Japanese Aircraft Research

[smpicciano]

First time through as Japan, and I have a few questions about Japanese research:

1. When starting research on the Rufe and moving to the A6M8, do you move to the A6M5 when all factories for the Rufe are repaired (30 out of 30) or after research is 100% (which moves it up one month)?

2. When do you switch to the A6M5b? One day later or after it's research reaches 100%(which moves it up one month)?

Many thanks in advance for any assistance.

[Chris21wen]

You should have one days grace after research reach 100% indicated by the a/c going blue in the list. Due to some game quirk sometimes this does not happen and I think from what I've read this is down to any engine bonus. The advice is to change before the figure reaches 100%.

Looks like you have more than one factory researching the Rufe. If you have multiple factories researching one a/c type then if one switches to production they all switch.

Like production, changing an a/c to its natural successor, i.e. Rufe to A6M5, cost nothing in terms of factory repair. Changing to an a/c that is NOT, even one in the same family (e.g. Rufe to A6M5b), puts the repair back to zero plus reduces the number by approx a third. It's not the research % that controls how quickly you get an a/c from research to production but the repair time to fully repaired, which takes longer the further away the a/c is due. Putting the two together then it's counter productive switching a fully repaired factor to anything other than it's natural upgrade.

[smpicciano]

Thanks, Chris.

[Schatten]

However dont use to much research for the Zeros. They not really good Planes, only reason to have them that they your only carrier capable fighters.
You want Georges for Navy and Franks for Army Fighter Squadrons, thats the only -well in every area and also good to shooting down 4E- Japanese Fighters that you can get early 43.

[smpicciano]

Thanks for your input Schatten.

[Uncivil Engineer]

First time through as Japan, and I have a few questions about Japanese research:

1. When starting research on the Rufe and moving to the A6M8, do you move to the A6M5 when all factories for the Rufe are repaired (30 out of 30) or after research is 100% (which moves it up one month)?

2. When do you switch to the A6M5b? One day later or after it's research reaches 100%(which moves it up one month)?

Many thanks in advance for any assistance.

Like many other things in the game - it depends.

You're not likely to move the Rufe forward a month so there is no particular reason to keep researching it after it reaches 30(0). But you'll want to complete at least one R&D site to put it into production. The A6M5 is next after Rufe; the R&D sites will be undamaged when you change. I skip the A6M5b and go to the A6M5c for the armor and better gun (it's only a few months later). BUT you MUST upgrade the A6M5 to A6M5b, then the A6M5b to A6M5c or the research will go back to 0(30), or some other number. You can do both upgrades the same day. WHEN you do this depends on how fast you want the A6M5 and how many. I research Rufe at 7 R&D sites, then change 6 to A6M5, which becomes available BEFORE A6M3 and A6M3a, which can be ignored. If you want to build 90 A6M5 per month then 3 can be changed. I'm not sure you want to bother with the A6M8 because by then you should have A7M2 Sam.

I'm sure there are other opinions out there.

[RangerJoe]

First time through as Japan, and I have a few questions about Japanese research:

1. When starting research on the Rufe and moving to the A6M8, do you move to the A6M5 when all factories for the Rufe are repaired (30 out of 30) or after research is 100% (which moves it up one month)?

2. When do you switch to the A6M5b? One day later or after it's research reaches 100%(which moves it up one month)?

Many thanks in advance for any assistance.

Like many other things in the game - it depends.

You're not likely to move the Rufe forward a month so there is no particular reason to keep researching it after it reaches 30(0). But you'll want to complete at least one R&D site to put it into production. The A6M5 is next after Rufe; the R&D sites will be undamaged when you change. I skip the A6M5b and go to the A6M5c for the armor and better gun (it's only a few months later). BUT you MUST upgrade the A6M5 to A6M5b, then the A6M5b to A6M5c or the research will go back to 0(30), or some other number. You can do both upgrades the same day. WHEN you do this depends on how fast you want the A6M5 and how many. I research Rufe at 7 R&D sites, then change 6 to A6M5, which becomes available BEFORE A6M3 and A6M3a, which can be ignored. If you want to build 90 A6M5 per month then 3 can be changed. I'm not sure you want to bother with the A6M8 because by then you should have A7M2 Sam.

I'm sure there are other opinions out there.

You can also switch a production factory to produce Rufes if you are using the rule against switching between production and research factories. This would keep the maximum number of Research Factories available farther into the game.

But check the research paths in the game if you are playing a mod because some paths may have been modified from their original path in the original Scenario 1.

But I would also move most of the factories to the next model if you are getting close and if you are willing to wait for the next month when it would produce or if it will start producing before you can complete a month's research.

Engine bonus is important as well as the expected use of the specific engine for production of aircraft. It may be better, depending upon PDU ON or PDU OFF, to concentrate on fewer models of aircraft that use common engines. But in that case, aircraft like the Tony have a problem with many types using a unique engine before getting to the Ki-100 Tony which uses a common engine.

[Chris21wen]

I've never tried the Rufe approach as suggested above. Here's what I did in my last game.

First you only have one (56) factory producing carrier fighter (A6M2) at the start you'll need more by the end of 42. You can change a factory that is already producing something but that something is likely to be needed. Japan is limited that way at the start.

My idea is to upgrade one of the research factory as quickly as possible producing 90 total A6**. When I first worked this out I did not know which, the M3a or M5. The A3 can be ignored it's not carrier capable.

Of the two types there's little difference, the M3a has greater range and maneuver, the M5 has better speed and durablity but the way the game plays probably the later. But is it quicker to research directly to the M5 or go through the M3a. Here's the figures from my last game.

I researched only on 1 Rufe factory which arrived in Apr 42 its due date I set it to produce as you need some Rufes but not many. With one factory I did not expect it to advance. I allowed it to upgrade to the M5 when it came online in Nov 42 (See below).

I did not set any factory to research the M5 I went for the M3a (Dec 42), setting six factories (30) to research. It arrived Sept 42 three months ahead of schedule. None went into production all to researching the M5 (Aug 43) which arrived Nov 42 nine months ahead.

One very rough calculation here, thee fully repaired research factories (30) will advance a due date by one month ever month so you can guestimated when you will get something. Three factories halfing the time from full repaired to due, with six it's quartered.

If you keep researching each upgrade in sussession, the M5b (Jun 44) arrives approx Aug 43, M5c (Oct 44) - Feb 44 and M8 (Aug 45) - Nov 44.

I do not know how quickly you will get the M8 if you were to set the six factories to research it due to the random nature of repair all-be-it repair gets quicker the closer you are to the due date. I can give you a comparison using the George N1K1-J (Sep 43). Using 6 factories as before this ac had not arrived by Jan 43 but don't know when it did as I stopped recording data then and I no longer have a save.

Take what you will out of this but to be it appears quicker to go through the chain.

[smpicciano]

Many thanks for your input fellows... very helpful

[RangerJoe]

Don't go higher than size 30 for your Research factory, the returns become sub optimal after that. If you have 500+ engines for that airplane that you are researching, each research factory will use ONE engine but will give another research point. The research factory will never use two engines even if the factory is larger than 30 and you get another research point out of the extra. The factory will also never use more engines for multi-engine aircraft either.

So 5 fully repaired size 30 research factories will yield 150 research points per month, moving production forward by one and a half months per month. With the engine bonus, the factories will produce 300 research points per month, moving production forward per month. So if there are multiple factories researching various models along the research path, to get all of the aircraft except for possibly the first one sooner, it is optimal to have all research factories assign to that line researching the first model, then moving to the next model either when complete or when the next model is close to being produced. They do not all have to switch to a different model at the same time but if you have 5 factories researching and are 92/100 in research before production, move one factory to the next model so that it will not go into production unless that is what you want.

As far as the A6M2 production, many players expand the original factory to size 120. Engine factory production needs to be increased to keep up with production as well as accumulating the 500+ engines for the research engine bonus if you want that. Use the same process and thinking about all other aircraft needed.

Another thing to point out, if you already have the engines for an aircraft type that can be used for training purposes as well as action against undefended Chinese position, by all means continue to produce those aircraft. Think Nates plus the single engine Army bombers. The HI cost is then half of producing a more modern aircraft which will become obsolete later anyway.

Also, since there are engines for the B5N1, you might want to switch a factory to build those airframes, then let the factory upgrade to the B5N2 airframe when those engines run out.

As always, look for the most efficient means to get the job done. Research for PDU ON and PDU OFF games may be drastically different since the air units are much more limited in airplane usage in PDU OFF. In PDU ON, you can concentrate on the fewer and better airplanes for your air units. The Allies don't have that option in increasing production in either situation so the Japanese can have the advantage in an attritional defensive air war.

Be careful about industry expansion, including engine production since that can cost a lot of supplies and you can run out! You can pause expansion if it appears that continuing to expand your industry will hurt your expansion and defensive preparations for the inevitable counter attack. It may be best only to expand certain things up to 10 industrial points at a time. Use the expansion on the industry tab on the top of the page and not at the base industry on the map.

[smpicciano]

Thanks again Joe, a lot to think about.

[RangerJoe]

Thanks again Joe, a lot to think about.

You are most welcome.

This AAR has a lot on the Japanese economy and his previous one did as well:

https://www.matrixgames.com/forums/view ... 5&t=371686

[smpicciano]

RangerJoe,

Thanks again. The AAR is helpful. However, one thing I am not able to find is a good source for how to spend you PP as Japan. I already bought out of the LCU recommended in the tracker. So what to spend pp on next? I know I can spend PP on replacing leaders but feel at this point I would rather spend it on other things.

Long-range bombers in Manchuria?

LCU in Manchuria?

LCU in Japan?

Any specific recommendations or additional sources would be much appreciated.

[Nomad]

RangerJoe,

Thanks again. The AAR is helpful. However, one thing I am not able to find is a good source for how to spend you PP as Japan. I already bought out of the LCU recommended in the tracker. So what to spend pp on next? I know I can spend PP on replacing leaders but feel at this point I would rather spend it on other things.

Long-range bombers in Manchuria?

LCU in Manchuria?

LCU in Japan?

Any specific recommendations or additional sources would be much appreciated.

Replacing bad leaders should be high on the list of things to use PPs for

[RangerJoe]

RangerJoe,

Thanks again. The AAR is helpful. However, one thing I am not able to find is a good source for how to spend you PP as Japan. I already bought out of the LCU recommended in the tracker. So what to spend pp on next? I know I can spend PP on replacing leaders but feel at this point I would rather spend it on other things.

Long-range bombers in Manchuria?

LCU in Manchuria?

LCU in Japan?

Any specific recommendations or additional sources would be much appreciated.

Replacing bad leaders should be high on the list of things to use PPs for

You are most welcome.

for the point of attack as well as rebuilding a unit, yes. But not for a garrison in the rear areas.

Buy out armour, artillery, and engineer units in Manchuria as needed. Buy out divisions, one third of a time if you have to do it that way. But don't let one part upgrade while the other parts don't upgrade because they can't combine.

Buy out units when they first come in with disablements as well as needing replacements because they are cheaper.

Definitely make sure that your ships have good leaders, as well as your air units. Air units in training need different qualifications that combat air units.

But how players spent their PPs are inbedded in their AARs if they mention it.