Taking Chungking in 1943(?)

[Chickenboy]

Hello all!

Long time no post! However, my game with AcePylut (allies) is ongoing. Of course, I'm playing the role of the IJ. The basic setup is stock Sc. 2 (last official patch), mid-August 1943.

Burma is a stalemate, with IJ forces holding all of the Burmese plain down to Rangoon.

The Allied 'machine' is picking up steam in the Pacific, particularly SoPac. Suva is still under my control, but is / will be a focal point of conflict for the near-intermediate future. Noumea, Port Moresby and PNG is largely mine on the Western flank. Centpac: Tarawa is a daily struggle as the Allies have captured most of the Carolines and are laying siege to the island. An unsuccessful Allied attempt to capture the atoll saw the destruction of the better part of an Allied division many months ago.

I hold N and NE Australia. Mid-1942 saw an epic fight over NW Australia. At tremendous cost to the RN, the Allies re-captured Port Hedland, but haven't made any further headway to the E/NE of the continent.

I hold almost exactly a 3:1 VP ratio (~42,000: ~13,900) heading into September 1943.

The Chinese have been routed from most of central and Eastern China, with the exception of Chungking and a few other scattered cities to the NE that are of tertiary importance to the (me) IJ concerns.

Chungking has been invested and all hex sides turned for the better part of a year now. Through daily bombing, I am making sure that the airfield is bombed and that engineers are too busy using their scant supplies on repair work. Plus, daily bombing regularly hits airfield supply per se as well. Probably ~80% of the Chinese units are stacked in Chungking where they retreated early in the war-SIGINT/Recon shows ~600,000 Chinese troops present in this hexenkessel.

Chungking started with a fortification level of 5, but through painful deliberate Japanese attacks (at significant cost to IJA engineering units) has been reduced to (last turn) a fortification level of 2. I *think* that's a monumental development. But as I've never captured Chungking before in any of my games (long story short: most of my Allied PBEM partners have had an unfortunate tendency to die IRL before we get to 1944 or get AutoVic'ed out in 1943), I'm not sure what this endgame is *supposed* to look like from my vantage.

So-my point: Tell me what you (as IJ) did towards the end of the Chungking siege that A) Demonstrated the 'writing on the wall' for its downfall-when did you know that the 'jig was up' and B) If you changed anything in the Deliberate assault-bombard-rest-rotate / refresh IJA assault units-repeat process that made a meaningful difference in its capture near the endgame.

For 'bonus points' I'd be interested in what you think a reduction of Chungking (and surrender of the garrison of this number of Chinese units) will do for my game. Do you think that the VP collection from the surrender will provide a meaningful and insurmountable buffer to get to 3:1 VP (and Autovictory) on January 1, 1944?

[Chickenboy]

As a follow-on: We are playing by HRs that prohibit Japanese strategic bombing in China. From what I can tell, the Chinese have some HI and LI still functional in this hex.

Additionally, although I can't figure out *how* apparently the Chinese leadership receives a regular + in the combat report. I've cycled through all of my Division and HQ Japanese leaders and they're pretty good-so how this has occurred is beyond my ken. Assaults on the hex have seen a consistent "-" supply malus applied, so I got that going for me at least.

[RangerJoe]

There is an easier way to reduce Chungking. PM me if you want details.

The enemy may have so many leaders in there that someone is bound to get lucky.

[Chickenboy]

There is an easier way to reduce Chungking. PM me if you want details.

The enemy may have so many leaders in there that someone is bound to get lucky.

Alright. Per your suggestion, I've PM'ed you for the 'easier way to reduce Chungking'. Anybody else?

[RangerJoe]

Remember that they Chinese in Chungking also receive automatic supplies. But included in the pm are ways to use those up.

[stuman]

Hello Chickenboy, long time no see !

[Chickenboy]

Hello Chickenboy, long time no see !

Hello to you too!

[PaxMondo]

CB,

Not knowing the exact forces on each side it is hard to give specific advice, still, with the forts down to 2 you should be able to take CK. Just make sure you already have Chengtu before you take Chungking. Then none of the CHI forces will ever return to the game ... a big deal for the IJ. So, whatever you need to commit to CK for it to fall is worthwhile.

[Chickenboy]

CB,

Not knowing the exact forces on each side it is hard to give specific advice, still, with the forts down to 2 you should be able to take CK. Just make sure you already have Chengtu before you take Chungking. Then none of the CHI forces will ever return to the game ... a big deal for the IJ. So, whatever you need to commit to CK for it to fall is worthwhile.

Much obliged for the advice, Pax. Chengtu is my center of operations for the Central Chinese Plain-built up nicely with beaucoup HQ units to repair and replenish the disruptions from assault efforts and keep forces in supply.

[PaxMondo]

CB,

Not knowing the exact forces on each side it is hard to give specific advice, still, with the forts down to 2 you should be able to take CK. Just make sure you already have Chengtu before you take Chungking. Then none of the CHI forces will ever return to the game ... a big deal for the IJ. So, whatever you need to commit to CK for it to fall is worthwhile.

Much obliged for the advice, Pax. Chengtu is my center of operations for the Central Chinese Plain-built up nicely with beaucoup HQ units to repair and replenish the disruptions from assault efforts and keep forces in supply.

Excellent. I will offer this, I often allow the NW (76,44) hex to be free to allow the CHI forces to retreat to. My experience is that this will often save me a lot of losses. Once the CHI forces are shifted there, no supply, no forts, they collapse very quickly.

This is all empirical observation.

[btd64]

CB,

Not knowing the exact forces on each side it is hard to give specific advice, still, with the forts down to 2 you should be able to take CK. Just make sure you already have Chengtu before you take Chungking. Then none of the CHI forces will ever return to the game ... a big deal for the IJ. So, whatever you need to commit to CK for it to fall is worthwhile.

Much obliged for the advice, Pax. Chengtu is my center of operations for the Central Chinese Plain-built up nicely with beaucoup HQ units to repair and replenish the disruptions from assault efforts and keep forces in supply.

Excellent. I will offer this, I often allow the NW (76,44) hex to be free to allow the CHI forces to retreat to. My experience is that this will often save me a lot of losses. Once the CHI forces are shifted there, no supply, no forts, they collapse very quickly.

This is all empirical observation.

As an AFB, that is the best way, I hate to say....GP

[RangerJoe]

Much obliged for the advice, Pax. Chengtu is my center of operations for the Central Chinese Plain-built up nicely with beaucoup HQ units to repair and replenish the disruptions from assault efforts and keep forces in supply.

Excellent. I will offer this, I often allow the NW (76,44) hex to be free to allow the CHI forces to retreat to. My experience is that this will often save me a lot of losses. Once the CHI forces are shifted there, no supply, no forts, they collapse very quickly.

This is all empirical observation.

As an AFB, that is the best way, I hate to say....GP

Not just that, but bombing units in the open with no field fortifications is so much better than bombing the units in Light Urban terrain, at least from the attackers point of view!

Then, if you just leave one unit there and evacuate the area, Chungking just might revert to Chinese control and you can have fun destroying those units all over again.

[Chickenboy]

CB,

Not knowing the exact forces on each side it is hard to give specific advice, still, with the forts down to 2 you should be able to take CK. Just make sure you already have Chengtu before you take Chungking. Then none of the CHI forces will ever return to the game ... a big deal for the IJ. So, whatever you need to commit to CK for it to fall is worthwhile.

Much obliged for the advice, Pax. Chengtu is my center of operations for the Central Chinese Plain-built up nicely with beaucoup HQ units to repair and replenish the disruptions from assault efforts and keep forces in supply.

Excellent. I will offer this, I often allow the NW (76,44) hex to be free to allow the CHI forces to retreat to. My experience is that this will often save me a lot of losses. Once the CHI forces are shifted there, no supply, no forts, they collapse very quickly.

This is all empirical observation.

Do you think this a better / more efficient JFB approach than taking all hexsides, eliminating all retreat and liquidating them in situ en masse in Chungking? Are they more likely to retreat than just up and die in your experience?

ETA: I think it may be too late to implement this approach, as I've long since turned all hexsides and there's no practical way for the Chinese to flip it back.

[btd64]

I held out in CK for almost a year....GP

[PaxMondo]

Much obliged for the advice, Pax. Chengtu is my center of operations for the Central Chinese Plain-built up nicely with beaucoup HQ units to repair and replenish the disruptions from assault efforts and keep forces in supply.

Excellent. I will offer this, I often allow the NW (76,44) hex to be free to allow the CHI forces to retreat to. My experience is that this will often save me a lot of losses. Once the CHI forces are shifted there, no supply, no forts, they collapse very quickly.

This is all empirical observation.

Do you think this a better / more efficient JFB approach than taking all hexsides, eliminating all retreat and liquidating them in situ en masse in Chungking? Are they more likely to retreat than just up and die in your experience?

ETA: I think it may be too late to implement this approach, as I've long since turned all hexsides and there's no practical way for the Chinese to flip it back.

To what GP said, it seems that if you leave an exit, you can displace the forces much easier. Keep that hex 76,44 encircled, and when you take CK, they are still trapped. As I said, all empirical.

And yes, you may no longer be able to execute this tactic.