Logistics Systems and WitE-2 vs WitP-AE

[BadInfluence]

Been reviewing the Matrix forum threads from over the years trying to decide what Grigsby monster game I should focus on. I want the logistical system of a game to have a big impact on what is and is not an effective strategy. The opinion from about 5 years ago seemed to be that WitP-AE was a much more production/logistics focused game than WitE-1. A game that rewarded exemplary logistical gameplay. Having played a little of WitP-AE and a lot of WitE-1 I can agree with that.

Recently picked up WitE-2 and see it has made enhancements to the logistics part of the game. Fleshing out the highly abstracted logistics system from WitE-1 and giving the player some more granular control. Things like the addition of being able to build depots in specific locations and set their prioritization which give greater control over how supplies will flow throughout a network. If I primarily want to focus on logistical gameplay is WitP-AE still considered to have a better set of systems than the enhanced WitE-2? If say I'd rank WitP-AE as a 10 and WitE-1 as a 3 when it comes to rewarding logistical gameplay where would you rank WitE-2?

I understand this is all personal preference and my rankings of WitP-AE vs WitE-1 may not be your rankings. That said I'd still like to get feedback on where you think the updated WitE-2 stands in relation to WitP-AE.

[K62_]

While my expertise leans more towards WitE2 rather than WitP-AE, I'd be glad to share my thoughts on this topic.

When we look at the intricacies of the logistics system, WitP-AE undoubtedly takes the crown. It involves managing a vast array of ships, each differing in speed and capacity, and carrying various cargo types. There's the added complexity of ammunition reloading (including torpedoes and mines) and ship repairs, plus considerations for port capacity, engineer and naval support allocation, and the need to evade enemy submarines and LBA. It's a bit of a challenge to master, but once you do and if all goes according to plan, you can anticipate a predictable outcome, like receiving 12,000 tons of fuel in a certain port within a 8-day period.

On the other hand, WitE2 presents a simpler but more unpredictable system. It only deals with one type of cargo that morphs into whatever is required at the destination. Freight automatically moves along repaired rails (with a bit through ships and airplanes), reaching your depots based on their priority. Depots located farther away receive less freight. While it's easier to handle, the unpredictability means you can't easily estimate the exact tonnage a depot will receive next turn. But over time, you'll develop a feel for it, for instance, if you set both depots to priority 4, Minsk might receive around 5000 tons per week in October '41, while Vyazma might get around 1000 tons.

Both games share similarities in certain logistic aspects. Air transport operates similarly in both, and the process of supplying units from depots is roughly the same. WitE2 does have a slight edge in road supply with improved reports and the simulation of truck usage and loss.

The real game-changer, in my view, is how logistics impacts gameplay in WitE2. In WitP-AE, most task forces can function over long distances, can be replenished by other task forces, and they maintain their speed and combat efficiency for a while regardless of the nearest well-supplied port. However, in WitE2, even a small increase in distance to the closest depot can have significant consequences. You'll receive less supply, consume more trucks, and this effect will rapidly accumulate from one week to another and exert a major effect all your operations. It's essential to strike a perfect balance between your rate of advance and logistical capacity to avoid major disruptions to your offensive operations. Small optimizations of your logistical operations, such as making somewhat better use of air transport, can have a significant and even occasionally decisive impact at the spearhead of your advance.

So, if we're scoring, I'd give WitE2 a 7/10 for the complexity of the logistical system compared to WitP-AE, but I'd also rate WitE2 10/10 and WitP-AE 7/10 for the influence of logistics on gameplay.

[MarkShot]

I am somewhat familiar with both.

Logistics are great in both.

But I think you will find:

* The tools for understanding what is going on are built-in in WITE-2. Go to WITP-AE forum, and you will see about 3-4 third party tools. This is because the built in analytics are not as good as GG's later work.

* The WITP-AE AI is scripted and WITE-2 is more dynamic. For me, I would rather not invest learning a vast game that is scripted. Of course, a turn is a day ... so, you may not get many GCs in during your lifetime anyway.

[BadInfluence]

Very elucidating. Thanks K62 and MarkShot for your responses. The logistics system in WitE-2 sounds crunchy enough to be satisfying while not being excessively chewy (aka micro-management drudgery) which WitP-AE can be. Especially interested in hearing the logistics in WitE-2 can have more of an affect on outcome than in WitP-AE. Its dynamic (and therefore uncertain) nature will also reward building a resilient supply network instead of a highly optimized one. Just one more thing to keep you on your feet as you try to design and implement your strategy.