Red Tide Scenario 6 Feedback

[HalfLifeExpert]

I've reached scenario 6 in the campaign, and I've got some feedback:

1) There's definitely some scoring issues in this scenario. Not all of my submarine kills registered in my score (including a Hotel II SSBN and an Algerian Romeo). The Hotel II should be worth extra points being an SSBN. Losses and Expenditures and scoring Log at the end.

2) The beginning seems a little unfair to me in terms of scoring (for campaign purposes). There's at least one ship I really can't do much to save except pray the RNG ends up in my favor. I lose a Portuguese ship very early due to a single long range missile, and it can't really defend itself.

3) Related to the above, I think the passing score for this scenario is too high (700 points), Even with the subs I killed that didn't register, I don't really see a clear path to success. Perhaps knock the required score down a couple hundred points?

Losses and Expenditures:

SIDE: NATO
===========================================================

LOSSES:
-------------------------------
4x A-7P Corsair II
2x AV-8S Harrier [VA.1A Matador]
1x F 109 Leander [Type 12I Leander Batch 1, Ikara]
1x F 472 Almirante Pereira da Silva [Dealey Class]
1x F 480 Comandante Joao Belo [Mod Commandant Rivière]
1x F 487 Baptiste de Andrade
1x F 71 Baleares
1x Nimrod MR.2P
1x P-3C Orion Update II
1x Phantom II FG.1
1x SA.319B Alouette III


EXPENDITURES:
------------------
18x 100mm/55 Model 1953 PFHE
5x 100mm/55 Model 1968 PFHE
16x 127mm/38 Twin HE-PD Burst [HiCap, 2 rnds]
47x 127mm/54 HE-CVT [HiFrag]
5x 20mm/85 Mk15 Phalanx Blk 0 Burst [200 rnds]
22x 20mm/85 SUU-23/A Gun Pod Burst [100 rnds]
2x 30mm ADEN Mk4 x 2 Burst [50 rnds]
62x 40mm/60 Quad Bofors Burst [8 rnds]
79x 40mm/60 Twin Bofors Burst [4 rnds]
4x 40mm/70 Single Bofors Burst [4 rnds]
5x 40mm/70 Single Breda Burst [4 rnds]
4x 76mm/50 Twin Frag Burst [2 rnds]
1x AGM-65B Maverick EO
7x AIM-9F Sidewinder
4x AIM-9H Sidewinder
17x AIM-9L Sidewinder
75x AN/SSQ-53A DIFAR
111x AN/SSQ-62A DICASS
43x AN/SSQ-77A VLAD
38x CRV-7 C14 70mm Rocket
8x E15
2x Ikara [Mk46 Mod 2]
2x L5 Mod 3
1x Mk44 Mod 1
2x Mk46 LWT Mod 2
9x Mk46 NEARTIP Mod 5
2x RGM-84C Harpoon IB
5x RIM-66A SM-1MR Blk IV
8x RIM-7H Sea Sparrow
20x Sky Flash
31x SSQ-904 Mini-Jezebel LOFAR
38x SSQ-947 Julie Active Range-Only [AN/SSQ-47]
25x SSQ-963A CAMBS III



SIDE: Soviet Union
===========================================================

LOSSES:
-------------------------------
1x BRK Kildin [Pr.56U]
1x EM Kotlin SAM [Pr.56K Spokoinyy]
2x PL-611 Zulu IV
1x PL-641 Foxtrot
2x PL-641B Tango [Som]
1x PLA-627A November [Kit]
1x PLA-671RTM Victor III [Shchuka]
1x PLARB-658M Hotel II
1x SKR Kotlin [Pr.56 Spokoinyy]


EXPENDITURES:
------------------
3x 130mm/58 Twin HE Burst [2 rnds]
6x 45mm/85 Quad Burst [8 rnds]
13x 53-51 Pattern Runner
6x 53-65K WH
6x 57mm/81 ZIF-75 Quad DP Burst [6 rnds]
10x AK-230 30mm/65 Twin Burst [50 rnds]
8x Generic Acoustic Decoy
2x Generic Acoustic Decoy
2x SA-N-1b Goa [M-1M/P Volna-M/P, 4K91 / V-601]
1x SS-N-12 Sandbox Mod 1 [P-500 Bazalt]
4x SS-N-2c Improved Styx [P-15M]



SIDE: Non Subs
===========================================================

LOSSES:
-------------------------------


EXPENDITURES:
------------------



SIDE: Merchant Shipping
===========================================================

LOSSES:
-------------------------------


EXPENDITURES:
------------------



SIDE: Biological
===========================================================

LOSSES:
-------------------------------


EXPENDITURES:
------------------



SIDE: Algeria
===========================================================

LOSSES:
-------------------------------
2x 801 Rais Hamidou [Pr.1234E Nanuchka II]
16x MiG-21PFM Fishbed F
1x PL-633 Romeo
16x Su-20 Fitter C


EXPENDITURES:
------------------
5x 23mm Gsh-23 Burst [GP-9 Pod, 40 rnds]
7x 30mm NR-30 x 2 Burst [20 rnds]
4x AA-2a Atoll [R-3S]
4x FAB-250M-54 GPB
4x FAB-500M-54 GPB
2x PK-16 Chaff [TSP-60U]
2x PK-16 Flare [TST-60U]
20x SA-N-4b Gecko [9M33M3]



SIDE: Allied Shipping
===========================================================

LOSSES:
-------------------------------
1x Commercial Dry-Bulk Carrier - Handymax Size [45,000t DWT]
1x Commercial RO/RO Vessel [18,000t DWT]


EXPENDITURES:
------------------

Scoring Log:

04/17/1985 04:03: Score changed from 0 to -30. Reason: Event Action: 'NATO Frigate Sunk' has been fired (part of Event: 'NRP Adm Magaihaes Correia Sunk')

04/17/1985 04:13: Score changed from -30 to 20. Reason: Event Action: 'Zulu Sunk' has been fired (part of Event: 'Zulu IV Sunk')

04/17/1985 04:13: Score changed from 20 to -10. Reason: Event Action: 'NATO Frigate Sunk' has been fired (part of Event: 'HMS Leander Sunk')

04/17/1985 04:13: Score changed from -10 to -40. Reason: Event Action: 'NATO Frigate Sunk' has been fired (part of Event: 'NRP Comandante Joao Belo Sunk')

04/17/1985 04:52: Score changed from -40 to -70. Reason: Event Action: 'NATO Frigate Sunk' has been fired (part of Event: 'NRP Augusto de Castilho Sunk')

04/17/1985 05:23: Score changed from -70 to -20. Reason: Event Action: 'Kildin Sunk' has been fired (part of Event: 'Kildin Sunk')

04/17/1985 06:01: Score changed from -20 to 30. Reason: Event Action: 'Tango Sunk' has been fired (part of Event: 'Tango Sunk')

04/17/1985 06:05: Score changed from 30 to 80. Reason: Event Action: 'Kotlin Sunk' has been fired (part of Event: 'Kotlin Sunk')

04/17/1985 06:24: Score changed from 80 to 50. Reason: Event Action: 'NATO Frigate Sunk' has been fired (part of Event: 'SPS Beleares Sunk')

04/17/1985 06:45: Score changed from 50 to 125. Reason: Event Action: 'Victor Sunk' has been fired (part of Event: 'Victor III Sunk')

04/17/1985 06:57: Score changed from 125 to 175. Reason: Event Action: 'Kotlin Sunk' has been fired (part of Event: 'Kotlin SAM Sunk')

04/17/1985 10:54: Score changed from 175 to 205. Reason: Event Action: 'Algerian Nanuchka Sunk' has been fired (part of Event: 'Nanuchka Sunk')

04/17/1985 12:46: Score changed from 205 to 235. Reason: Event Action: 'Algerian Nanuchka Sunk' has been fired (part of Event: 'Nanuchka Sunk')

[TitaniumTrout]

I had a similar experience. Until this point I thought all of the scenarios felt good, with this one I was trying to plug holes without enough plugs. Which is totally fine from a narrative standpoint, but like HLE says, it left me wondering how I would wrap it all up by the end. One thing I liked is every asset felt very important as you had so little to work with. Each pair of those garbage Harriers was critical, as were the Phantoms. Rushing assets to hope to intercept incoming Fitters was a pretty tense challenge.

[HalfLifeExpert]

Exactly.

I don't necessarily have a problem with the scenario itself, just with the scoring in relation to Campaign mode. If this were a purely standalone scenario I wouldn't be concerned.

Obviously some fixes are needed due to not all sub kills being registered in the Score, but I hope the devs make some of the adjustments I recommend.

[CommandPB]

ORIGINAL: HalfLifeExpert

Exactly.

I don't necessarily have a problem with the scenario itself, just with the scoring in relation to Campaign mode. If this were a purely standalone scenario I wouldn't be concerned.

Obviously some fixes are needed due to not all sub kills being registered in the Score, but I hope the devs make some of the adjustments I recommend.

All noted

[AndrewJ]

Looking through the events, I'm seeing the Hotel scoring 200, the Echo 100, November and Victor 75, Foxtrot, Tango, and Zulu 50, so the SSBN is definitely worth more than any others.

The trouble is that the triggers for the Foxtrot, Hotel, and November refer to unit IDs that do not exist in the game, instead of the actual units which are present. I'm not sure how that would happen, but it should be a simple matter to correct. If you want, you can do this in the editor yourself: go to the Event Editor, Triggers, select the appropriate trigger ('Foxtrot Sunk', etc.), and in the last drop-down for 'Specific Unit', switch it from the long alphanumeric code to the named unit.

[AndrewJ]

ORIGINAL: TitaniumTrout
One thing I liked is every asset felt very important as you had so little to work with. Each pair of those garbage Harriers was critical, as were the Phantoms. Rushing assets to hope to intercept incoming Fitters was a pretty tense challenge.

Agreed! There was a lot of anxious action at the start for me, trying to get fighter planes into place, flee from the Russian surface group, cut off the enemy with my sub, keep the Moosbrugger out of trouble, etc. Somehow, scenarios have a little more spice when you don't have quite enough to to everything you need to do. I definitely enjoyed this one.

[HalfLifeExpert]

I've just played this scenario with a corrected score version by Kushan (although the Algerian Romeo subs still don't count toward score?)

Anyway I won, but only barely. Suffered pretty bad losses, and one of the Portuguese frigates I lost is still that one I can't do anything about. No matter what I do that frigate is going to be destroyed very early in the scenario.

I still think the required pass score should be knocked down maybe 100-200 points.