Tunnel Rat programming anomalies

[Ronzy]

Greetings designers/programmers of this awesome game!

In my recent playing of the "Ho Bo Woods" scenario (aka "Tunnels of Cu Chi"), I ran into several unrealistic programming anomalies (mostly related to Tunnel Rats, but also one that applies to Helicopter interactions in the game as well {as they have to do with elevation status/location within a hex} that were quite irritating and that I think could be fixed by programming of proper Logic in a future patch/DLC).

I am not a computer programmer, but I Aced my Logic classes in college days (i.e., AND/OR/NOR/IF/THEN/NOT etc. arguments ... that have practical application in not only computer programming, but also mathematics, electronics, and real life {such as discerning the truth about the bull***t government propaganda spewed by the MSM, etc. }).

I believe incorporation of tried and true Logic arguments to your existing programming for game events involving units at different elevation status (i.e., U vs G vs N vs L vs H) would fix all the issues I am about to describe.

Issues observed -

1. A tunnel hex occupancy includes a VC Btn HQ/Supply Cache at U elevation and a Tunnel Rat at G elevation. When the Tunnel Rat is moved within hex from G elevation to U elevation, Assault mode is NOT activated. No Assault is initiated. My Tunnel Rats can just go down into the tunnels in that hex and have a tea party with the VC beneath it. Yucking it up and sharing some rice wine and crumpets, with no combat initiated. That is just wrong. The only way I found for the Tunnel Rat to initiate combat with that VC Btn HQ/Supply Cache is to enter the hex in U elevation from an adjacent hex (when they should be able to initiate the combat by entering same location from above in the same hex).

2. Hex A has Tunnel Rats at U elevation adjacent to Hex B with a VC Btn HQ at U elevation AND 2 "friendly"/same side infantry platoons at G elevation (trying to make sure the VC Btn HQ doesn't escape to ground level). When the Tunnel Rats in Hex A initiate an assault against the U level VC in Hex B, the "friendly"/same side infantry platoons at G elevation in Hex B also participate in the Assault BUT AGAINST the Tunnel Rats!!!!????. This results in an overwhelming fratricide incident against the Tunnel Rats (whereas they could have easily taken out the VC involved at U level, BUT the friendly infantry platoons at G level in Hex B overwhelmingly wipe the Tunnel Rats out {rather than fighting against the VC ... they fight against their own friendly Tunnel Rats}). The programming fix here is to ensure that the Logic chain of the Assault is that ONLY units at U level are involved in the Assault if the Assault is initiated at U level.

3. Hex A has friendly infantry units at G level. Adjacent Hex B has Tunnel Rats at U level. Tunnel Rats at Hex B move to Hex A at U level. This triggers all kinds of surrounding Opp Fire at the units at G level in Hex A. Why??? No logical reason. The moving units are out of LOS at U level. This comes down to programming Logic that should be programmed in that Opp Fire only occurs based on the level of the target (U,G,N,L,H) and units at other levels than the moving unit should not be affected/targeted by that Opp Fire (and if the level of the moving unit is out of LOS, then NO Opp Fire should be triggered at all). And this ties into the same issue with Helicopter programming. I have seen multiple times a Helicopter unit moves at say L elevation over a hex with friendly units at G elevation, and it triggers VC Opp Fire at the friendly units at G elevation. That is also ridiculous. The Opp Fire programming should be, using Logic formulae, that a moving target unit at X elevation only triggers Opp Fire to X elevation (such that in the scenario above, if the Helicopter at L elevation triggers a VC Opp Fire, then that VC Opp Fire should be directed at the Helicopter at L elevation {NOT at units in the hex at G elevation}).

I think that if you could solve the programming challenges listed above, you will have found the "holy grail" of being able to actually make "Valor & Victory" a good game as well. I bought into the first few installments of V&V, but I hate it now and never play it because, besides not being able to form fire groups as in ASL, units can not occupy upper levels/be at different levels in large multi story buildings (ruins the game for me ... as all that is well modelled in ASL). However, you have your Helicopter model very well done in this game (just need to fix the anomaly in point 3 above) ... So I believe you are very close to a breakthrough in 3D modeling for an essentially 2D game if you would focus on fixing the anomalies I describe above.

Thank you for your consideration of these proposed/suggested programming fixes.

[Jason Petho]

That is excellent feedback, thank you so much!!

Definitely things to look into for future UPDATES.

I've noticed much of the same things during my replays.

THANK YOU!

[Ronzy]

Jason,

Thank you so much for your consideration of my suggestions.

One thing I do want to emphasize though, is that my qualm is not about AI selection of targets for Opp Fire as long as they are relevant (realistically) to elevation level of the target.

I absolutely LOVE that when you fire/move a unit at G level (or whatever level) of target, that you do not know which target the AI will choose to shoot at. For example, you fire/move a unit at ground level and the AI opponent Opp Fires, they may fire at the moving/firing unit (maybe 50% of the time), but they may fire at a non-moving/firing unit in the same hex (or even in a nearby hex at equidistant or less range). I think that is GREAT! That creates an unknown to the human player regarding reaction of the AI to the human player's move/fire that contributes greatly to the chaos/FOW on the battlefield as to enemy AI reaction to the human player's action that makes the situation all the time tense and unknown. I love that about this game. It is very realistic and keeps the human player on the edge of their seat. It also prevents Human player manipulation of the AI player.

So for example, when in my Original Post (OP from here on out), I say that a helicopter at L level should only trigger Opp Fire at L level, I do not mean to limit that Opp Fire to that moving helicopter unit only .... Only to limit that Opp Fire to elevation level L only. For example, there may be other helicopter units at level L in that same hex as the Opp Fire triggering helicopter unit at level L ... they should be legitimate targets for the AI ... as should be other helicopter units at level L potentially in other hexes at equidistant or less range.

The whole point of my suggestions in my OP are to limit/correct things in logical accord to unit's elevation levels.

I may post more on this subject as to examples I have seen (I have played more than 2 dozen scenarios of this game .. and it is my absolute favorite game that I have purchased from Matrix over the past couple decades) ... You (and your supporting developers and programmers) have created an awesomely great game here!