What are extended maps?

[MarkShot]

Ian,

You are a big fish in a small pond. I gaze at you in total awe. [&o]

PS: That’s right. I am not intimidated. Others are not either. Most realize the obvious is that you made yourself into a big fish by pouring arsenic into the pond.

[Andrew Brown]

Hey all, lets keep it civil.

My updated extended AE map is compatible with any scenario designed for use with my (original) extended map. As mentioned they are not compatible with any of the official scenarios included with the game.

[MarkShot]

Thank you. It is kind of you to support the game beyond the usual last patch.

[Lokasenna]

PS - nobody cares about epeen contests.

[Alfred]

ORIGINAL: MarkShot

Alfred,

I have been googling for hours to find this stuff and looking at the various files. ChemKid was listed as one of the best map makers, but is AWOL. Babes made maps that allowed reduction of stacking limits. The main difference between most of these files hex representations and borders versus topo or stylized. The stock has about 8 files and the extended maybe 50.

Alfred, I think that was rude. I know it's a pandemic, and that may have interrupted your therapy visits. But if you cannot contribute, then just move along please, and don't post in my threads.

Thank you. (The next I am going to report you to a moderator. Reason: discouraging customers from purchasing Matrix products.)

PS: I am a Matrix beta since around 2003.

1. The man calls me rude, without identifying what was rude. How far has the English language been debased in today's modern world.

2. Then immediately follows up with an ad hominem attack. One could say you are applying different standards.

3. Just as this isn't your forum, this isn't your thread. You have no authority to dictate who or what gets posted in a thread opened by you. You only, as everyone else equally does, have the power to green button a forum member.

4. Do you often make threats? Was that your MO as a member of the Panther BETA Team. Did you threaten the actual game coders and designers. So please, pretty please, report me. In your report state how exactly I'm preventing you from buying this game. Am I holding a gun and shouting if you buy the game, the dog/cat gets it. Or I'm hacking your details to divert your order.

5. You also claim to have been a Matrix beta since 2003. Why is this relevant or important. Does it mean that anyone who isn't a Matrix beta (whatever that actually represents) is barred from speaking in the presence of a Matrix beta. I will paraphrase the great words of Martin Luther King, that a man will be judged not by whether they are a Matrix beta or not, but by the quality of their contributions. So far, other than self promotion, I've seen no quality in your contributions.

6. Considering how often in your posts you are inviting the reader to infer you actually work in the computer game industry, doubtless because that would add a certain cachet to your explanations of the worth of games and computer programming, I find it very interesting that your membership details are silent on what your day job or even interests are. Could it be there is no substance behind your self promotion. Does this observation fall into the rude category for not being suitably obsequious to a Matrix beta since 2003.



The different after market map mods are neither better nor worse than the standard maps shipped with the game. What one individual finds more pleasing to the eye, another finds the same map displeasing. Some of them in fact make it harder to play the we.. But then you don't care about that because you haven't even bought the game yet so you can't really assess the standard maps with any of the after market maps.

What is clear to me is that your concern only extends to eye candy, which no true grognard attaches much weight in assessing the quality of a game. In fact what is becoming very clear to me is that your comments on logistics, and other Gary Grigsby games are at odds with your preoccupation with eye candy. There is an inconsistency with what you post and your likely ability as a player.

All this angst for a game it seems you are only interested in buying if sold in a sale at approximately $20. That sum of money won't even buy you a cocktail which would be consumed in a fraction of the time spent on reading the manual. Anyone who will only buy the game if it sells for $20 is a cheapskate. If you really cared about the company, if being a Matrix beta since 2003 really amounts to anything, you would just buy the game even if you lacked any intention of installing it onto your computer. Plenty of other members, who don't self promote as you do, have bought the game at full retail price even though the subject matter/game design did not appeal to them.

BTW, those whose day job is to actually design or code games, don't really have the time to play games of their competitors. They might, as market research or just to kill off unavoidable down time, look at/play competitors games but then, being professionals, they don't have to open threads seeking guidance. They do their own self discovery on the quiet.

Alfred

[Alfred]

ORIGINAL: MarkShot

.

Oh goody goody goody. He made a contribution. In a player Guide. Was your name included as an after thought, perhaps as a result of some threat on your behalf along the lines of post #4, you being both a Panther and Matrix Beta.

But of much more serious importance, how is having your name on a Player Guide for a completely different game, relevant to a thread on AE map mods. How does your "contribution" (whatever that actually entailed) stack up against what others have directly contributed to explaining AE.

All I can see is self promotion solely for the sake of it. Zero value added to this thread.

Alfred

Alfred

[Alfred]

ORIGINAL: Tanaka

ORIGINAL: MarkShot

Alfred,

I have been googling for hours to find this stuff and looking at the various files. ChemKid was listed as one of the best map makers, but is AWOL. Babes made maps that allowed reduction of stacking limits. The main difference between most of these files hex representations and borders versus topo or stylized. The stock has about 8 files and the extended maybe 50.

Alfred, I think that was rude. I know it's a pandemic, and that may have interrupted your therapy visits. But if you cannot contribute, then just move along please, and don't post in my threads.

Thank you. (The next I am going to report you to a moderator. Reason: discouraging customers from purchasing Matrix products.)

PS: I am a Matrix beta since around 2003.

ORIGINAL: Tanaka

ORIGINAL: Q-Ball

I was a tester on WITE-2, so I am very familiar with that one. It's a very good game, but it does not hold my attention like WITP-AE does.

This game is more complex, and has alot more strategy nuances, too much to possibly put here! It takes awhile to get knowledgeable, but if you're not afraid of PBEM there are newer players here

In general, a few things:

1. If you are hung-up on graphics, this is not your game. It's functional enough. If you like WITE-2, you'll be fine.
2. With 1-day turns, it's a big commitment; much more than WITE-2 with 1-week turns. Games are going to take years, literally
3. The forum is AWESOME for advice; you can post almost any question and it will get answered in detail. Use the SEARCH feature first, but acknowledge that it's not very effective all the time

I would take the plunge and buy it, you won't regret it as long as you understand the time commitment

3. Unfortunately have to disagree here. The forum has become a difficult place to ask ANY question even if you have searched the forum and manual. There are a lot of helpful people here but also difficult ones that will attack you just for asking a question. Be prepared to be chastised. I think it is because the forum and a lot of the players have been around for such a long time (We go back to PacWar, Uncommon Valor, and WITP) and everything has been discussed at some point you just have to weed through everything to find it. This can be difficult because there is so much out there. Oh and if you take a break for a few years be prepared to have to learn a lot of it all over again.

It is the biggest most complicated difficult game on the planet to learn and playing as the Japanese is a whole other level and game in itself (the economy) so you will have lots of questions. Try and find the answer yourself first but if you can't be prepared to defend your question. Like he said the search function can be difficult to use and not everything is perfectly specified in the manual and patch notes you need more player perspective/experience for a lot of things.

That being said DEFINITELY get this game. As Strategy Dojo also says in his series and I completely agree this is the best game ever made as so many here will attest and you will get a lifetime of game play. I do not think another game this great will ever be made again. I say it is the best game ever made because it was made by experts in every field that came together that will never come together again to make another game like it ever again. Truly a once in a lifetime accomplishment by an amazing team:

https://www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.asp?m=2173764

Now you know why I posted this. Welcome to Alfred's forum.

https://www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.asp?m=5094598

You really don't know when to stop digging when you are in a hole.

I suppose I should be chuffed that of the various posters who pointed out your deficiencies, you only focussed on me, who gave you the answer in my first post in that thread. Alas for you, you lack the competence to recognize an answer.

Alfred

[Alfred]

ORIGINAL: MarkShot

Tanaka,

Again thanks for the guidance.

The forums belong to the publisher. They exist to sell games and promote customer retention. Actions to the contrary require administration.

If you are neither an employee nor beta, then you are under no obligation to answer questions.

My posting here on topics and doing game tutorials was so extensive that two edited PDF volumes were made by Matrix and hosted by Matrix. Each volume was about 100 pages.

That was in the past as Matrix was sold by David Heath. But Erik is still here from the old days. These days Matrix is more of a retained brand name. The developer I was most involved with, Panther Games, decided to leave.

I used to play H2H even before the internet using a MODEM and Compuserve. I stopped in 1994 reaching the top of a USA national ladder. Mainly because many entrants were not interested in gaming, but the chance to degrade and humiliate others.

These days game expertise can be used to feed the psychotic tendencies of some individuals through forums such as these as you have noted. They avoid admin action under the cloak of being an expert. But it comes at the heavy cost of lost sales which for niche game such as this is very bad.

Tanaka, I am happy we met. My name is Mark.

More self promotion.


1. Still no explanation of what a Matrix Beta does.

A Matrix beta certainly isn't a forum moderator. We know who the AE moderators are and their avatar clearly identifies the relevant individual to be moderator. No such identification on your avatar.

Nor is a developer (design, coding, artwork, OOB research etc) of a game published by Matrix have Beta on their avatar. The many AE developers had no distinguishing mark on their avatar; they didn't feel the need for the extra publicity. The AE developers were clearly identified by the quality and nature of their posts over a period of many years. Plus their patching of the earlier classical WITP said enough. Other game developers do have a mark on their avatar but they don't repeat ad nauseam, hey look at me I'm important.


2. Nor how does one achieve Matrix Beta status.

Seems to me all that one has to do to reach this status is to sign up as a beta tester of a Matrix published game. That entails signing a Non Disclosure Agreement. Not much more in the way of any relevant experience or qualifications is needed.

We know for a fact, MarkShot was not a beta tester for AE. How many other Matrix published games has he also not been a beta tester for. That being the factual case, is he really entitled to claim to be a Matrix Beta since 2003 (see post #4) for that strongly implies he has been a beta tester on all games published by Matrix since 2003. An interesting legal question thereby arises whether in certain jurisdictions he has broken the law by deliberately misrepresenting himself.


3. Nor what are the rewards.

Clearly being a Matrix beta is not considered by the company to mean they are a staff member. Matrix Staff Members receive remuneration from the company, as well as being clearly recognised as such on their avatar. To the best of my knowledge, there is no remuneration paid to game beta testers, unless one is to argue that the early game playing experience together with perhaps a free copy of the game (which they get anyway else they can't do their testing) constitutes proper remuneration from Matrix. Good luck arguing that position in a court of law.


4. psychotic tendencies

A very thinly disguised dig at me. Obviously, coming from a Matrix Beta since 2003, directed at one who isn't, it can't be categorised as being rude. Oh no of course not.

Yet one has the thought, is MarkShot qualified to make such a diagnosis, I mean where did he study, where is he registered to practice, and what exactly is the evidence the diagnosis is based on. Or is it all just a case of self displacement onto others, what the layman would call, "it takes one to know one".


Overall, another lengthy post whose only discernible value seems to lie in impressing the rest of us. Still nothing relevant for the subject matter of this thread or AE in general.

Alfred

[Alfred]

ORIGINAL: Tanaka


...Could not agree more. And you as well. Glad to have another Matrix vet around here especially one that has been so involved in past games. Hope you don't let the negativity run you off. Don't be afraid to ask questions! Cheers!

So easily gullible. It goes a long way to explaining the nature of your AE forum posts.

Alfred

[RangerJoe]

ORIGINAL: Alfred

ORIGINAL: MarkShot

Tanaka,

Again thanks for the guidance.

The forums belong to the publisher. They exist to sell games and promote customer retention. Actions to the contrary require administration.

If you are neither an employee nor beta, then you are under no obligation to answer questions.

My posting here on topics and doing game tutorials was so extensive that two edited PDF volumes were made by Matrix and hosted by Matrix. Each volume was about 100 pages.

That was in the past as Matrix was sold by David Heath. But Erik is still here from the old days. These days Matrix is more of a retained brand name. The developer I was most involved with, Panther Games, decided to leave.

I used to play H2H even before the internet using a MODEM and Compuserve. I stopped in 1994 reaching the top of a USA national ladder. Mainly because many entrants were not interested in gaming, but the chance to degrade and humiliate others.

These days game expertise can be used to feed the psychotic tendencies of some individuals through forums such as these as you have noted. They avoid admin action under the cloak of being an expert. But it comes at the heavy cost of lost sales which for niche game such as this is very bad.

Tanaka, I am happy we met. My name is Mark.

More self promotion.


1. Still no explanation of what a Matrix Beta does.

A Matrix beta certainly isn't a forum moderator. We know who the AE moderators are and their avatar clearly identifies the relevant individual to be moderator. No such identification on your avatar.

Nor is a developer (design, coding, artwork, OOB research etc) of a game published by Matrix have Beta on their avatar. The many AE developers had no distinguishing mark on their avatar; they didn't feel the need for the extra publicity. The AE developers were clearly identified by the quality and nature of their posts over a period of many years. Plus their patching of the earlier classical WITP said enough. Other game developers do have a mark on their avatar but they don't repeat ad nauseam, hey look at me I'm important.


2. Nor how does one achieve Matrix Beta status.

Seems to me all that one has to do to reach this status is to sign up as a beta tester of a Matrix published game. That entails signing a Non Disclosure Agreement. Not much more in the way of any relevant experience or qualifications is needed.

We know for a fact, MarkShot was not a beta tester for AE. How many other Matrix published games has he also not been a beta tester for. That being the factual case, is he really entitled to claim to be a Matrix Beta since 2003 (see post #4) for that strongly implies he has been a beta tester on all games published by Matrix since 2003. An interesting legal question thereby arises whether in certain jurisdictions he has broken the law by deliberately misrepresenting himself.


3. Nor what are the rewards.

Clearly being a Matrix beta is not considered by the company to mean they are a staff member. Matrix Staff Members receive remuneration from the company, as well as being clearly recognised as such on their avatar. To the best of my knowledge, there is no remuneration paid to game beta testers, unless one is to argue that the early game playing experience together with perhaps a free copy of the game (which they get anyway else they can't do their testing) constitutes proper remuneration from Matrix. Good luck arguing that position in a court of law.


4. psychotic tendencies

A very thinly disguised dig at me. Obviously, coming from a Matrix Beta since 2003, directed at one who isn't, it can't be categorised as being rude. Oh no of course not.

Yet one has the thought, is MarkShot qualified to make such a diagnosis, I mean where did he study, where is he registered to practice, and what exactly is the evidence the diagnosis is based on. Or is it all just a case of self displacement onto others, what the layman would call, "it takes one to know one".


Overall, another lengthy post whose only discernible value seems to lie in impressing the rest of us. Still nothing relevant for the subject matter of this thread or AE in general.

Alfred

Thank you Alfred. I recognize your knowledge and value to this forum and I thank you for your many contributions.

Where is Nemo when he could be useful for something like this?

[Alfred]

ORIGINAL: MarkShot

Well, I didn't post anyone's work. Just simply found it as a result of searching and downloaded for myself. (Also, any legal issues depend on where the owner {not creator} of those files is domociled, where the actual server is located, and where was I when I downloaded. And are the hosted files simply on a storage service, or is the service a publisher. No one is going to litigate this unless we are talking some serious $$$.)

The topo and Yamamoto stuff was quite nice, and the various HEX handling was innovative.

---

Actually, I am in such a situation now. David Heath former owner of Matrix, and Dave O'Connor owner/developer of Panther Games (now published by Lock and Load) are selling the new iteration of RDOA/HTTR/COTA/BFTB/CO1 as CO2. I have a ton of content which I created here for the prior games which would still be of use to players.

But technically, it is the property of Matrix games. Sadly, I cannot make it available to the public as there are potential legal issues. Oh, well ...

---

A rather simplistic, and not necessarily accurate representation of the legal position.

I wonder just how far your legal exposition would be supported by lawyers who have produced AE mods. Specifically thinking of the DaBabes family headed by a patent attorney partner, or IanR (sorry Ian I don't know your field of legal specialisation) with his campaign mod which continues until the end of the 1940s.

It does however provide an excellent fig leaf to avoid having your work exposed to public scrutiny.

Alfred

[Alfred]

ORIGINAL: MarkShot

Then, he can ban me and continue his policy of hurting sales. As an employee or beta, you have a fiduciary responsibility. Read the beta agreement. See what happens to you as a beta if you leak an internal memo that HOI4 is better than the GG series for the following reasons …

You may say that as a customer. But being an employee or beta is not a democracy in the USA; maybe the UK?

Ah, confirmation you have no legal qualifications.

"Fiduciary responsibility", one of those legal terms much misunderstood by non lawyers.

Alfred

[Trugrit]

Alfred,

I think we should give him a little slack.

He is obviously intimidated by joining the forum since most of us know so much
more about the game than he does. That is why he feels he needs to puff himself up.

He should have left his credentials at home.
He didn’t need to post a full page ad so everyone would be impressed by who he is.

I don’t care if he is a Beta, Alpha, Omega, Phi Beta Kappa, head of his class
Or master of the war-gaming universe. It does not matter to me.

Ian should have curbed his nihilism.

And…….You did slap him pretty hard out of the box.

I agree that sometimes you are very rude and you should really try and control yourself before
you begin to frighten young children on the street for not having a game manual.

You did not discourage him from buying this game or Matrix products.
I don’t think he can site anyone who does not buy Matrix products
Because they were scared off by you. That would be a very timid war-gamer.

I don’t want to see you run off the forum if I have anything to say about it
and I do have something to say about it even if I’m a nobody.

You have helped hundreds of WITP-AE players understand this game over the past ten years.
So far he has helped zero, none, nada players with this game.
But….we should give him a chance.

I also don’t want to see him go crying to mama Matrix every time you hurt his feelings.
We have a very good moderator on this forum and he does not need any help.

He did not make a great start on the forum but I think that will improve with time when he gets
more confident with the game.

We should help him along and welcome him to a small pond.

Tanaka maybe a different case.

I think he has trouble reading for comprehension.
That is not an unusual problem with some people.

I had a very good friend who failed several grades in school because while he
could read he just could not understand what he was reading.
That has got to be frustrating.

This game takes a lot of reading.

[Alfred]

ORIGINAL: RangerJoe


...Where is Nemo when he could be useful for something like this?

Actually, you don't have to pine for Nemo. Mind_messing is possibly just as qualified. Whether he views it as being worthwhile to come in is a different matter. Frankly I don't see why he or anyone else similarly qualified (and there may well be other AE forumites) would bother wasting their time. Me, well being the victim of several ad hominem attacks in this thread, especially as I have a finely tuned radar for BS. And no, BS doesn't stand for Bachelor of Science.[:)]

Alfred

[RangerJoe]

ORIGINAL: Alfred

ORIGINAL: RangerJoe


...Where is Nemo when he could be useful for something like this?

Actually, you don't have to pine for Nemo. Mind_messing is possibly just as qualified. Whether he views it as being worthwhile to come in is a different matter. Frankly I don't see why he or anyone else similarly qualified (and there may well be other AE forumites) would bother wasting their time. Me, well being the victim of several ad hominem attacks in this thread, especially as I have a finely tuned radar for BS. And no, BS doesn't stand for Bachelor of Science.[:)]

Alfred

There is the BS degree, then there is the More S degree, then the Pile it Higher and Deeper degree. I know someone who got an EdD degree instead of the Pile it Higher and Deeper degree because he said that he would not learn anything new.

I did not know Mind_messings qualifications. Maybe I should stay away from him [;)] so he does not analyze me too much . . . [8D]

[mind_messing]

ORIGINAL: Alfred

ORIGINAL: RangerJoe


...Where is Nemo when he could be useful for something like this?

Actually, you don't have to pine for Nemo. Mind_messing is possibly just as qualified. Whether he views it as being worthwhile to come in is a different matter. Frankly I don't see why he or anyone else similarly qualified (and there may well be other AE forumites) would bother wasting their time. Me, well being the victim of several ad hominem attacks in this thread, especially as I have a finely tuned radar for BS. And no, BS doesn't stand for Bachelor of Science.[:)]

Alfred

Unfortunately not - Nemo's domain was clinical in nature, if I recall correctly, and working with groups with particularly complex needs.

That said, one does not need to be a fully qualified psychiatrist (with bells, whistles and all) in order to be able to form a hypothesis or two. There's been a fair degree of confirmation bias on the forum recently.

Also on show is the old authority argument. I am a "Matrix beta" (whatever that is), with the implication that it carries some weight.

ORIGINAL: RangerJoe

I did not know Mind_messings qualifications. Maybe I should stay away from him [;)] so he does not analyze me too much . . . [8D]

I wouldn't worry too much - analysis of behaviour in the digital space is vastly different from the real world. Completely different rules of engagement - for one the digital space rarely has substantial consequences, and there is often the comfort of anonymity. Less so in real life.

There is a whole literature around the stark difference in online (mis)behaviour generally (but particularly by males towards females) from what would be expected from actual face-to-face interaction.

[Admiral DadMan]

Ok, everyone out of the pool.

[Erik Rutins]

Alfred,

Your initial reply was in fact rude. Mark did respond with an ad hominem, which made things worse, but instead of trying to find a way to make peace you then followed up with a series of ad hominem rant posts, the result of which was in fact to drive an old wargamer who was just about to get into WITP-AE completely away from the game and the forum. This thread was reported for moderation and our goal in this forum is to be a friendly and civil community that encourages new players and does not drive them away.

As he who cast the first stone here and followed it up with a bucket of rocks, you've got a one week vacation from the forum to think over how to follow the forum rules. Be civil and aim for de-escalation rather than the other way around.

Regards,

- Erik