Nit Pickie Scenario changes

[LargeSlowTarget]

From what I have read the Hazemeyer was too complicated and unreliable and was replaced by a simpler, un-stabilised mount.

Some quotes from a variety of online sources:

The mount gained a reputation for unreliability among many naval officers.

The mount was well thought out and very effective but the technology wasn't ready and it proved very unrelieable.

Mk 5 twin mount [...] were more reliable than the Hazemeyer (which was officially the Mk 4) and easier and cheaper to produce.

While very efficient the Hazemeyer system suffered from difficult maintenance, and was subject to sea damage.

IMO no history of the Bofors 40/56 would be complete without the Dutch/British advanced mounts (Hazemeyer and derivatives), possibly too advanced for 1940 tech but a forerunner of contemporary integrated mounts.

Watercooled Bofors (probably Mk.IC) guns on the Dutch Hazemeyer tri-axially stabilized mounting. This Dutch mounting arrived in the UK in 1940 on a Dutch destroyer, and was adapted for British use. Often fitted with the Type 282 fire control radar right on the mounting. Gun was water cooled. This mounting was replaced by the less complicated and more reliable Mk.V mounting.

For close-range defense, the new destroyer would finally abandon the quadruple 40mm Vickers “pom-pom” for the long-barreled Bofors 40mm gun on the sophisticated (and, in practice, highly unreliable) Dutch-designed Hazemeyer twin mounting.

Mark IV: a tri-axially stabilized twin mounting, copied from, and usually known as, the "Hazemeyer". It had on-mounting fire control, and was usually fitted with Radar Type 282 to provide target range information.
Mark V: twin mounting, which superseded, and eventually replaced, the Mark IV, often referred to as the "utility" mounting. It was a simplified, unstabilised mounting based on the American twin mounting Mark I, and was designed for remote fire control.

The sophisticated Hazemeyer twin 40 mm mounts proved not just over-weight but unreliable. It was therefore decided to replace that the next five ships should have instead an even more advanced (with better radar) and, it was hoped, more reliable and lighter British-designed STAAG mount - only for this to turn out so horrendously over-weight that just two twin mounts could be carried on the rear deckhouse instead of the four Hazemeyers although this was augmented by 5x40 mm single Bofors (i.e. 9 in total). Moreover, the STAAG’s proved even more unreliable than the Hazemeyers! The last three 1942 Battles were fitted instead with a new ‘Utility’ mount, much simpler but still radar controlled and far more reliable – if (theoretically) less capable.

[orabera]

From what I have read the Hazemeyer was too complicated and unreliable and was replaced by a simpler, un-stabilised mount.

Thank you, I'll leave the Hazemeyer as is.

I've been away for quite a while this time, waiting for final update.

I have make a couple of additions. I found a sort of source for the boats taken up as YP by the US Navy from mid-41 through mid-42 or so. I've added all the ones I could confirm as Pacific based, former fishing boats and suitable for overseas deployment. Some of the boats used as YP were quite small and useful only for inner harbor patrols. These are including in the attached #80 scenario, Ship numbers 11376-11392 and 11692-11740, 103 in total.

Before I was making changes here and there, whatever caught my fancy. I plan to implement a more though out review, one nation at a time. Starting with the Australians. Tossing around the idea of implementing a brigade based OB for them with Division HQ's. Division organization was quite fluid for the Australians throughout the war and I think the currently implemented structure over represents the forces deployed outside of Australian.

Completely removing the 2nd, 5th, 6th and 7th RAA Coastal Artillery Regiments. I've been using the Australian War Memorial website (https://www.awm.gov.au/collection/C1359733) for research. They've digitized the unit war dairies of the 2nd AIF and CMF forces from WWII and I can find no record of these units beyond their services as the Australian Regular Army units manning Australia's fixed defenses. All of Australia's mobile Coastal Artillery were the letter batteries (A-H and L-U) equipped with US 155 GPF guns from WWI, with many of these these batteries manning fixed 155mm positions reinforcing existing fixed guns around Australian harbors.

[LargeSlowTarget]

Starting with the Australians. Tossing around the idea of implementing a brigade based OB for them with Division HQ's. Division organization was quite fluid for the Australians throughout the war and I think the currently implemented structure over represents the forces deployed outside of Australian.

Yup. I have implemented this in my mod for the same reason.

[orabera]

I found a translated Japanese document from 1942 which is titled "Report on Installations and Captured Weapons, Java and Singapore". Pretty interesting reading, it contains details on numbers and placement of CD guns at Singapore and Soerabaja. I'll upload an updated scenario once I've made some changes to the CD guns at these two bases.

All sorts of interesting tidbits. In Malay the Japanese captured 34 sabers, on Java they captured 40,552. The Dutch attempted to destroy their costal guns by exploding the attached ammunition storage and expecting this to destroy the associated gun. The British had specific shells for this purpose, the shells were marked on the outside with a Skull on the outside and were filled with a powerful explosive load that would detonate immediately upon firing. This would cause major damage near the breach and leave the guns unrepairable. Three of the four 15' guns at Singapore were destroyed in this manner.

[orabera]

Updated with info from the Japanese document. Didn't change much:
• added sixteen 6pdr CD guns to Singapore
• Added eighteen18pdr guns to Singapore fort (16th Defence Regiment which manned mobile guns for beach defense)
• three US 7in CD guns to Soerabaja
• Dutch port of Cherison to 51, 100 with two 7in CD guns being installed and three 75mm CD guns.

Apparently the Dutch had recently purchased twelve old 7in naval guns from the US and were in the process of adding them to CD installations.

Found an error in the data base: Admiralty 'V' class DD (Bult in 1917, Ship classes 122 and 123). In the DB it is equipped with Mk V 4.5in Gun (1512), should be Mk V 4in HA Gun (1522). Really changes AA capability, downward of course.

Assorted other changes:

Found a copy of the History of the Royal Regiment of Artillery, Anti-Aircraft Artillery, 1914-55. Never could find a good online source for British AA in Malaya. I think I have a better idea of all the guns available now.

• Added four 3in AA guns to Alor Star
• Added six 3in AA guns to Kota Bharu
• Renamed Sungei Pantani to Butterworth and increased Airfield to four. Butterworth is still a major air base of the Royal Malaya Air Force.
• Moved all British air units from Georgetown to Butterworth
• Added eight 3.7in AA guns to Butterworth
• Changed the Japanese air units that attack Georgetown first turn to attack Butterworth. Japanese air attacks on the first turn on the three advanced airbases (Alor Star, Kota Bharu and Butterworth) now lose a plane or two to AA fire.
• Added one battery of 8x40mm guns supporting III Corps at Alor Star.
• There are two AA batteries in Singapore assigned to III Corps (One HAA and one LAA). These two historically deployed to the Malay Peninsula to provide additional AA cover to III Corps.
• Added several China River patrol boats to Singapore and Hong Kong, these boats all provided bombardment support during the early battles.
• Added regular British Army Independent company for the Malaya Command at Georgetown.
• Added a Federated Malaya States Volunteer Independent Company at Kuala Lumpur, since it is a Volunteer force (Territorial/National Guard) it has lower experience and moral.
• Independent Companies had nine squads and in game are given nine Cdo/Para squads and one Combat Engineer squad. Since Commando squads were twice the size of typical Para squads I've doubled this to 18 Cdo/Para quads and two Combat Engineer. A typical Commonwealth Infantry company was approximately 120 men in nine squads and Independent companies were 256 men.
• Created a new Transport Taskforce at Karachi. It is carrying three independent AA batteries that were last minute reinforcements bound for Burma. 3rd Indian LAA Btry, 8th Indian HAA Btry and 8th HAA Btry.
• Added base Dry Tree Point one hex south of Rangoon (54,54) and moved the two 6in CD guns from Rangoon to here. This Examination Battery was intended to keep raiders away from the port of Rangoon if possible. Two 6in guns, one 12pdr AA gun, one Lewis Twin AA MG, one Burmese infantry platoon.
• Added patrol zones to all the Dutch SS at sea. Occasionally one will now attack a Japanese transport first day of the war.
• Changed the patrol zones for the four US SS around Midway and Wake. These SS were intended more for point defense of the islands than distant screening. When these two islands were bombarded the first day of the war three of the SS were close enough to see dust and smoke from the bombardments and the two SS around Midway (Trout and Argonaut) attempted to get into position for torpedo attacks on the bombardment forces, neither was able. One of the SS at Wake (Triton) made the first US Navy submarine torpedo attack of the war on Japanese bombardment forces on 10 Dec 41.
• Added small Australian Air base units to Tulagi, Port Vila (Efate Island) and Il Nou (Noumea, New Caledonia).
• Added Australian Robin Force CD guns to Noumea (2x6in guns)
• Created a Transport Task force at Sydney carrying the 2/3 Australian Independent Company to Noumea. This unit appears at Nomea on Dec 25 normally. I've added it as a unit in transit to give the player options on its eventual destination.

Some day I should try and list all of the other changes I've made.

[orabera]

Surprise Surprise, I made a mistake changing the gun on the Admiralty 'V' class destroyers.

First, the Admiralty 'W' class was the same as the 'V', just built with triple Torpedo launcher vice Double. All 'V' were updated to Triple post WWI.

Second, they were not equipped with a High Angle mount for the 4in/45 Mk V, they had a Low Angle mount without AA capability. I created a new device 1499 for the 4in/45 QF LA Mk V and equipped both 'V' (122, 123) and 'W' (243, 244) class destroyers. No AA and a slightly shorter range. Also replaced the 12pdr AA with 2pdr Pom Pom on the starting ships.

All this only affects three ships.

Sorry
Mike G

[Yaab]

Loaded your scen080's first turn.

Splendid job on Burma and Malaya. Love the forward LCU deployment in both countries.

Now can you make a day last 48 hours instead of 24 hours, so I can finally have time to play your scenario?

[LargeSlowTarget]

@orabera

Interesting, never heard of the Examination Battery but then found some info about it (and Burma Army in general) here : https://www.indiaburmasoldiers.co.uk/Ra ... tm#ExamBty

If you don't mind I would like to 'steal' that nit pick for my mod, if I can find an unused LCU slot.

I like the additional AA and Inf units as well, but won't be able to steal those - would require too many LCU slots which I don't have available.

[btd64]

Surprise Surprise, I made a mistake changing the gun on the Admiralty 'V' class destroyers.

First, the Admiralty 'W' class was the same as the 'V', just built with triple Torpedo launcher vice Double. All 'V' were updated to Triple post WWI.

Second, they were not equipped with a High Angle mount for the 4in/45 Mk V, they had a Low Angle mount without AA capability. I created a new device 1499 for the 4in/45 QF LA Mk V and equipped both 'V' (122, 123) and 'W' (243, 244) class destroyers. No AA and a slightly shorter range. Also replaced the 12pdr AA with 2pdr Pom Pom on the starting ships.

All this only affects three ships.

Sorry
Mike G

Mike, Do you have a scenrio page that discribes your scenario?....GP

[btd64]

Surprise Surprise, I made a mistake changing the gun on the Admiralty 'V' class destroyers.

First, the Admiralty 'W' class was the same as the 'V', just built with triple Torpedo launcher vice Double. All 'V' were updated to Triple post WWI.

Second, they were not equipped with a High Angle mount for the 4in/45 Mk V, they had a Low Angle mount without AA capability. I created a new device 1499 for the 4in/45 QF LA Mk V and equipped both 'V' (122, 123) and 'W' (243, 244) class destroyers. No AA and a slightly shorter range. Also replaced the 12pdr AA with 2pdr Pom Pom on the starting ships.

All this only affects three ships.

Sorry
Mike G

Mike, Do you have a scenrio page that discribes your scenario?....GP

Apon futher review I desided that I should of reread this thread. ....GP

[orabera]

@orabera

Interesting, never heard of the Examination Battery but then found some info about it (and Burma Army in general) here : https://www.indiaburmasoldiers.co.uk/Ra ... tm#ExamBty

If you don't mind I would like to 'steal' that nit pick for my mod, if I can find an unused LCU slot.

I like the additional AA and Inf units as well, but won't be able to steal those - would require too many LCU slots which I don't have available.

Feel free to borrow anything.

[Yaab]

...and now orabera fixes his gaze upon India. Or does he?

[orabera]

...and now orabera fixes his gaze upon India. Or does he?

Yes, going to be hard, no great online sources for the Indian Army. May need to purchase some more books.

[orabera]

Minor changes here.

Looked at the 18th Infantry division enroute from England and noticed one small problem to start.

The 251st Recce Bn is actually the 18th Recce Bn. The 251st was a Field Park Company, the Division level engineer company. Division also had three Field companies, engineer companies for the Brigades. The 18th Recce was redesignated from 5th Loyal Bn, a Bicycle bn which had been the Divisional recon force before the Recce Bn's were formed in 1940.

Made a few small changes to the unit OB and added one device, Humber Scout Car. British naming is a bit confusing, there were two unique Humber Armored Cars. The first was the Humber Scout Car, a light hardly armored car with Bren gun and Boys AT rifle, this was the primary vehicle for Recce Bn's. The second was the Humber Armored Car, this had some armor and a 37mm gun, from 1942 the Recon Bn replaced 18 of the units 45 armored cars with this. To confuse more there were also two unique Daimler Cars, one Scout and one Armored.

Apparently the 18th Recce Bn shipped without heavy equipment, they were to receive Bren Carriers and Humber Scout cars when they arrived in the Middle East. Functioned as a regular infantry Bn in Malaya.

I haven't yet updated the OB for the reassembled18th Infantry Division, that's next.

Humber LRC.JPG (126.31 KiB) Viewed 645 times

Humber HRC MkIV.jpg (113.8 KiB) Viewed 645 times

[orabera]

Here a few of the changes I previously made but haven't mentioned yet.

Destroyer Division 57 (four US DD at Balikpapan) - The US had committed to provide the British Force Z with additional DD since they were short. These four destroyers were enroute to join Force Z when the War started. Since the Editor doesn't support TF Merge (that I could find) this TF is set to Follow Force Z at game start. With delays in refueling at Balikpapan they just missed sailing with them to destruction.

Ships under repair - I've checked as many ship histories as possible and added more ships to repair.
• US DD Pillsbury and Peary at Manila. Repairing very minor collision damage
• French DD Le Triomphant minor overhaul at Sydney.
• British CVL Hermes major overhaul at Cape Town.
• British CL Mauritius at Singapore. When the anti-magnetic mine system was installed it caused major problems with the ship fire control system. Under repair at Singapore, it had to return to the UK to have repairs completed. After they repairs were completed it then returned to the Eastern Fleet.
• US DD Shaw at Pearl Harbor. She was in the floating dock during the attack and the photo of a ship exploding was the Shaw.
• USCGC Haida at Bremerton, Overhaul. Also reclassified it as a DE.
• US SS Cachalot at Pearl Harbor, Overhaul.
• US SS Sealion and Seadragon at Manila, minor Overhaul. Both were hit by the Japanese airstrike on Cavite, Sealion was sunk.

Added small US Navy base forces to US coastal cities of Tillamook, Coos Bay and Eureka. All were in the process of becoming US Navy air bases. Tillamook eventually became a major Navy Blimp base.

Adjusted US Navy Blimp reinforcement rate to more closely match history.

Created base San Nicolas Island (California Channel Islands) with one Port and one airfield level.
Added one airfield to San Clemente islands (California Channel Islands)

Added small US Navy base forces San Nicolas and San Clemente islands.

USS Thresher one hex northwest of Pearl Harbor was returning from training exercise and met DD USS Litchfield the morning of Dec 7 to be escorted into harbor. Add USS Litchfield to the same hex as ASW Patrol.

CA Minneapolis and four DMs that appear in Pearl Harbor on Dec 8 were just south of Pearl on Dec 7 conducting exercises. I've added this TF to the start. In all my tests against AI they have never been attacked by Japanese air on Dec 7.

Enterprise Air Group - Made changes to the Enterprise Air Group to show flight activities and losses on Dec 7. This results in VS-6 with 13 SBD-2 and VF-6 Det with 2 F4F-3A appearing at Pearl on Dec 8 and lowering VS-6 on Enterprise to 10 fighters. Unfortunately this means the scenario only works with Historic first turn or AI opponent.

Changed the start position of the Enterprise and Lexington task forces. Enterprise south of Pearl and Lexington a bit to the north and heading to Midway.

Start US Carrier Air Groups. I've adjusted starting numbers to more accurately depict historic numbers. This lowers the number of fighters at start and increases number of torpedo bombers.

Added two islands to the Bering Sea, St. Paul and St George with one port level. Both had significant seal populations at one time and the Russians had forced Aleuts to live on both islands to support seal hunting in the 18th century. The US Army built airfields on both during the war.

Added small island bases to the South China Sea northwest of Palawan. No real reason, just poop and chuckles.

USS_SHAW_exploding_Pearl_Harbor_Nara_80-G-16871_2.jpg (188.14 KiB) Viewed 638 times

[orabera]

Apparently the 18th Recce Bn shipped without heavy equipment, they were to receive Bren Carriers and Humber Scout cars when they arrived in the Middle East. Functioned as a regular infantry Bn in Malaya.

Wiki is a good source to start research but only to start. Found the pre-deployment War Diary for the 18th Recce Bn online and it shipped from Liverpool with all it's equipment. Now need to find out what happen to it.

I'll upload a new version shortly with this fixed and 18th Division OB updated.

[orabera]

Details regarding the deployment of the 18th Infantry took forever to find, or so it seemed. No complete answer in one site, little details spread all over the place.

The 18th Infantry shipped from the UK in two convoys. The first was WS12X (WS - Winston Special), this was the convoy that used six US transports and was escorted from Halifax to Cape Town by a US Task Force build around the aircraft carrier Ranger and arrived at Cape Town on 9 Dec 41. It carried the 18th's Troops, carrying nothing more than personal equipment and weapons. The second convoy was WS12Z, this convoy carried assorted minor units and replacements heading to the Middle East and arrived at Durban on 18 Dec 41. It also had a number of Cargo ships carrying the heavy equipment for the 18th Infantry.

These convoys broke up and the ships headed to various destinations. Most of the 18th Infantry (54th and 55th Bdes and Division troops) headed to Bombay where the troops off loaded and rested for 2 weeks. Much of the equipment was loaded from one set of cargo ships and loaded onto a different set. These troops departed Bombay on 19 Jan 42 and arrived in Singapore on 29 Jan 42. The equipment arrived in Singapore spread across a few smaller convoys. The 53rd Infantry Bde (onboard the Mount Vernon) headed to Mombasa after leaving Cape Town accompanied by the troop ship USS Orizaba. I'm assuming that at Mombasa some of the troops on Orizaba transferred to the Mount Vernon. From Mombasa the Orizaba headed to Bombay and the Mount Vernon joined a convoy headed for Singapore and arrived on 13 Jan 42. The 53rd Bde when it arrived at Singapore had no heavy equipment, only the troops arrived. It was issued heavy equipment and weapons from wartime reserves held in Singapore. Only one ship was lost among these convoys to Singapore, Empress of Asia was bombed and sunk in sight of Singapore, the men were rescued but all equipment was lost, this is where the 18th Recon Regiment lost its 45 light armoured cars. At Singapore the 18th Recon was issued 10 ACV-IP (Armoured Carrier Vehicle-India Pattern) a vehicle equivalent to the Humber LAC and built in India. Of the six US troop ships that left Halifax, only the larger three (Mount Vernon (53rd), Wakefield (54th) and West Point (55th)) actually carried troops all the way to Singapore.

Now that I've bored you senseless I need to find a way, probably two convoys, to replicate this some how. I prefer that players be given the situation as it existed at game start and then can decide where to go from there.

IndianPattern_mkII_2.jpg (49.18 KiB) Viewed 579 times

General comment on British infantry Divisions. British Infantry Divisions were far more motorized than US Infantry Divisions. A US division had around 1400 total assigned vehicles while a British Division would have around 4300. A number of these in the British division would be motorcycles, but this would only account for around 400 or so. The US division had 10 light armored cars in the Recon Troop, the British Division had over 200 light armoured vehicles between the Recon Regiment, the Universal Bren carriers and Universal 3in mortar carriers in the Infantry Bns. As the war progressed the number of vehicles in US division actually fell as the division organization was adjusted to reduce shipping needs. On the other hand as the British produced more and more equipment and units received full equipment issue, vehicle numbers actually increased gradually. The US did have an incredibly large number and variety of trucks, they were just assigned at Corps and Army level.

When I do get to the British update I will need to greatly increase the number of Motorized Support, at least for the Divisions as they deploy from the UK. Later the British did have a lower vehicle establishment for divisions in the CBI.

Little tidbits I picked from reading the War Diary of the 18th Recon. His Majesty the King inspected the 18th Infantry Division shortly before it deployed and was impressed by the Humber LACs new from the factory. Upon arriving in Bombay all official weapons carried by the troops were reported to Indian Immigration. Officers were informed that they must complete immigration paperwork for any personal weapons they were carrying. When the 18th was loading transports in England an armed detachment was formed to escort prisoners from Division stockade to brigs onboard the transport ships.

The copy of the war diary I found was a photo of the pages, not a scan. I was able to see the back of the official war diary form. Units were instructed that the war diary would be sent to the unit rear HQ at the end of every month. The 18th Recon War Diary ends 31 Dec 41. It appears the Jan 42 War Diary was lost in the fall of Singapore.

[btd64]

I read that the division arrived just in time for the surrender....GP

[Yaab]

That Indian Mk II APC is a actually quite nice. Never heard of it.