Where the Iron Crosses Grow: K62 (Axis) vs Veterin (Soviet) GC41

[K62]

This is an AAR thread for a new GC41 game that Veterin and I have started.

I intend to keep most updates three turns behind the actual game. All are welcome to read and comment!

Game settings and house rules:

• Open TBs

• No temporary motorization

• No paradrops

• No naval invasions more than 10 hexes from a friendly, non-isolated hex

• No airfield bombing after T1

[K62]

I have implemented some big changes to my standard T1 opening. Many thanks to Veterin for his patience as I've never taken this long on a single turn before! So far I am happy with the results... but we will see whether my opponent manages to wreck this beautiful new opening

The first turn just got submitted. In the interest of opsec, I will only post information available to both sides for now. (Further details will be added once we're on T4 or so.)

Here is the Axis advance in the south, center and north:

converted hexes south.png (1.98 MiB) Viewed 4243 times

converted hexes center.png (2.34 MiB) Viewed 4243 times

converted hexes north.png (2.57 MiB) Viewed 4243 times

[K62]

I went all out for killing Soviet planes. I know... it doesn't really make a big difference. And HLYA will hate my fighter losses. (Or maybe love them, since he's playing a lot of Soviets now )

So I've also spent a crazy amount of time tracking down Soviet air groups to hunt them better. And routed several divisions out of the Minsk pocket in order to overrun airfields.

But I really had to see whether 7000 air losses was possible

loss air.png (472.29 KiB) Viewed 4237 times

loss ground.png (324.51 KiB) Viewed 4237 times

oob.png (407.11 KiB) Viewed 4237 times

[jasonbroomer]

I went all out for killing Soviet planes. I know... it doesn't really make a big difference. And HLYA will hate my fighter losses. (Or maybe love them, since he's playing a lot of Soviets now )

So I've also spent a crazy amount of time tracking down Soviet air groups to hunt them better. And routed several divisions out of the Minsk pocket in order to overrun airfields.

But I really had to see whether 7000 air losses was possible

loss air.png

loss ground.png

oob.png

A 20:1 kill ratio is always going to work. An impressive haul!

[Nikel]

But those aircraft losses are too high, are they not?

[HardLuckYetAgain]

But those aircraft losses are too high, are they not?

With open TB's it really does not matter at all how many either side will lose. At least in my opinion. Can easily replace from other theaters to fill in any gap.

Wresting the Air from the Germans with Open TB is extremely difficult. It can be done but you better know what you are doing.

[Nikel]

I meant, compared with historical data for the first week of the war.

[HardLuckYetAgain]

I meant, compared with historical data for the first week of the war.

Proportion wise to historical is way out of whack. Simple as that.

[Nikel]

Should not be.

There should be a margin according to luck and the respective players abilities, but not beyond that.

I think 7000 is too much.

One Soviet source recognizes 1222 aircraft lost the first week, 738 the first "surprise" day, much less the other 6.

Not sure how many the German estimated to have destroyed.

And how many aircrafts were available in the Western Military Districts?

[Jango32]

By the 26th of June around 4000 VVS planes were reportedly lost, so effectively this is almost twice the historical haul with 3 extra days.

[Nikel]

Thanks Jango, which is that source?

From Google books, the Soviet aircrafts available according to Hooton, War over the Steppes.


Edit: follow Jango recommendation and back to my cave, thanks for the AAR K62.

[Jango32]

I will DM it later so as not to hijack the AAR thread.

[Veterin]

1

1.png (1.47 MiB) Viewed 3967 times

Well this Axis air opener certainly takes a lot of the admin out of a Soviet T1 air phase! Pretty much every airfield bombed all the way up to Orel/Kharkov!

Very impressive opener, in particular the south. You're basically at Vinnista.

[HardLuckYetAgain]

Yes, K62 is a thinker outside of normal constraints, setting examples not following examples. Not to mention the unsung "Top" player of WITE2 in my book. You are going to have your hands full in this game Vet.

[HardLuckYetAgain]

I find it interesting the only interception is the circled yellow section with the yellow arrow pointing too. Normally when I tried this with Germany coming in by the Red arrow the bombers would get intercepted in the orange box area. So either K62 got lucky or there was deviation around this area coming in from the North or South(more likely).

Interception.png (4.55 MiB) Viewed 3910 times

[K62]

Awww HLYA you make me blush

But really most of what I know I've learned from you! I just wish more players would go and dig through your old posts sometimes... you're the best WitE2 teacher ever

Also we should apparently call you Eagle Eye for spotting the interception pattern. Yes I had to do a lot of manual adjustment on that flight path, and it did come in from the south.

Bonus fun exercise: figure out an air directive that targets Orel airfield on T1. (With a non-zero number of planes, of course.)

[K62]

Top Axis pilots, with a special dedication to Jango:

pilot list.png (850.65 KiB) Viewed 3890 times

[K62]

Aircraft types lost:

loss aircraft types.png (290.94 KiB) Viewed 3888 times

[DekeFentle]

7k on T1, wow, thought I was doing ok bagging 5800. Any chance you would share your air directives?

[K62]

7k on T1, wow, thought I was doing ok bagging 5800. Any chance you would share your air directives?

I'm happy to share my air setup but don't want to bore anyone to death with it. You have to be aware that I'm using some 50 ground attack directives and need to move around 50 air groups in preparation. Also you won't get the best results unless you're willing to adjust flight paths on a good number of those directives. If people are indeed interested, I'm happy to post a thread in the War Room (as it would take way too much space on this AAR).