153 huge transports (C46) lost on ONE day? Plus some more funny issues

[Alpha77]

Zwischenablage01.jpg (69.51 KiB) Viewed 713 times

Is this funny or disturbing, can´t decide... but rather laugh I am Japan.

And btw these planes aren´t even supposed to be there at this time in the game ) EDIT, Cuz they start only in 8/43 and we have 5/43 I just checked in editor.

[Yaab]

Correct me if I am wrong, but when you sink a ship carrying aircraft from an air group, those destroyed aircraft will be listed as Ground losses?

[Platoonist]

Is this funny or disturbing, can´t decide... but rather laugh
I am Japan, these planes aren´t even supposed to be there at this time in the game )

The Aircraft Losses screen shows both Alied and Japanese losses. That's why there are Catalinas, B-17s and Venturas on that list too.

[Alpha77]

Here the Wiki for this plane type, I did not note it before much...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Curtiss_C-46_Commando

And a also somewhat funny picture with the undertitle:

"A U.S. C-46 aircraft conducting an aerial evacuation of wounded American troops from Manila, the capital of the Philippines, shortly after U.S. forces retook the city after intense fighting with the Japanese."

Here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Curtiss_C ... flight.jpg

And here Lufthansa used this one (must be very early!)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Curtiss_C ... eldorf.jpg

[Alpha77]

The Aircraft Losses screen shows both Alied and Japanese losses. That's why there are Catalinas, B-17s and Venturas on that list too.

I know ofc but where should these planes have been lost?

And as I wrote they are "Not supposed to be there" they start a smaller production for the US army on 7 or 8 / 1943 (needed to recheck) and it is 5 / 1943. The type for the Marines may appear earlier (need check) but named differently.

When I post something like this then it is worth a post and has nothing to do with what you write
"shows both Alied and Japanese losses" which is obvious it does and since the beginning of the game already

@Yaab: Yes planes sunk with their ships count as "ground "losses...but I sank only 1 merchant this turn I believe

[RangerJoe]

Check the Chinese start date as well . . .

[Yaab]

Which scenario is this? An Ironman one?

[Alpha77]

Check the Chinese start date as well . . .

7/42 must be an oversight I guess.... and 10 per month at least in my version.

I did not overrun a Chinese base this turn and how many trans squadrons do they have 2 or 3 I guess.
They get ony 1 DC3 but 10 of these huge planes so early?

[Alpha77]

Which scenario is this? An Ironman one?

It is Scen2 with a few edits by me (mostly "streamlining production for Japan, deleting many merchants and small craft and lots of land unit updates)...

But did not change ANY Allied transport plane numbers or data...and to add I do not like "Ironman" scens at all, cuz fantasy Never played "Ironman" but Ranger Joe is right - the Chinese get 10 of these planes from 7/42 on.
Version here is 11.27 (the beta before the new beta )^. I may check the other side perhaps it brings an insight or at least confirms the (ca.) numbers. There is FOW but never this huge...
Also love the that a Russian cruiser is in the Salomones ... and Russians landed 3+ div equivalents at Shikuka
After the EVIL Stalin attacked the peaceloving Japanese on the 1st of May ( Der rote 1. Mai, heraus zum Tag der Arbeiter Genossen Ein wirklich wahrer Tag der Infamie)

I just remembered that some planes arrive BEFORE the date with new units (but 153 planes sunk on ships? When 1 ship only sunk and these planes would not fit on such normal cargo ships)

[Alpha77]

Opened Allied side and FOUND a mega C46 unit:

Zwischenablage02.jpg (80.43 KiB) Viewed 596 times

Here the combat:

Day Time Surface Combat, near Sandoway at 49,51, Range 19,000 Yards

Allied aircraft
no flights

Allied aircraft losses
C-46A Commando: 59 destroyed

Japanese Ships
DD Takanami
DD Hibiki
DD Shirayuki
DD Shikinami

Allied Ships
AM Swallow, Shell hits 14, and is sunk
xAK Colbert, Shell hits 19, Torpedo hits 2, and is sunk


So unit has 120 planes which went down, combat report says 59 and Jap FOW report says 153 and unit should have max 25 planes And maybe perhaps a dozen planes of this size would fit into such a normal transport....

What a story and it this is not even the end of the fun, more perhaps later

[RangerJoe]

During the Beta testing, a B29 unit came in during 1942 . . .

[Yaab]

Well, something is wrong with AI logic if it can augment an air group's size by 450%.

[Alpha77]

Well, something is wrong with AI logic if it can augment an air group's size by 450%.

That was the only monster unit I found tho... so not a common thing at all.

AND this is more a sign the AI did something good, as it tried to safe these 120 planes.
The location where it was bases is also quite curious, as it is an isolated place which I forgot about -
but the English still had in possession. I thought who cares they should die over time and did nothing
to take this last English base near Rangoon (lazyness mostly). Untill one flight of my bombers were intercepted by the
Flying Tigers. Turns out this base also has half of the Chinese airforce and after months of isolation
were still able to fly CAP missions. Lost a dozen 2€ bombers that was a surprise So the airbase1 sitze
base had ca 80/90 fighters and this C46 monster unit.

There is only 1 ground unit there however (now half disabled) but NO air support. Seems AI gets also such a bonus, I understand planes can fly without support for a while. Now I send ofc something to take this location
But this base is a "new" one right? I can not remember the name from earlier versions - and it was said the new
bases were added "to help the AI". So can someone explain to me how this "help" works here? The AI sent all these fighters to an isolated mini base without any support and then creates a monster transport unit also there Interesting that this is defined as a "help" by someone

Edit, here also a pic from the base (the ground unit is "kings own battalion" which has no air support):

Zwischenablage01.jpg (142.06 KiB) Viewed 479 times

[HansBolter]

Much more common in modded scenarios for ground units as well.

I currently fighting against Japanese engineer brigades on Sumatra that have AVs of over 400. Brigades of engineers as strong as divisions!

[Yaab]

Yes, Sandoway is one of the new bases.

I reckon no rail goes to Sandoway. At least a railroad would have accounted for moving any damaged aircraft to Sandoway.

Also, the arifield is overstacked (the "*" sign).

[Yaab]

Here the combat:

Day Time Surface Combat, near Sandoway at 49,51, Range 19,000 Yards

Allied aircraft
no flights

Allied aircraft losses
C-46A Commando: 59 destroyed

Wait, that would mean the AI evacuated by ship those damaged C-46 aircraft stranded in Sandoway. That is actually a well-programmed, "reasonable" move. The code should have just assigned more escort ships to the xAK.

[BBfanboy]

The size of the unit is likely a database input problem. Trying to key 12 but hitting the 2 and 0 key with the same finger stroke would give you 120.

Also, in the original game the Chinese get in the early days 10 X C-22 transports (DC-2s in civilian designation). I don't know what the database index number is for those aircraft but if it is close to the code for the C-46a, there could be a database entry error that way.

[insecttoid3]

That particular air unit in scen2 arrives in 5/43 with 10 C-46A and a max size of 25(no idea how the AI would have resized it).

The start date for planes is when free ones start arriving, not when they are available overall. Units using them can and do arrive before that date, they just shouldn't be able to replace losses due to no free ones arriving, so again no idea how the AI got that many into one group.

[Alpha77]

Yes, Sandoway is one of the new bases.

Seems the holiday industry sponsored the adding of this base, cuz when I google the location only resorts and hotels etc come up Yes I said already the only reasonable move by the AI is to try evacuating the giant unit.

Ofc all fatatasy as these planes never could fit in the ship as well port 1 does not have huge cranes etc to load such planes ofc. And there is no supply left to have the few engs left to do work (and no nav support etc). Also it shows in the base screen to have AV(!!) even if no unit is there with AV. Must be display error or help for the AI

Ohter funny move I noted in the same area, Brits send an Indian brigade to Chittagong (which is in Jap hands for 7/8 months now) in transport mode (not amphibious). Then the last turn the TF turned around as they must have noted unit won´t unload there Ofc i had found some shipping (before peaking at the other side) and send 2-3 fleets to catch something, this brigade should also go under I guess. While at Suez and Alex almost 400 mostly BRITISH planes sit dwindling their thumbs along with their navy mates (from the cruisers and CVs "stranded" there, no damage etc).

So someone thought it to be cool to add a bunch of bases but no one seemed to care to let the AI know these new bases exist and write some code that AI knows to move the stuff out from there. Like before it arrived at Aden mostly and also mostly this was moved out on map. However also at Panama 2 modern US CLs now sit for a long time, Jamaica a Brit CV, 45 subs at PH etc

[Alpha77]

That particular air unit in scen2 arrives in 5/43 with 10 C-46A and a max size of 25(no idea how the AI would have resized it).

The start date for planes is when free ones start arriving, not when they are available overall. Units using them can and do arrive before that date, they just shouldn't be able to replace losses due to no free ones arriving, so again no idea how the AI got that many into one group.

5/43 correct it should arrive at LEDO iirc. But the planes would indeed be there, as RJ pointed out the Chinese get 10 of them from 7/42(!). Can be just an input error or even WAD (but no idea here, czu I did not find a source saying in WW2 the CAF so early got so many big transports). YES CAF had those planes in 44/45 and after the war up to the 50ties iirc!

HOWEVER ... the US army (airforce) can draw from the Chinese transport plane pool. A pretty cool issue all in all