Attacking incorrectly with Flight-plan issue

[ReimuHakurei]

I set a land strike flight plan,but the attacking group didn't execute the plan right.
here's my test scenario.

TEST X.7z

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First look at the contrast attacking group made up of 2 B-1Bs.
They were assigned to a land strike mission manually by event trigger.
Everthing went right with all 48 AGM-158Bs out.

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Then came the problem group "Flight bird39" which made up of another 2 B-1Bs executing strike mission as flight plan.
"Flight bird39" arrived at Wpn Lncp point,but they just launched only 8 AGM-158s by only one bomber,the other one just watching and doing nothing.
After that,they kept heading towards targets when they should RTB,the same problem went to the B-52 group behind too.
When "Flight bird39" approached targets,they launched another wave with 5 more AGM-158Bs.It seems that they were evaluating and deciding whether continue attacking.

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When attacking groups flew over targets,they didn't attack nor RTB but just circle around.



Actually,this issue also shows in MDSP tutorials.
F-15Es strike targets.The leader fighter drops all 4 JDAMS and RTB,with other 2or3 fighters still heading towards targets and circling around.You may have a try.

[ReimuHakurei]

When attacking groups flew over targets,they didn't attack nor RTB but just circle around.

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[DWReese]

I often experience the same thing. I believe that it has to do with "assigned missile (weapon) saturation", or something along those lines.

For example, four planes approach a target, and the target will usually take two bombs to kill it. The first two planes drop their load, and the third plane is about to fly over but it won't drop its bomb because TWO BOMBS (saturation) has already been reached. The third plane flies over. One of the first two bombs misses, so the fourth plane drops its bomb because it takes two to destroy the target. This leaves the third plane in limbo. Sometimes the target is destroyed and the plane doesn't know what to do; sometimes the target is almost destroyed, and the plane refuses to attack further; sometimes it hangs around (as you mentioned). I sincerely believe that it has to do with he number of weapons assigned and the saturation level.

I tries staggering the release, and that works sometimes, but it also allows the enemy to reload weapons that they might not have been otherwise able to do. So, it's like 6 one way, or half a dozen the other.

I continue to play around with it, but I sincerely believe that something within the attack design programming is causing it. The programming is good, but just not in this specific case. You wouldn't want a group of four planes to drop 4 bombs each on the target, only to see that the first two dropped already killed the target. That would be a real waste.

So, who knows what's really going on behind the curtain? <lol>

[ReimuHakurei]

I often experience the same thing. I believe that it has to do with "assigned missile (weapon) saturation", or something along those lines.

For example, four planes approach a target, and the target will usually take two bombs to kill it. The first two planes drop their load, and the third plane is about to fly over but it won't drop its bomb because TWO BOMBS (saturation) has already been reached. The third plane flies over. One of the first two bombs misses, so the fourth plane drops its bomb because it takes two to destroy the target. This leaves the third plane in limbo. Sometimes the target is destroyed and the plane doesn't know what to do; sometimes the target is almost destroyed, and the plane refuses to attack further; sometimes it hangs around (as you mentioned). I sincerely believe that it has to do with he number of weapons assigned and the saturation level.

I tries staggering the release, and that works sometimes, but it also allows the enemy to reload weapons that they might not have been otherwise able to do. So, it's like 6 one way, or half a dozen the other.

I continue to play around with it, but I sincerely believe that something within the attack design programming is causing it. The programming is good, but just not in this specific case. You wouldn't want a group of four planes to drop 4 bombs each on the target, only to see that the first two dropped already killed the target. That would be a real waste.

So, who knows what's really going on behind the curtain? <lol>

I agree with the saturation attack situation you mentioned,I've considered about it when i tried out the MDSP tutorials.There actually will be some Recon units, ELINT units or attack groups themselves to do targets damage evaluating for the next supplementary attack.

But in my scenario,40+ units have been assigned as targets,only less than 10 out of 48 missiles launched,so i don't think it should be considered as saturation attack issue.Even if waiting for next supplementary attack,the groups should hold the attack position instead of heading towards targets which is dangerous especially for bombers.The contrast group which I mentioned in this topic thread acted normally with all missiles out.

So I think maybe there's still something improperly with the attack design programming to be fixed.

[thewood1]

I think the issue here is that WRA on the first flight is filling all the slots for weapons to be launched. The following flights just follow the flight path in because there is no weapon launch point due to WRA and they still have weapons. Once the first flight's weapons hit, that following flight launches weapons. If they still are waiting on weapon hits, they'll continue on to the target. If they get too close to the target minimum launch range comes into play that prohibits launches. So the attacking flight just circles. The only workaround is spacing the flights out to let the first volley of missiles hit. Then the following flight will launch weapons.

The only solution I see is having the follow on flights circle at the launch point until the WRA slots aren't full. But it might get very complicated with mixed weapon flights and sorties.

[ReimuHakurei]

I think the issue here is that WRA on the first flight is filling all the slots for weapons to be launched. The following flights just follow the flight path in because there is no weapon launch point due to WRA and they still have weapons. Once the first flight's weapons hit, that following flight launches weapons. If they still are waiting on weapon hits, they'll continue on to the target. If they get too close to the target minimum launch range comes into play that prohibits launches. So the attacking flight just circles. The only workaround is spacing the flights out to let the first volley of missiles hit. Then the following flight will launch weapons.

The only solution I see is having the follow on flights circle at the launch point until the WRA slots aren't full. But it might get very complicated with mixed weapon flights and sorties.

I think the issue is not just the WRA settings.As you can see two groups in contrast here,the airfield to be striken contains 46 targets totally,first group lanuches all 48 AGM-158s then RTB,but the second group just launches 10 out of 48 totally AGM-158s that only come from the leader bomber.According to my WRA setting which is 2 rnds for 1 land contact,the quantity isn't even enough to fill actually.

Also as I said,there should be a target damage evaluating unit such as Recon or AEW in reality,I think flightplan in that situation should be programmed to hold position waiting for next order,or just RTB as the flightplan created instead of heading to targets.

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[DaveFromCTX]

On top of the WRA issue, which is frustrating on its own - it's one thing for aircraft not to engage but to continue to fly towards a target with standoff weapons only to get shot down is even more frustrating.

I raised the issue a few weeks ago and despite the title of the post, it is not been fixed. https://www.matrixgames.com/forums/view ... 0&t=392449

You can set your ignore plotted course to know at the unit, flight plan (weapon target), flight, mission, side level -- it will still overwrite each time as soon as it reaches the "weapon target" point.

I even made a video showing the unit doctrines switching from no to yes at the exact point when it started launching weapons. It was actually a similar scenario with b1s using agm158c to attack an enemy ship.

NOTE: I eventually gave up and just had the mission set to deactivate a few minutes after the flight plan said the weapon Target point would be reached

[ReimuHakurei]

On top of the WRA issue, which is frustrating on its own - it's one thing for aircraft not to engage but to continue to fly towards a target with standoff weapons only to get shot down is even more frustrating.

I raised the issue a few weeks ago and despite the title of the post, it is not been fixed. https://www.matrixgames.com/forums/view ... 0&t=392449

You can set your ignore plotted course to know at the unit, flight plan (weapon target), flight, mission, side level -- it will still overwrite each time as soon as it reaches the "weapon target" point.

I even made a video showing the unit doctrines switching from no to yes at the exact point when it started launching weapons. It was actually a similar scenario with b1s using agm158c to attack an enemy ship.

NOTE: I eventually gave up and just had the mission set to deactivate a few minutes after the flight plan said the weapon Target point would be reached

Yes,I read your thread days ago,then I tried many times in different situations by different settings as they said the issue been fixed,but now I believe that the issue still exits to be fixed.

[Dimitris]

Logged #15040

[Deserere]

Hi ReimuHakurei,
I tested your first scenario, the behaviour you are describing is a consequence of the WRA set to "Missile defence value", once you set it to a value like "Use all weapons" or a specific number you will see that the right weapon quantity is fired.