Let us reform the Red Army of Workers and Peasants! (Advice needed)

[Wiedrock]

One thing I had not realized is that on the production screen, the number of vehicles shown in depots also includes damaged vehicles that are displayed farther down. So if it says you have 150k trucks in the depots and 50k are under repair, you have 100k functional trucks in the depots.

If you try to make sense of the "Depot" figure, try adding up Depots on MAP plus all the truck numbers in the first pages of the TB-cards (the ines you open with the buttons above the map overview).

[Joel Billings]

I assume you are looking at used and unused vehicles. Used does not equate to damaged vehicles. IIRC used are vehicles that were used at some point during the turn to truck goods.

[M60A3TTS]

One thing I had not realized is that on the production screen, the number of vehicles shown in depots also includes damaged vehicles that are displayed farther down. So if it says you have 150k trucks in the depots and 50k are under repair, you have 100k functional trucks in the depots.

If you try to make sense of the "Depot" figure, try adding up Depots on MAP plus all the truck numbers in the first pages of the TB-cards (the ines you open with the buttons above the map overview).

Yep, I was wrong. So the numbers add up exactly when adding in the TBs to the .csv file. The production number isn't just showing on map stuff. Got it, thanks.

[M60A3TTS]

I assume you are looking at used and unused vehicles. Used does not equate to damaged vehicles. IIRC used are vehicles that were used at some point during the turn to truck goods.

Yes I was. Since units in TBs are not on a map, I don't think I want to know the logic around how many trucks the AI allocates to a TB. In this case, ignorance is probably bliss.

[Wiedrock]

Ok, let's tackle the bigger Post....

And yes, I know the difference with "Active" and "Transit" pools; I have quite a few guns in transit pools all the time, but seems like "Active" is the best measure for where you stand vs. requirements. My active pools for Howitzers, Heavy Artillery, AT Guns, etc, are nearly always empty.

It's not about Active/Transit but about seeing what you actually are missing.
You can have 1k in Active and 2k in Transit an still miss 10k which you will only see in the "Ground Elements Map" (that one also takes into account reduced TOEs - so with reduced TOEs it will show less missing). So it is possible you build and build more units needing an Weapon because you see it being present in the Pools which is missleading since you have dozens of units missing it (because they simply do not have freight or manpower or fail rolls for actually emptying the Pools).

Artillery/Rocket:

Another idea, as you suggested, might be to build alot of Heavy Rocket Bn, to at least have something there. I have plenty of Rockets, so it's better than nothing. The only question is whether it's worth the VEHICLE allocation.

Not sure if I rly suggested "Hvy Rocket BATTALIONS" (I was mostly referring to TB stuff, for MAP use we would need an average Hits per Gun to be compared with Artillery (SU) averages to then be combined with the manpower and truck numbers of the SUs to get the true efficiency).
In 1942 since the recent update, you can expect them to be SOMEWHAT (if they have a good battle) equal in Manpower per Hit and Trucks per Hit to the ~122mm'ish Artillery SUs on the attack (but I did not do in depth analysis of that). They have battles where they are about equal in man/trucks per hit and then they have battles where they are only ~50% as effective (so the arty hits 4times more per gun while only needing 2times more per gun compared to rocket)....so no clear answer....
In 1943 this will turn (even) further in favor of Artillery until 01/1944 comes, since Artillery will gain even mroe Ammo while Rockets stay at the same 1941/42/43 Ammo levels. So in 1941+42 it improved to previous versions but they can probably still only be seen as an "alternative" (unless someone comes up with other infos/tests/ways to make them perform (constantly) acceptable).
I have not looked into if this issue of Rockets being bad on the defense in Forts was investigated by the Devs. If it is still around (be it a bug or a intended historical fact of Rockets performing worse in defense[in Forts]), then the Rockets fall even more behind Artillery SUs on the defense.

But despite this, if you rly only have 120+80 Artillery SUs and 60 Armies, that's only ~3 per HQ which is very low, the Rockets would certainly not hurt to be used as addition. But as you yourself hinted before, before that, build the Rocket Brigades/Divisions for more control over them to only be used on attacks(with stacked CPP and so on).
If it is Truck efficient/worth it...well...
I did not look into the Rocket CUs. Maybe they rule with the many MP they have or work different in some way to the SUs...


Mortars:

I would love more Mortar Bn, but I don't have enough of a surplus of 120mm Mortar to do so.....I have about 80 of those Mortar units. I don't think I can go higher without cheating Rifle units, and I don't want to do that.

OK, let's talk mortars...

First off, you don't have 80 mortar battalions, although I'm guessing that isn't what you meant. For clarification, the battalion cap is something like 16.

What you do have probably is 64 regiments either the 42a or 42b brand with a combined total cap space of 122. The 42a type are not motorized and the 42b types are, so the latter is going to be a bigger consumer of vehicles. You can build the 42a regiments in Jan 42 and the 42b's in May 1942. Both will not be eligible to convert to the 43 mortar regiment until July 1943, so there is indeed a long wait there.

42a regiment is a mix of 16 82mm mortars with the same number of 120mm's. The 42b is all 36 120mm's.

So there is something of a tradeoff here, irrespective of competing with infantry units for assets. If you want steel on target, I wouldn't hesitate to take from the infantry and give to the mortars, especially as the mortars flip to guards. Multiple guards mortar regiments with all 120mm tubes can be helpful when supporting ground attacks and are more manpower and vehicle friendly with regards to the artillery class as Wiedrock has shown.

@Q: Sounds reasonable.
@M60: No he means 36gun Battalions, there is no limit on Mortar Battalions (you may mean the Brigades with 144 Mortars?).

I tried figuring out the difference between the 120mm inside Divisions vs SUs. Divisonal Mortars are performing better (with everythign equal) since the Ammo reduction for Artillery is not affecting the Ammo of the Division that much, but the SUs in live games would usually have way more CPP, so I'd say it's about equal on where the 120mm are inside/comming from in the end.


Tanks/AT:

I have actually disbanded almost all AT REGIMENTS. Good idea, or no?

I did this because a) to me they are defensive units, and at this point I would rather direct attach a TANK unit, b) I need the AT guns for Rifle and other units, c) don't want to spend the VEHICLES on them. I feel like Rifle formations have a pretty good amount of AT guns anyway. Thoughts?

I don't think so. (see attached)
a) AT Guns=defense only (definitive 100% true), Tank=offense(in rare cases defense, sometimes also suck in offense)
b) not sure, 45mmm you must have a quadrillion in the Pool, no? The 76mm is what you may need looking into, they mostly enter regular TOEs only in like mid 1944. Those I would propose are worth it to keep AT Regiments around and attach for defensive purpose.
c) yes, 45mm mostly, they also are well suited taking out Panthers later on. Tho I'd say the 76mm is well worth it to get into defensive combat additionally with SUs, as said in b).

I think I am stuck with not really enough Artillery SUs; I haven't been assigning Armor SUs to Army HQ (I always direct attach them) so I suppose I could start doing that just to fill slots.

[...]

ARMOR is a whole different subject in terms of production vs. needs........

As M60 indicates, the Soviet Union produces an obscene amount of KV Tanks. I have 20 Guards Heavy Tank units right now, and still there are nearly 2000 in the pool. I just don't think it's really possible to use them all.

It's nearly the same with MEDIUM Tanks. Medium tank production for me was short through early winter of 1942, then with expansion of T-34 production really went into surplus. The pool is swimming with all types of medium; the Matilda and Valentines aren't really being used[.]

I would submit that the best 76mm artillery is the gun mounted on a T-34 or KV-1. Battle results consistently show that tanks have higher HPE than a lot of artillery types. That is not to say tanks are better than artillery. Firing early in the battle sequence is a big benefit. So it's combined arms all the way. But if we're talking Soviet tank regiment vs light howitzer regiment, I'll take the tank.

Attack, mostly. Defense, it depends. If you are attacked by good Panzers the Tanks completely vanish and perform worse than 76mm Art/AT (funny huh?). That's what I several times hinted at in other Threads.
In the defense they...
1.can underperform,
2.are lost for future attacks,
3.if some are damaged before combat, they will just vanish as well when you retreat, something that does not happen that way (in that scale) with guns.
If you see differences in live games, then likely because you have tanks have other factors improved over others (e.g. more Ammo, ASSAULT, more CPP or the circumstances (the enemy offers) for them to succeed/survive. Or you are looking at attacks.
You can also do the same Soviet attack 5times and sometimes the Tanks get some good rolls and are on the top of HPE and sometimes the enemy just retreats without the Tanks getting seriously involved, so it's rly hard to make definitive statements imo. But the are definitely better on atatcks than AT Guns. So AT Guns defense, Tanks Offense is what I'd say (with many caveats on the tanks).

It's in RECON tanks that there are shortages; I think alot of that is just because RECON tanks evaporate in combat. There aren't enough for open slots, and the engine is substiting T-26s and T-38/40. I don't really care much if RECON tanks aren't filled, because they don't provide much combat value. I actually prefer the T-26 to the T-60, because the gun has a chance to actually kill something. Not sure if others feel the same way about RECON tanks.....it will be a good thing IMO when they start disappearing from TOEs. Thoughts?

They evaporate as all other tanks but the difference is that they simultaneously completely underperform. I'd call it "treshholds" of the combat engine which makes some elements simply underperform because of how RoF/Damage works and further is coded together with (low) MOREX values and such. Since you can't change the TOEs, nor production, nor manually change equipment you just have to ignore them I suppose, they are what they are.

[M60A3TTS]

@M60: No he means 36gun Battalions, there is no limit on Mortar Battalions (you may mean the Brigades with 144 Mortars?).

No I meant the battalions. When checking my own build queue, i saw 16, but that was how many I had, not could build.

Still, the reason I didn't build many was there is something I can't recall about the number of support squads affecting performance. With only 3 support squads, that maybe is an issue?

In any case, battalions can't become guards, so I tend to avoid them.

[Q-Ball]

@M60: No he means 36gun Battalions, there is no limit on Mortar Battalions (you may mean the Brigades with 144 Mortars?).

No I meant the battalions. When checking my own build queue, i saw 16, but that was how many I had, not could build.

Still, the reason I didn't build many was there is something I can't recall about the number of support squads affecting performance. With only 3 support squads, that maybe is an issue?

In any case, battalions can't become guards, so I tend to avoid them.

I mis-spoke on number of Mortar Bn; I have 32 total.

The bigger issue though is that I am out of Mortars in the pool; this is from 12/42 (and is set on ACTIVE pool); as you can see, the Active Pool for Guns is completely empty except for Light Artillery. This includes Mortars, AT Guns (even 45mm), Artillery, Heavy Artillery, everything.

Is this normal?

I think part of the reason is that I have a 7 million man Red Army at this point, so I have alot of Rifle units on the map. Nearly all have their allotment of Mortars, Artillery, and AT Guns (GOOD!), but that's not leaving much left for anything else

I mean, look at all the Zeros......I think this will stabilize somewhat; with the Nov '42 Manpower infusion I created alot of new Rifle Units (because it's the last chance and all), so unit creation will halt in 1943. This hopefully will stabilize some of these pools. I hope?

12-20-42pool.jpg (186.11 KiB) Viewed 414 times

[M60A3TTS]

I mean, look at all the Zeros......I think this will stabilize somewhat; with the Nov '42 Manpower infusion I created alot of new Rifle Units (because it's the last chance and all), so unit creation will halt in 1943. This hopefully will stabilize some of these pools. I hope?

12-20-42pool.jpg

If you're referring to the fact that divisions will no longer appear in the build queue after 1942, it's not really an issue. You can always merge brigades into divisions and then just rebuild the brigades.

[Wiedrock]

45mm.....empty...

[56ajax]

I have reformed the Red Army and I think I have stopped the Axis in 1942.

Any advice or tips on how I go on the offensive? New ground for me.

[Q-Ball]

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[Q-Ball]

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[Q-Ball]

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[Q-Ball]

Congratulations Comrade for Defending the Motherland! Now to expel the fascist invaders.

Yes, I think this is a good topic, since I am in the same spot. As 1942 moves to 1943, what do you need to do to get the Red Army to an offensive force?

The biggest change from 42 to 43, besides morale, is the drop in manpower modifier, and increase in vehicles. The drop in manpower means the Red Army will no longer grow, and will shrink if you are not careful about losses (it gets worse in 1944). The increase in vehicles, however, means you can get more Motorized units on the map. So those two things have to be the trend.

On MANPOWER, you should be getting around 70K a turn......55K-ish in new production, and another 15K or so in Disabled Returns. 70K is not alot, since attrittion will use most of that number, so with heavy fighting you are likely to be moving backwards some turns. And there isn't much help in the reinforcement queue. (In 1944, I think the Red Army has to start making disband choices to keep key units up to strength)

Some things I think are pretty obvious, but for starters my two kopeks right now:

RIFLE UNITS: You need more density to make attacks, so accelerate the consolidation of Rifle Divisions into Corps. Rifle Brigades still useful as attachments, and to farm guards; but not as on-map units. I'm not 100% sure what do with the Naval Infantry Brigades; they are "2nd Choice" SUs to Rifle Brigades, but I have used some. I may disband later if I need the manpower.
GUARDS AIRBORNE: You get 19 of these on 12/42; build them all. They are not Corps, but they are high-quality infantry (+15 morale to a standard Rifle Division)
ARTILLERY: You should have lots of Howitzer Brigades, Army Artillery, etc.....get guns on the map. Artillery Divisions can help with breakthroughs, but are manpower hogs. Heavy Rocket Bde/Division are good units for support.
TANKS: Overall, as manpower production wanes, and you start getting more vehicles, you need to get the Red Army more armored. You can't afford endless "Meat Waves" of Rifle units all the time. Tank units are Manpower efficient for the firepower you get. So, make liberal use of Tank SUs. Every attack should have every slot filled with either Brigades you are farming, or Tank SUs
ASSAULT ENGINEER: You get 24 of these in May 1943; build them all immediately. You need them to crack forts
HEAVY SU: You also need Heavy SUs (122, 152) to crack forts; get those built
MECH CORPS: I wish I had started sooner, but in 1942 you need to be using Mech Brigades to start farming guards, to later get Guards Mech Corps......unlike Tank Corps, they combine mobility AND punch
SUPPLIES: Use the Rail Repair Corps liberally to build Supply Stockpiles; until you have alot of rail to repair, this will be their main purpose (and you should have some Rail Repair independent units anyway). The Red Army consumes much more supply than the Germans do on the attack (more guys and guns), so Supplies are really important to sustain an offensive.


I think I need additional pointers on Fort Busting, beyond what I already know (Engineers, Heavy Guns, etc).....there may be a secret sauce I don't know...anyone else?

[Wiedrock]

GUARDS AIRBORNE: You get 19 of these on 12/42; build them all. They are not Corps, but they are high-quality infantry (+15 morale to a standard Rifle Division)

+5, not +15 (Airborne is +5, if they are GUARDS then another +10 = +15)

HEAVY SU: You also need Heavy SUs (122, 152) to crack forts; get those built

They do not destroy Fortifications, they are neither Minesweeper Tanks, nor Engineering Tanks, nor Artillery.

For Fort Reduction, "Heavy Artillery" works, Rockets also work, Mortars too (120mm at least). I have not yet seen "Medium Field Guns" or "Light Artillery" reduce any Fort Level. "Artillery" on German side I have seen sFH18 work (none normal "Artillery" type worked on Soviet side so far for me), it is possible there is some treshold on a stat/metric that needs to be reached (possibly Anti-Soft Damage?) or which defines the chances. Or Artillery is exempt on Soviet (due to its large numbers(?)) side, also possible.

ASSAULT ENGINEER: You get 24 of these in May 1943; build them all immediately. You need them to crack forts

+figure out how many you need together with Artillery Divisions to reduce a Fort level with some certainty. Soviet Assault Engineers do not have Flamethrowers and therefore are not as broken as Axis Pioneers shooting with 10 Flamethrowers while only owning one.

I think I need additional pointers on Fort Busting, beyond what I already know (Engineers, Heavy Guns, etc).....there may be a secret sauce I don't know...anyone else?

Some thoughts I had, some obviously obvious.

1. Do not "force the push".
2. Don't push through heavily fortified areas without Guards just because you can/you want to. Farm Guards in easy battles.
3. Get good Leaders.
4. Get max. ASSAULT Fronts (watch out to not overstack them).
5. Think about CPP management. Each point of CPP saves few of your men and takes few more enemy men.
6. Understand Fort reduction math. Check for Fort level-% before attacks. (Artillery can't reduce Fort below 1(+50%)).
7. Figure out how many Engineers/Artillery you need to reduce one Fort level (get it below the level's "100%" treshold) with somewhat of a certainty.
8. Be aware about the "without enemy contact only lvl 1 Fort can be build" - e.g. if there's a German Fort 1 which you plan to attack next turn, it is likely if you contact it with a Unit/a friendly Hex, it'll be a Fort lvl 2 next turn.
9. Keep up defensive GS ADs. Occasionally use them in Attacks if rly needed.
10. GA UNIT (if allowed) on tough Hexes you plan to attack.
11. If you attack and Germans have defensive GS on/Fighters flying and you have GS off and your fighters still fly CAP, see if they actually are intercepting any German planes or just dying for nothing, if not, put the AGs to "REST" (don't forget to activate them again for defensive GS).
12. If you rly plan on any type of encirclement'ish, use Recon to find enemy Counters (use: Recon "Interdiction" target/mission, one plane missions per Hex are usually sufficient to spot Counters (as of game Version V1.04.12))
13. Soviet scientists need to figure if/how the reduction of MOR by Air Interdiction works. Could be a "good" (depends) way to let German Units's MOR "follow" the NM decreases.

[56ajax]

Thanks Q-Ball and Wiedrock.

Let me put the question in a different way.

Tank Corps - what are the best SUs to assign and are there any I should never assign.

Cav Corps - what are the best SUs to assign and are there any I should never assign.

Rifle Corps - what are the best SUs to assign and are there any I should never assign.

What are the best units to attack German Tank, Motorised and then Infantry units,

What do I do with Tank HQs

Do Flame Tanks have any use?

Do anti tank units do anything?

Is there any way to use the Soviet Airforce to disrupt Axis supply?

At the moment I am being totally opportunistic and attacking Axis Allies or low value German Units.

[Q-Ball]

Thanks Q-Ball and Wiedrock.

Let me put the question in a different way.

Tank Corps - what are the best SUs to assign and are there any I should never assign.

Cav Corps - what are the best SUs to assign and are there any I should never assign.

Rifle Corps - what are the best SUs to assign and are there any I should never assign.

Wiedrock has more experience than I do, but on attachments I don't think there is a set rule per unit type. Here is my process; may or may not be correct.

Generally, I don't keep SUs attached to units for a long time. If they take losses, they get rotated back to STAVKA.

I look at SUs as either OFFENSIVE or DEFENSIVE

DEFENSIVE SUs, attached when you really need to hold a spot or help out a unit you think is going to be attacked......generally I use AT Regt, Naval Infantry Bde, Ski Units (in heavy snow), or sometimes Heavy Tank Regt (which are auto-guards, and can easily be replaced if destroyed)

OFFENSIVE SUs I am often trying to farm guards. Rifle and Tank Bde, Mech and Mot Bde, and Tank SUs mostly. And on a combat, you want a mix of Infantry and Tanks, so I always try and work tanks in there. I also think as the war progresses, you'll probably want more Tank SUs than Rifle, since you need to conserve manpower. If you are farming aggressively you'll start to hit Infantry and Tank Guards caps anyway, so it will be more about combat balance.

For TANK CORPS, you have to keep in mind that attaching Rifle Units will draw trucks from the pool; you may or may not want to do that. TANK corps definitely do need that extra heft. I tend to attach mostly Tank Brigades if they are on the attack, just to farm them.

Other than that, since attachments for me usually only a last a turn or two, it doesn't matter much to me what is attached to CAV or RIFLE CORPS; it's a matter of what is there for the entire attack as a whole.

I hope I am on target, and that it helps!

[Wiedrock]

Wiedrock has more experience than I do

I do not have experience, I just observe and test.

For TANK CORPS, you have to keep in mind that attaching Rifle Units will draw trucks from the pool; you may or may not want to do that. TANK corps definitely do need that extra heft. I tend to attach mostly Tank Brigades if they are on the attack, just to farm them.

The normal Rifle Brigades (NON-MOT) will increase vehicle needs from aboit 50 to 800, so about x20 when attached to a MOT unit (to quantify it). This I overlooked for ages. Not sure which Leader rating is used for them when attached to a MOT unit this way.

Note that each Leader rolls his own units's final CV. So if you have a Tank leader and a Infantry leader in the same battle it makes sense to put the MOT SUs into the MOT units with the MOT Leader and the NON-MOT SUs with the Inf Leader (if you anyways plan on using a mix). At least when it comes to CV rolls.

What are the best units to attack German Tank, Motorised and then Infantry units,

I think you want a "receipt"/manual a`la, use A against B and C agains D and so on?

Not sure if this can be TLDR'd.

My observation (but do not take it literally/as a fact) is that few (about 100-200) Soviet tanks against similar/larger number of German tanks, tend to fail in "total hits", but will still get some AP hits. But once they are like 500 against 100-200 some more survive the tank combats and seem to start making better hits on soft targets.

Do anti tank units do anything?

In defense the AT guns are fine.

Is there any way to use the Soviet Airforce to disrupt Axis supply?

In 43 I do not think so. Germans will have the FBDs stack Freight, additionally retreating, then the 41 modifiers are long gone. So I don't see this being possible/worthwile.
Interdiction used in a specific way, not as the manual suggests (would need a separate Thread), may still be worthwile (not sure if more worthwile then GA Unit tho).

What do I do with Tank HQs

I think this was topic in the Thread already?!...or it was in Discord....
Good: MOT units attached to them get +1 Admin Leader Rating on rolls (supplies, MPs....).
Questionable: They are small, so SUs will only serve few units and (good) Leaders only serve few units.

Do Flame Tanks have any use?

I never looked at them.

[M60A3TTS]

Always keep in mind that mech and motor brigades are very vehicle intense. When you are gradually committing an increased number of vehicles to cope with increased artillery ammo needs, independent mech and motor brigades start to move to the luxury category, that is to say, you really can't afford a lot of them.

[56ajax]

Thanks Q-Ball, M60 and Wiedrock.

The Axis 1942 offensive took out about 1 Army of my forces. The front line runs roughly from Leningrad to Taganrog with a Eastward bulge South of Tula. I hold kerch.

Most of this line appears rock solid with Axis defensive CV typically > 30. I am not quite certain who to attack, or with what. I try not to move around SUs as it chews up CPP. I am ok at managing trucks.

Perhaps it is just a matter of concentrating my best units with my best commanders.

Does anyone create SUs simply because there is plenty of equipment in the pool?