Thread for DB3000 database problems, updates or issues

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UncertainlyCertain
Posts: 26
Joined: Mon Jul 20, 2020 6:18 am

RE: Thread for DB3000 database problems, updates or issues

Post by UncertainlyCertain »

<type>UPDATE</type>
<summary>CAMM (Sea Ceptor / Sky Sabre) data correction</summary>
<detail>This has been asked before on the forums, still I'd like to bring attention to the following weapons' issues:

- weapon #3735 Sky Sabre [Land Ceptor] and #2783 Sea Ceptor [CAMM(M)]

Currently the speed of this missile is set as:

0 - 12000 ft band | 1160kt (1.75M)
12000 - 24000 ft band | 1270kt (2.00M)
24000 - 65000 ft band | 1600kt (2.60M)

Yet MBDA (the manufacturer) claims a maximum speed of 3M. Assuming this is intended as maximum reachable speed, say in the 24k - 65k ft band, then the maximum "low altitude band" speed should be higher.

Here for example the stats for the #2767 VL-MICA EM (a missile of similar performance)

0 - 12000 ft band | 1390kt (2.10M)
12000 - 24000 ft band | 1520kt (2.40M)
24000 - 65000 ft band | 1870kt (3.09M)

Next point is "target speed" which is set at 1350kt. This allows the weapon to engage older supersonic missiles such as the SS-N-22 (Sunburn / Moskit) or the SS-N-26 (Strobile / Yakhont) albeit this pushes the CAMM to the higher limit of its interception parameters and the POK against such targets is approximately 35%.
However when it comes to faster missiles like the SS-N-27 (Sizzler / Kalibr) and its chinese derivatives / copies, the CAMM cannot engage them because they are outside its interception parameters.
Again, according to the manufacturer the CAMM has "[...] capability to intercept and thereby neutralize the full range of current and future threats including combat aircraft and the new generation of supersonic anti-ship missiles." and "[...] Sea Ceptor [*a.k.a. CAMM] provides complete protection against all known and projected air targets." this leads me to assume a higher engagement speed then currently displayed in the DB, for example akin to the previously referenced VL-MICA or the #3168 Derby [SPYDER-SR], both having a maximum engagement speed of 1950kt and both similar in design and parameters to the CAMM.

</detail>
<evidence>
https://www.mbda-systems.com/product/sea-ceptor/ ---> Official MBDA page
https://www.forces.net/news/what-can-ro ... issiles-do
https://www.royalnavy.mod.uk/news-and-l ... r-missiles
https://www.seaforces.org/wpnsys/SURFAC ... r-CAMM.htm
</evidence>
UncertainlyCertain
Posts: 26
Joined: Mon Jul 20, 2020 6:18 am

RE: Thread for DB3000 database problems, updates or issues

Post by UncertainlyCertain »

<type>ADD</type>
<summary>Please, consider adding the SIRIUS / MPCI / Albatros NG short / medium defence system, in service date: Italy 2022/2024+</summary>
<detail>Based on the EMADS and CAMM by MBDA. Three different systems for the Italian Army, Air force and Navy to replace the aging Skyguard and Aspide air defence systems scheduled to be put out of service in 2021.

The land systems are based on a truck mounted C2 / radar center with several TEL each with 8(12?) CAMM-ER missiles.

Expected configuration

For the Army - "Forza NEC" (Network Enabled Capability) or PCMI (Posto Comando Modulo di Ingaggio): equipped with X - TAR radar and 2 TELs. Requirement for 9 systems
For the Air Force - "MAADS"(Medium Advanced Air Defence System) or SIRIUS: equipped with Kronos 3D Land radar and 3 TELs. Requirement for 3 systems

The naval system is known as Albatros NG and "[...] is centered on a modular, compact and low-weight maritime launching system, firing (weapon control) units and platform data link terminal (PDLT), all managed by the system command and control (C2) unit. The Albatros NG suite also includes a system control panel (SCP) to conduct pre-operational and safety activities on system components." with integration into the SAAM ESD system (developed for the Aster family) of the CAMM-ER to be fired from existing VLS such as Sylver / ExLS.
The PPA class of OPV for the Italian Navy is scheduled to be equipped with such system.

As for the missile: a further development of the CAMM. The maximum range is extended to "over 45km".
Its specs are similar to the CAMM with some key differences:

Length: 4200 mm
Diameter: 190 mm
Weight: 160 kg
Maximum range: 45+ km / 25nm c.a.

The missiles come packed in a canister 275mm x 275mm x 4400mm, that is the same canister for the CAMM but longer which in theory means that the CAMM-ER can also be quad-packed in a Sylver or MK.41 VLS.

Air Force variant

Image
Image



</detail>
<evidence>
https://www.laran.it/wp-content/uploads ... ississ.pdf --> Comprehensive report on planned Italian systems, costs and development dynamics (in italian)
https://www.edrmagazine.eu/albatros-ng- ... m-detailed --> Albatros NG
https://www.mbda-systems.com/product/camm-er/ --> Official MBDA page for the CAMM-ER
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CAMM_(missile_family) --> Wikipedia reference
https://svppbellum.blogspot.com/2019/04 ... ne-di.html --> CAMM / CAMM-ER w/pictures of missiles (in italian)
https://www.analisidifesa.it/2021/03/a- ... dscamm-er/ --> News on the SIRIUS module (in italian)
http://avioblog.it/mbda-italia-ha-ricev ... g-camm-er/ --> Albatros NG related news (in italian)
</evidence>
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Blast33
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Location: Above and beyond

RE: Thread for DB3000 database problems, updates or issues

Post by Blast33 »

In the attached JPEG is a sumup of the AIM-7 Sparrow and AIM-9 Sidewinder A-A missiles used in Vietnam.
Apart from the misses, a very large number are failures.
This has also effect on other conflicts like Shifting Sands etc.
Is something like this programmable?

Source: Marshall L. Michel's "Clashes: Air Combat Over North Vietnam, 1965-1972.
https://twitter.com/RealAirPower1/status/1404819028288458753

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UncertainlyCertain
Posts: 26
Joined: Mon Jul 20, 2020 6:18 am

RE: Thread for DB3000 database problems, updates or issues

Post by UncertainlyCertain »

<type>UPDATE</type>
<summary>SAMP/T correction</summary>
<detail>The following unit facilities: #230 SAM Bty (Mamba [SAMP/T]), #735 SAM Bty (Mamba [SAMP/T]), #3203 SAM Bty (Mamba [SAMP/T]) are affected.

As of DB3K v488 these units are set to use the missile #578 Aster 30 SAAM-FR/IT however it appears that the SAMP/T actually uses the Aster 30 Blk 1 (ever since it was put into service) which has BMD capabilities to counter SRBMs (i.e. SCUD-like missiles, 600km max range).
This is backed by reference here [1], here [2] and here [3], furthermore these [4][5] articles support this claim stating that the SAMP/T proved BMD capabilities during trials in 2010, so before the adoption of the system by its current operators, therefore the SAMP/T uses the Block 1 missile as standard.

It appears that the Aster 30 variants are subdivided as follows:

Block 0 - Initial variant for ship local/area defence. No BMD capability.
Block 1 - Ground based variant for the SAMP/T. Main difference from the Blk 0 is limited BMD capability.
Block 1 NT - Improved version scheduled to be fielded in the near future (2024+) for both naval and land application (in the form of the SAMP/T NG). BMD capability against 1500km range missiles.
Block 2 - A new version with a kill-vehicle and improved BMD capabilities to counter ballistic missiles with a 3000km range. In development.

The Block 1 is present in game as weapon #681 Aster 30 Blk 1 and is currently affiliated with facilities #3213 SAM Bn (Aster 30) and #3214 SAM Bn (Aster 30). Note that these two facilities appear to be incorrectly organized: each is composed of 8 Aster 30 Blk 1 mounts with an Aster 30 Blk 1 missile per mount; also the only sensor for this facility is the trusted Mk 1 Eyeball.

I suggest:

- remove facilities #3213 SAM Bn (Aster 30) and #3214 SAM Bn (Aster 30);
- replace in the following facilities #230 SAM Bty (Mamba [SAMP/T]), #735 SAM Bty (Mamba [SAMP/T]), #3203 SAM Bty (Mamba [SAMP/T]), the missile #578 Aster 30 SAAM-FR/IT with the #681 Aster 30 Blk 1;
- replace in the following facility #3203 SAM Bty (Mamba [SAMP/T]) the sensor Arabel with ControlMaster 200 (already present in game as facility #2477) in accordance with the following reference [6][7] which claims that Singapore decided to swap the Arabel radar for the Ground Master 200;

Also, weapon #681 Aster 30 Blk 1 currently has a maximum engagement speed of 6500kts, wouldn't it be better to reduce it to 4500kts to reflect the fact that its effective only against SRBMs?

Thank you for taking this request for consideration.</detail>
<evidence>
[1] https://www.armyrecognition.com/france_ ... video.html
[2] https://pulaski.pl/en/french-response-t ... e-threats/
[3] https://www.seaforces.org/wpnsys/SURFACE/Aster-SAM.htm
[4] https://www.thalesgroup.com/en/worldwide/defence/samp-t
[5] https://www.army-technology.com/projects/aster-30/
[6] https://www.defensenews.com/land/2018/0 ... ideo-post/
[7] https://www.ainonline.com/aviation-news ... les-radars
</evidence>
Fox13
Posts: 18
Joined: Fri Jun 26, 2020 1:23 pm

RE: Thread for DB3000 database problems, updates or issues

Post by Fox13 »

According to those pictures, the Saudi Arabian National Guard(SANG) is an operator of the VL-MICA system with GrounMaster-60. However, SAMI ( Saudi Arabian Military Industries ) has got a Joint venture agreement with Thales about manufacturing the VL-MICA system, but with Ground Master 200, ( maybe SANG is using both of them?). Also, SANG is operating the RapidFire system.


Those pictures took from SANG social media accounts.



https://ibb.co/TT09pDy
https://ibb.co/QKG4gJr
https://ibb.co/rQX4S9w
https://ibb.co/zJdQTnm


Moreover, I wish If you added the MK3 missile for the crotale SAM system,

The missile No-Escape-Zone is 15km and maximum effective range of 16km

Some useful sources:-
https://www.thalesgroup.com/en/vt1 ( there is a useful pdf brochure here)
https://missiledefenseadvocacy.org/defe ... ration-ng/


BDukes
Posts: 2678
Joined: Wed Dec 27, 2017 12:59 pm

RE: Stickied thread for minor database issues?

Post by BDukes »

<type>ADD</type>
<summary>Add Chinese Z-8L Super Frelon 2020 Variant-Updated Info</summary>
<detail>China create a wide body Z-8G called Z-8L variant to accomidate bigger cargo. Updated issue with more info. 1st link original request. Second Link picture comparison between G and L. Third Link notes 15 ton vs. 13ton. Capacity similar to Mi-17. 4th Link. Jane's notes 1.8-2.4 meter width difference from G. 5th link notes 10 are in service which jives with the photos </detail>
<evidence>
fb.asp?m=4889486
https://twitter.com/louischeung_hk/stat ... 4887618561
https://www.airrecognition.com/index.ph ... opter.html
https://www.janes.com/defence-news/news ... ing-trials
https://chinese-military-aviation.blogs ... s-iii.html
</evidence>
Don't call it a comeback...
BDukes
Posts: 2678
Joined: Wed Dec 27, 2017 12:59 pm

RE: Stickied thread for minor database issues?

Post by BDukes »

<type>ADD</type>
<summary>Add Iraqi AN/TWQ-1 Avenger SAM IOC 2014 x8 and x13 MPQ-64 Sentinel Radars</summary>
<detail>Add Avenger SAM to Iraqi Army 2014. Copy Facility #286. Likely J variant stinger. Bought 13 MPQ-64 Sentinels Radars. Few paired with these systems. </detail>
<evidence>
https://twitter.com/FarooqB90714421/sta ... 1826949122
https://armstrade.sipri.org/armstrade/p ... gister.php
</evidence>
Don't call it a comeback...
BDukes
Posts: 2678
Joined: Wed Dec 27, 2017 12:59 pm

RE: Stickied thread for minor database issues?

Post by BDukes »

<type>ADD</type>
<summary>Add HGR-106 Radar to Pakistan 2014</summary>
<detail>These radar system where sold to Pakistan with Chinese AAA Guns and 825 FCR to defend Pakistani Naval Bases. HGR-106 [LLQ032] is export UHF system. First two links pictures in PN service. Third link basic stats </detail>
<evidence>
https://twitter.com/FarooqB90714421/sta ... 6657528834
https://twitter.com/rajfortyseven/statu ... 2379436032
https://www.radartutorial.eu/19.kartei/ ... 59.en.html
https://trishul-trident.blogspot.com/20 ... -2018.html
</evidence>
Don't call it a comeback...
SRB-Z32
Posts: 6
Joined: Tue Feb 09, 2021 2:42 pm

RE: Stickied thread for minor database issues?

Post by SRB-Z32 »

UPDATE:
R77, R27T & R27R Loadout to Angolan MiG-23-98. There are several photos showing these planes carrying these missiles.








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SRB-Z32
Posts: 6
Joined: Tue Feb 09, 2021 2:42 pm

RE: Stickied thread for minor database issues?

Post by SRB-Z32 »

MiG YE-8

Heavily modified Mig21 with Mig23 fire control system and weapons.



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SRB-Z32
Posts: 6
Joined: Tue Feb 09, 2021 2:42 pm

RE: Stickied thread for minor database issues?

Post by SRB-Z32 »

Kosava (Whirlwind) launcher of rocket assisted aerial bombs for Serbia

"

Kosava (Whirlwind) truck mounted launcher of rocket assisted aerial bombs is advanced artillery system for long range target engagements of unique concept and applied design solutions, providing artillery units with great punch capability.

Main system features:

simple and reliable design,
low-cost of development and production,
high battlefield survivability (due to high mobility and rapid into and out of action transition time),
capability for sudden, concentrated, accurate and powerful engagement of wide range of battlefield targets,
high firepower (owing to multiple launch capability, high warhead effectiveness, relatively high rate of fire, and possibility of using broad range of modified standard and guided aerial bombs)
warhead weight/ range ratio is optimized to suit typical categories of battlefield targets and combat scenarios.
Kosava can engage following target types:
concentrations of enemy manpower and combat materiel
AD and artillery systems positions
Highly reinforced zones of resistance, particularly in anti-terrorist and anti-guerilla operations
C3 (command, control and communication) nodes
Logistic and storage facilities
Vital military, industrial and infrastructure facilities



Kosava munition has been created by mating the bombs with solid propellant rocket motors, in order to reach the efficient range of up to 12-50 km, dependent on bomb and motor type. With reduced warhead weight, even longer ranges can be achieved.

After active phase of flight is completed, bomb is released from rocket motor assembly by pyrotechnical/mechanical device, and continues flight by ballistic trajectory up to the impact point.

WARHEAD RANGE
Kosava uses general purpose (GP) aerial bombs or pure blast aerial bombs based on FAE (fuel air explosive) technology. Warhead weight envelope covers 100 kg, 250 kg and 500 kg bombs.
Kosava can be also adapted to fire rocket assisted laser guided bombs of 100 kg and 250 kg class, using aerial bombs with HE or penetration warhead as bomb chassis.



GUIDANCE
1st phase: The program guidance
2nd phase: The modified pursuit guidance. This modification pursuit guidance used both the angle between LOS and velocity and the angle attack.



Advantages of modified pursuit guidance are:
Better stability of system
Higher accuracy on the illuminated target.

"



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SRB-Z32
Posts: 6
Joined: Tue Feb 09, 2021 2:42 pm

RE: Stickied thread for minor database issues?

Post by SRB-Z32 »

Pracka SAM for Serbia (Modified Praga AAA)

Versions:
RL-1 using 2x R-13M or R-3S missiles

RL-2M using 2x R-60MK missiles with Booster motors

RL-4M using 1x R-73E Missile with Booster motor





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Parel803
Posts: 937
Joined: Thu Oct 10, 2019 3:39 pm
Location: Netherlands

RE: Stickied thread for minor database issues?

Post by Parel803 »

Good morning,
For a CoastGuard like scenario I'm looking for a person in the water. If it is in there, please point me in the right direction. If it isn't poissible disregard this entry.
with regards GJ
KnightHawk75
Posts: 1850
Joined: Thu Nov 15, 2018 7:24 pm

RE: Stickied thread for minor database issues?

Post by KnightHawk75 »

@Parel803 (post #6932),

Try
2553 - Life Raft [5m]
2552 - Civilian Life Raft [10m]
2741 - Civilian Life Boat [11m]
2742 - Civilian Life Boat [7m]
---
+ add Personnel mount (#3037), usually works for rescue scenarios involving water.

Given 1147.26 enhancements (csar\sar) and waspickedup unit properties, a 'ship' that is a person in the water is probably a good idea for addition though for the next round.
Parel803
Posts: 937
Joined: Thu Oct 10, 2019 3:39 pm
Location: Netherlands

RE: Stickied thread for minor database issues?

Post by Parel803 »

Thx again. I'do.
with regards GJ
Parel803
Posts: 937
Joined: Thu Oct 10, 2019 3:39 pm
Location: Netherlands

RE: Stickied thread for minor database issues?

Post by Parel803 »

<type>ADD</type>
<summary>DB3K489, Bouchard (Gowind) class, P51, Offshore Patrol Vessel (OPV), Argentinian Navy, </summary>
<detal>3 of 4 units in class. First one is ex-L'Adroit (French), other three newly build by Kership in French.
starting form second one (ARA Piedrabuena) units are differently armed.
The L'Adroit in DB under France with #2885. Transferred in 2019
</detail>
<evidence>
https://www.naval-technology.com/news/n ... ol-vessel/
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ARA_Bouchard_(P-51)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ARA_Piedrabuena_(P-52)
https://www.navyrecognition.com/index.p ... group.html
https://en.mercopress.com/2021/07/02/ar ... iedrabuena
https://militaryleak.com/2021/06/26/arg ... l-service/
https://www.navalnews.com/naval-news/20 ... edrabuena/
https://navyrecognition.com/index.php/n ... -navy.html
https://www.naval.com.br/blog/2020/01/2 ... gibraltar/
https://www.naval.com.br/blog/2021/04/1 ... argentina/
https://www.marinetraffic.com/pt/ais/de ... IEDRABUENA
https://www.marinetraffic.com/pt/ais/de ... A_BOUCHARD
</evidence>
with regards GJ
TwarVG
Posts: 47
Joined: Mon Mar 26, 2018 2:45 pm
Location: Britannia

RE: Stickied thread for minor database issues?

Post by TwarVG »

<type>UPDATE</type>
<summary>Add Sea Dart Mod 2/3 datalink and range increase</summary>
<detail>The Sea Dart SAM system featured a datalink for the mod 2/3 missiles (#1640, #831) so that they only required terminal SARH guidance and an increase in range to 80nmi. In the current database they're pure SARH meaning the Type 42 Destroyers/Invincible class carriers can only engage 2 targets simultaneously and have 60nmi of range. Can the range and guidance for these missiles updated, and all of their launch platforms be updated to feature the datalink.</detail>
<evidence>
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sea_Dart "Mod 2 — 1989–1991. Upgrade included ADIMP (Air Defence IMProvement) which saw the replacement of six old circuit cards in the guidance system with one, allowing the spare volume to be used for an autopilot. Used alongside a command datalink (sited on the Type 909 pedestal) it allows several missiles to be 'in the air' at once, re-targeted during flight etc. and allows an initial ballistic trajectory, doubling range to 80 nmi (92 mi; 150 km) with the upgraded 909(I) radar for terminal illumination only."
https://cmchant.com/sea-dart-naval-sam-system/
https://www.defensemedianetwork.com/sto ... -salute/2/
</evidence>
Copper274
Posts: 2
Joined: Sun Nov 10, 2019 6:27 am

RE: Stickied thread for minor database issues?

Post by Copper274 »

<type>UPDATE</type>
<summary>U-28A #3325 small para- and cargodrop capability</summary>
<detail>According to this PDF from Pilatus, the new NGX modell of the PC-12 has a military variant (Spectre) which has build-in drop door (see quote)</detail>
<evidence>
"Built directly into the aircraft’s standard cargo door, it can be used to deploy parachute specialists or air-drop supplies and relief goods. What’s more, this added feature does not compromise any of the mission capability of the PC-12 NGX Spectre.
pilatus-aircraft.cöm/data/document/Pilatus-Aircraft-Ltd-PC-12NGX-Spectre-Brochure(PDF Page 12)
</evidence>
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