doing a fast transport to Makassar, where the Xenxen has decided to send a good amount of reinforcements. They died in the thousands and I got the base at the first shock attack. Fighter sweeps from there have cleaned the few dutch planes still around in CAP.
Kendari herself and other bases where hosting all the Dutch bomber force and I plastered them with KB and CA bombardment. Also a couple of BBs did their duty (I have my only AKE in Babeldaob).
Now I have the invasion forces for Kendari and Ambon arriving in a couple of days and I am confident they'll fall soon.

The CA Maya got a torpedo from a dutch sub but she should make it without any issue a part from the very low speed (18knts). On 8th Dec I met some allied surface forces and I think I sunk the Boise. For sure the CA Houston went down like a stone.
I lost a DD in return. And the CL Oi, hit by a single bomb which made it explode in 1.000.000 pieces.

My initial idea of landing in southern Java and then trapping Soerabaja has failed miserably. Xen has concentrated everything on the northern tip ages ago.


I do plan to secure Palembang very soon. My aim is to land in Diamond Harbour on 15th January, so I want to load my troops on the 5th of January. The trip itself should be much shorter but: A) I have to load the troops; B) I will do a refuel somewhere; C) I will embark a big amount of support units, which won't be able to provide air support.

My idea is to start bombing Palembang with dozens of 2Es from Singapore&co. I wonder, though, whether it's safer to land in Oosthafen and encircle Palembang occupying Djambi, the three hexes between it and PPraboemoloeh and the 3 hexes between this one and Oosthafen. Without any supply path, the defenders should just surrender.
I'd land inside Palembang at that point.
I have the troops (and fragments of them) to spare and time (2 weeks), so it's not an issue.



Last but not least from the area, I screwed up the landings in Christmas Island IO and Cocos Island. I decided not to go and instead send reinforcements to Makassar, where our Dutch friends where transporting mnay troops (god knows why).

[ITAKLinus]

PACIFIC OCEAN

Nothing much to say.

As we all know, Saratoga went down.

Now there are for sure many US ships in Suva area, just arrived from PH. I do not intend to expand much more, so it's not an issue.

CL Australia got sunk on turn 2 near PM. Since then, few B17s and some bombardment TF is visiting the place every few days. I have an AirCombatTF ready to intercept them the next time they try the trick. Have to be careful about the 2 surviving US CVs, though: I'm quite light in the area.

[ITAKLinus]

Final note.

In the air we're 430-175 in my favour. Not a wonderful ratio to be fair, but I have lost mainly due to ops and FlaK.




After this initial update, I'll try to keep the reports together in a single post.

[RangerJoe]

Multiple posts are fine with me if they each deal with a specific subject or area.

Very nice so far.

[ITAKLinus]

23-24 DECEMBER 1941

DEI

On the 23rd I launch a heavy AF bombing on Palembang, which leaves the AF closed and several planes destroyed on the ground.
The following day I start bombing troops over there. A good share of my bombers target two AT units airlifted from Singapore, which suffer some casualties. Various other troops, including the Palembang Base Force, are targeted and suffer damage.

A sweep of few A6M2s on Batavia is met with heavy resistance. 2 out of the 40 enemy fighters are shot down but I lose a Zero.

Barges land troops in the little island S-E of Singapore. Tomorrow it will be taken.
Landings also in Kuantan (which, I discover, has still an enemy LCU) and in Kendari. Kendari will fall tomorrow.

Ambon is conquered today with 17:1 odds. Tomorrow, hopefully, I'll land some air support for its AF.


I suspected Xen had no planes in NavB and so I sent forward a large TF composed of CAs and DDs. The idea was to come close to Batavia and bomb it on the 25th, so to give a Christmas present to the defenders.
A DMS rushes forward and reaches Oosthafen. No mines encountered. Various allied TFs are around but none is intercepted.


On the 24th I also start loading the troops for Palembang. I decided to skip any plan to encircle it and I'll land directly in the base. My hope is to be able to bring the KB there to make some strike on the defenders. I have a couple of hundreds 2Es hitting the place from southern Malaya, though.
I'll land the 5th Division and many ARM and ENG units. Few ART are present as well. The 5th Division is the one which led the assault on Singapore and is a veteran unit reasonably well-led. Given the few casualties incurred in Singers, it's already at 100% TOE.


Few other landings will happen in the next couple of days. I loaded a TF which will land in Oosthafen and one in Sabang. Just one SNLF for each should be more than enough. I decided to use Fast Transport TFs with warships to do these landings, due to the absent air cover and the need of speed.

Tomorrow, I'll also bomb Palembang from the sea. Risky, but I will use a CL and 5 TBs to do so. My hope is to eventually damage some enemy fighter, should Xen place them there from Batavia. The AF is badly damaged but it can fly CAP and sending there the fighters from Batavia in order to intercept my poorly escorted bombers might be appealing to him.


Last, but not least, I'm starting the process of cleaning the pocket North of Johore Baru. It contains the whole Malaya Army, except for a couple of stragglers here and there. It's going to be a tough nut to crack because of the terrain, but I am confident in my men. I have roughly 750AV and he has 350AV.
Cleaning the area will completely clean the Bankgok-Singapore railway. In any case, there is no hurry.


PACIFIC

On the 23rd nothing happens, but on the 24th Xen sends CLs and DDs to contest my invasion of Milne Bay. He has airlifted there an Australian Bn, which resists the attack of my SNLF Coy.
I had no enemy ship spotted on the 23rd, but I supposed he would have tried to bomb my guys from the sea, so I sent the AirTF in the area close to Buna.
On the 24th, indeed, he bombs my troops and he stays in the hex with the ships, which are attacked by my AirTF. Out of the 69 planes between TBs and DBs which fly, I have only one hit, which, nvertheless, sinks the CL Perth. Horrible weather and a surprisingly bad DL hampered my strikes.
My AirTF are heavily covered by CAs and BBs, so I am not that scared of a rush forward from his side even if we're at only 4 hexes distance.

I'll try to find a way to reinforce the guys in Milne Bay. I think a whole SNLF unit should be more than enough to wipe out the australian bn.



CHINA

I decided to sweep Chungking on the 24th and I met roughly 40 fighters. I sent in Hankow the Tainan guys precisely with the duty of hunting down the AVG, but they haven't managed to meet it in the skies yet. Still, I do a nice 7-0.




OTHER

Taiyo and Hosho meet in Nagasaki\Sasebo. Taiyo got 27 A6M2s on board and Hosho has loaded once again her original air groups. On 7thDEC, indeed, I had left behind Hosho air groups in order to load 9+9 A6M2, with the idea of using it to provide air cover for Mersing landings. It went well and now she has taken on board once again her original air groups, which have been in the meanwhile upgraded to Kate-I and A6M2.
Both ships will be used to cover the landings in India.

My current A6M2-equipped groups disposition:
1) Tainan group with 45 A6M2 is in Hankow trying to find and destroy the AVG
2) 3rd Ku S-1 with 45 A6M2s is in Chiang Mai, waiting for the AF to reach lvl2 so that I can launch sweeps on various bases in Burma where I suspect the AVG is hiding
3) Yamada Det S-1 with 18 A6M2s is going to Singapore to help with the reduction of Batavia
4) Yamada Det S-2 with 9 A6M2s is in Singapore after having served in Makassar. It's the main group the dutch have fought so far in the skies.

I left Philippines totally isolated but I reduced allied airforce there. Over the course of the first 10 days, I have alternated the Tainan and the 3rd KU S-1 in sweeping the area. After many turns with relatively few losses, I finally found the entire enemy airforce inthe air with CAP range 0 and pushed them out of the skies.

Now my main target is to find and destroy the AVG, so that I will have less issues in India. Also, the A6M2s in the northern Thailand area and China can be redeployed in India very quickly once I have conquered a base. It's a very relevant element.
The two Yamada Dets are instead roaming around the DEI to hunt down any dutch attempt to either bomb my ships or to setup a CAP. So far, they've been quite unsuccessful in the latter.


In general, I don't really understand what's my opponent doing. I think his approach is to withdraw as much as he can, while he tries to create some delays here and there through airlifting of LCUs in bases I'm attacking. It's really not a threat for me, since when I go somewhere I always bring a very big hammer, but we'll see.

Apparently, he hasn't brought reinforcements via sea to Burma. That's bad, but such is life. After I conquered Moulmein and Port Blair with paras, he decided to stop any shipment so there aren't even the lonley xAKLs I was seeing before. I have been avoiding to attack his ships precisely with the idea of encouraging him to bring stuff, but I suspect he simply doesn't want to risk.


53rd Division purchased in Onshu and embarked. Destination: Singapore.
Fusan reaches port lvl7. I start baking PPs to buy out the ENG there.

ORIGINAL: RangerJoe

Multiple posts are fine with me if they each deal with a specific subject or area.

Very nice so far.

Thank you very much!!!

[ITAKLinus]

[center]25-DECEMBER-1941
TURN 19[/center]



DEI

I bomb from the sea both Batavia and Palembang. Few casualties in the latter and over 200 ones in the first.

Bad weather prevents missions over Palembang itself.


A DMS is sunk by PTs near Batavia. Very bad.

KB sees and sinks a couple of poor xAKLs while sailing to Singapore.


I place once again A6M2s in Makassar since the Dutch airforce withdrew from the northern tip of Java, foreseeing my naval bombardment.


I attack the malayan army trapped North of Johore Baru and I obtain a nice 2:1 in odds with a relevant amount of casualties among the defenders:
Japanese ground losses:
1047 casualties reported
Squads: 1 destroyed, 97 disabled
Non Combat: 1 destroyed, 8 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 2 disabled
Vehicles lost 14 (1 destroyed, 13 disabled)

Allied ground losses:
1874 casualties reported
Squads: 64 destroyed, 159 disabled
Non Combat: 2 destroyed, 33 disabled
Engineers: 4 destroyed, 24 disabled
Guns lost 37 (8 destroyed, 29 disabled)
Vehicles lost 5 (1 destroyed, 4 disabled)

I will repeat tomorrow since my distruption/fatigue is low.

Kendari is conquered and airsupport is now present in Ambon, captured yesterday.

I also conquered the base S-E of Singapore, but I lost a barge in the process.

Tomorrow I'll land in Sabang and in Palembang. Hopefully, I will be able to bomb from my AFs and kill as many enemies as possible before launching the first deliberate.


A landing from Balikpapan to Manado is scheduled to happen soon and a force is already at sea in order to land in Lautem.



PACIFIC

Thomas attempts an attack on my ships moving toward PM but fails. I am trying to get the Kimura Det. out of there. It has been crucial in securing the base, but now I need it in order to riconstitute the division to which it belongs.

My AirTF goes back toward Truk, since I deem the area unsafe.

A unconsequential raid of B17s arrives on my SNLF Coy in Milney Bay, while my Betties miss their targets with the bombs. Since they come from PM, I expect another round of naval bombardment soon.

Many allied subs around Wake, where I am in the tedious process of landing a SNLF and embarking the GuardsMixedBrigade. An engineer unit is already present but I lack of air support.

Very decent number of ENG and AirSupp arrives in Buna. Now it's time for the supplies to arrive (tomorrow or the day after tomorrow).



CHINA

Nothing relevant. Tomorrow I'll sweep again Chungking with Tainan air group.

AVG apparently in Meiktila, Burma. 60F identified there today. Rangoon void of air presence and with only 3 units inside. I'm thinking I will land inside it when I'm moving toward Diamond Harbor. I have a spare division for that (provided the 5th ID takes Palembang quickly enough).


OTHER

Nothing relevant. I am somewhat unconfortable with my AirCombatTF in the SoPac, since I believe it can be severely damaged by a duel with the two remaining US CVs. I need one more CV in the area but I do not have it available: detaching it from KB would be complex, given its current position.

I am in the process of purchasing support units from Manchuria. Today it has been the time of 3 Const.Co. of 15xENG each for 15PPs each. Not bad. I decided to send them ASAP to Hankow via ship, since I desperately need the AF lvl9 there in order to start bombing massively in the Loyang area and support my push toward Sian.





SITUATION IN NORTHERN DEI

[ITAKLinus]

Few notes while my opponent does the turn.


I) I decided, in a very bizarre manner, to accelerate the Yamato. I am a staunch opponent of producing the two Yamato-Class ships, but I decided to produce them in this game.
Now, accelerating it will free up shipbuilding space very early (13/03/1942) and allow me to accelerate all the CVs and CVLs.

It's a questionable choice, but I did the math and I decided it's more sound than it looks like. Moreover, since I use BBs almost only as bombardment force, it's nice to have the Yamato in earlier.
Mostly, though, it's just to streamline the shipbuilding schedule. Given that Saratoga is sunk, I am not in hurry to accelerate any of the earlier ships in any case.


II) Another very big decision is regarding my plane building.
I generally run my production in "lots", rather than "flows" for all the planes which are not "final" (meaning the ones I'll produce until the end of the game). So, for example, I decide I do produce 500 Oscar-Ic and so I do. Bang.

In this game I have decided for a different approach and I will simply set a number of planes I want in pool +/- a certain value.
F.ex. I decided to have, say, 50 A6M2 in pool +/-10. Once I reach 60 in pool, I turn off the factories and I reopen them once I reach 40. It's much easier to manage production in this way, rather than through the "lots", but it also gives you less forecasting capabilities regarding your production rates and, thus, associated costs. Supposedly, it's more expensive than my former (and favourite) method. On the flip side, it adds a good share of flexibility.


III) I decided I will produce merchant ships which will arrive before the end of 1942 and stop the rest. Really, not a big deal. TKs coming before the end of 1943 will be produced and some of them accelerated. So: xAKLs and xAKs produced for the whole 1942 and TKs produced until the end of 1943.
From June 1942, I will start stopping the production of various NavShipyards. Before that date, I will use the points to accelerate various TKs coming in the end of 1943.
My aim is to drastically reduce the HI expenditure on the merchant fleet already by the end of 1942. I do have way more than needed in terms of cargo capacity, but I like to produce some of them anyway. Also, there are all the Std-... Class to be produced (currently I do have only 17 of them) and converted to TKs.
CVEs will clearly remain into the queue. Differently from any other game, I want to give a shot to the horrible small ones which come late war. They might be handier than I thought.


IV) As soon as I have taken Palembang, I start my LI expansion programme. I am confident to be able to take the other major oilfields relatively intact and I forecasted a total expenditure for them of 200.000SUPPLIES, of which 150.000 will be for Miri.
Without anticipating much, the general idea is to invest in some key areas in China and in the DEI.
I'm also in the process of calculating how many HIs I can add without f@cking up the economy. They're relatively more important than LIs. Well, actually much more important.
If my opponent decides for a DEI-focused strategy, though, I'm screwed.
The general plan is to add LIs scattered around in China/DEI and HIs in DEI. In case the DEI get cut off from Onshu, I will be able to locally produce more than enough to feed the troops and to contribute to the general war effort through HI production. Moreover, the added supplies will potentially enable me to have a good air presence in the area.

In my calculations I take into account being cut off from DEI from 01-JUN-1944. I highly doubt the "Holy Route" (Singapore-Nagasaki) will be severed so early, but... Better safe than sorry.

[ny59giants]

Do you plan on taking off the second FP groups from your CA/BB to resize on the CS to enable you to train up more fighter pilots? If so, will this be the case for all non-restricted FP groups?

[ITAKLinus]

ORIGINAL: ny59giants

Do you plan on taking off the second FP groups from your CA/BB to resize on the CS to enable you to train up more fighter pilots? If so, will this be the case for all non-restricted FP groups?

Hi there, thanks for the comment!

No, to be fair i find it a little bit too much. I have nothing at all if my opponents do it, but I don't like to do so.
I will criminally resize everything I can resize, though. Just, I don't like to take them off the ships.
I do resize when the ships sink.

Most of the FPs, as extravagant as it might look like, are used for NavB training rather than fighter pilots. I'm always short of good DB and PA pilots. I do train them in multiple skills, ASW included and it takes a lot of time more than usual. Also, DBs have always horrendous losses in my games since I'm pretty liberal in their use.

Fighters are not that hard to train in the end since you enjoy a healthy period of A6M2 supremacy in which you can train them very well at the frontline. I do send pilots not ready yet to the front and make them do actual fighting, cutting dramatically the time required by the training groups.



I do take out of ships the second group present in some AVs. And i resize it just like anything else. I use them for ASW.

[AlbertN]

Quite interesting to read of the preparations and technicalities - which hopefully can help me crawl in the game!

[ITAKLinus]

[center]26-27 DECEMBER 1941
TURN 20-21[/center]


DEI

On the 2th I conquer Palembang at the first deliberate. No issues at all and entire hostile army surrenders, bar a lonley dutch base force which withdraws toward Djambi.

The big news is that I have only 8 points of OIL and 8 of REF damaged. That's quite a big plus. Very little amount of fuel and supplies found in the base, though.

I also land in various other locations in Sumatra (Sabang and another one on the coastline).


The enemy decides not to oppose my landings with his airforce. I have conquered Prambolieh (yeah, that's not the spelling but you got what I mean...) with paras few days ago. Now it has a healthy 8 air support and I placed there 24 Nates with CAP, range=1. LRCAP of Oscars and A6M2s over the oilfields is provided from Singapore. Two units of AirSupp are landing tomorrow and I hope to have the AF repaired by the next turn.


Trapped Malayan Army stands another deliberate but they are now without supplies and at 1:8 odds. They're gonna surrender soon.
A Thai division is now marching on Georgetown.

Billions of ships in Singapore. Many xAKs are being transformed to xAK-t for the time being: I'll need as much sealift as I can for the invasion of India.
3 divisions are already reformed and ready (100%TOE). 1 is arriving from HK. 1 is in Malacca (the Imperial Guards) and 1 is in Palembang and will be shipped back in the next couple of days.
Total of 6 out of the 8 I need for the initial assault (1st and 2nd waves). I have several divisions which can be rebuilt and which have their various "fragments" arriving. One more division is arriving from Onshu with a large load of supplies.


In loading the troops for Miri and Brunei landings.

PACIFIC

I manage somehow to load most of the Kimura Det. from PM. Now I still have a good share of it to be transported, but I think I can do that the next turn.

Allied ships have withdrawn so far, probably scared by my AirTF. AirTF almost arrived in Truk, btw.

Nothing really important happens here. In three turns I will have an AirHQ in Rabaul. Hopefully, the AF will be lvl4 for that time.


CHINA

While I am concentrating my forces for the offensive in the LOyang area, I keep sweeping Chungking. I think Chinese have exhausted their fighters in the first line. Tainan air group has zero losses.

Hankow should reach lvl8 tomorrow or the day after.


OTHER

The huge news from Palembang will be extremely relevant for the next phase/actions. I hoped to get it intact and so it has been. Now it's time to organise its protection and further expansion in the area.


I have finally found the AVG in Burma. Chiang Mai reaches AF lvl2 and the 3rdKU sweeps obtaining a nice 3-0 in the air. A group of Betty from Bangkok helps as well damaging few on the ground and destroying one more.
Fighters appear for the first time in Rangoon. I will sweep them tomorrow with the 9-planes Tojo group.

Successful deliberate at Moulmein, which repulses the enemy troops coming from Tavoy. I keep the base.


I start concentrating Thai troops for their assault in Burma.