War in Spain: engine choice makes sense — but I worry the theater choice may hurt the wrong conclusion

[theoracle44]

I realise it's a long way off, but speaking of a global game like World in Flames, I wonder if the engine could support playing individual nations, or at least individual great powers, as well as the option of controlling the whole Axis or all of the Allied Powers? WiF does something like that. An example of why I would like this: I'm interested in the Pacific, and I would absolutely like the rest of the world included in the grand campaign, as some things (e.g. unit withdrawals) would be more dynamic. That being said, in that case I would prefer to have the computer (or another player) manage Germany and the other Axis nations so that I can focus on Japan's perspective. It would make things (relatively) more manageable too.

[Q-Ball]

I was actually joking about a global, 5 NM hex game! That would be insane. WW2 would take longer than the actual war to complete a Grand Campaign Game! I also imagine balancing that game would be a complete nightmare.

War in Med, my original suggestion, seems more digestable....and there are alot of other ones that could be done with this engine as a late-1800s through 1950s engine....tons!

[ham17]

If it's a stepping stone for a future War in the Med, I'll gladly buy War in Spain.

[Lucius Esox]

Having read several books on this conflict I think it is a perfect choice. Not too big and not too small and a complete war not just a campaign.

Can't wait

[terry1040]

I just read all the AARs and the Dev-Stories. How exciting is this?

Similar to you, I was very sceptical about the initial theater, however, now with a better understanding about the engine power and potential, it will be a first day purchase for sure.
BTW, if somebody is really interested in the Spanish Civil War, here is link to a 6-episode-documentary (in english) that is considered the Gold Standard about that period: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lu5f9hp ... kKJWGBNI9I

Please do not let us down with additional theaters.

I do see the BIG potential - maybe not as a complete next generation for WitP-AE, WitW, WitE2 yet, but as a nice stepstone for UV, Med-Wars, Finish, Italian etc as additional DLCs.
Then at some point, if the new enigine has proven its readiness, please take on the BIG THEATERS.

One question about the data management: Will include a possibility to export the turn-by-turn unit data into csv-files so that we could add-on potential anaylytical tools like PowerBI? For such a game, this seems to be a must-have to really analyse your status as a player each turn.

Cheers and I am really looking forward to get my hands on this.

Terry

[Alessandro S.]

....
One question about the data management: Will include a possibility to export the turn-by-turn unit data into csv-files so that we could add-on potential anaylytical tools like PowerBI? For such a game, this seems to be a must-have to really analyse your status as a player each turn.
...
Terry

There is not currently an export tool for unit data to CSV. But I could add one in future updates. The game can already import and export CSV. I wrote my own parser cause the team used different languages of CSV.
And German / English use different signs for separation and thus I had to be able to read in mixed language CSV files where more than one guy worked on data.

So with that code existent, I could add an export system for turn status / unit data.
Will put this on the list of features that got requested.

[potski]

Please do not let us down with additional theaters.

I do see the BIG potential - maybe not as a complete next generation for WitP-AE, WitW, WitE2 yet, but as a nice stepstone for UV, Med-Wars, Finish, Italian etc as additional DLCs.
Then at some point, if the new enigine has proven its readiness, please take on the BIG THEATERS.

Just to point out that WitW, WitE2 are developed by 2By3 and published by Matrix. War in Spain is developed by Joint Warfare Simulations and published by Matrix and Slitherine. And the teams have their own engines and technically might be regarded as competitors.

Yet it's a little confusing as the Joint Warfare Simulations guys mention they worked on WitP:AE and when I go back to it, that is also from 2By3, not Joint Warfare Simulations. So maybe there was a lot of overlap between the two teams over the years, and Joint Warfare Simulations looks to be a new team that grew out of people who worked for 2By3. Joint Warfare Simulations have no previous games published that I can see. The Dev Diary say they worked on War in the Mediterranean, but didn't publish it.

I don't think we'll be getting a WitE3 under this engine, that would impinge on the other team's IP.
But I'm going to be very disappointed if the 52 on Joe's list (love the ambition!) doesn't include WitP2. Maybe that is also a title that still belongs to 2By3 and the guys in Joint Warfare Simulations cannot produce it?

Or maybe (being super optimistic) the two teams have a deal between them of how to produce the next generation of early 20th century (and maybe late 19th century) war games. The fact they both appear under the Matrix/Slitherine umbrella might indicate a degree of cooperation. If nothing else, I would imagine the publisher would want to avoid producing two games competing directly in the same space.

A War in the Mediterranean could be a completely fresh "big theatre", rather than a rehash of WitW and many other games that already do the land war in Libya/Egypt. And on the absolutely epic scale that we loved in WitP:AE

But I like your stepping stones, with everything from Crimea potentially on the table to make Joe's list if the engine using trains, river boats, sailing and coal-fired ships has that scope to go pre-flight.

[AuloeSol]

Please do not let us down with additional theaters.

I do see the BIG potential - maybe not as a complete next generation for WitP-AE, WitW, WitE2 yet, but as a nice stepstone for UV, Med-Wars, Finish, Italian etc as additional DLCs.
Then at some point, if the new enigine has proven its readiness, please take on the BIG THEATERS.

Just to point out that WitW, WitE2 are developed by 2By3 and published by Matrix. War in Spain is developed by Joint Warfare Simulations and published by Matrix and Slitherine. And the teams have their own engines and technically might be regarded as competitors.

Yet it's a little confusing as the Joint Warfare Simulations guys mention they worked on WitP:AE and when I go back to it, that is also from 2By3, not Joint Warfare Simulations. So maybe there was a lot of overlap between the two teams over the years, and Joint Warfare Simulations looks to be a new team that grew out of people who worked for 2By3. Joint Warfare Simulations have no previous games published that I can see. The Dev Diary say they worked on War in the Mediterranean, but didn't publish it.

I don't think we'll be getting a WitE3 under this engine, that would impinge on the other team's IP.
But I'm going to be very disappointed if the 52 on Joe's list (love the ambition!) doesn't include WitP2. Maybe that is also a title that still belongs to 2By3 and the guys in Joint Warfare Simulations cannot produce it?

Or maybe (being super optimistic) the two teams have a deal between them of how to produce the next generation of early 20th century (and maybe late 19th century) war games. The fact they both appear under the Matrix/Slitherine umbrella might indicate a degree of cooperation. If nothing else, I would imagine the publisher would want to avoid producing two games competing directly in the same space.

A War in the Mediterranean could be a completely fresh "big theatre", rather than a rehash of WitW and many other games that already do the land war in Libya/Egypt. And on the absolutely epic scale that we loved in WitP:AE

But I like your stepping stones, with everything from Crimea potentially on the table to make Joe's list if the engine using trains, river boats, sailing and coal-fired ships has that scope to go pre-flight.

This game is a first day purchase for me. Also, i wish War in Spain is a sucess and this empowers Joint Warfare Simulations to pursue higher goals.

One thing they have to fix is the UI. What we have seen is, honestly, horrible. I mean, copying the WitP UI (wich was already outdated in the 2000s) is a terrible commercial decision.

I am fully aware that for a small group of developers in a niche market, spending time and money in graphics is kind of a luxury. But I am not asking for 3d league of legends kind of graphics. Something like WitE will do.

I hope that 2By3, Matrix, Slitherine or someone in the industry gives a hand to Joint Warfare Simulations on this. Maybe leting them to use the graphic resources of WitE (since it seems the saga will not continue) but please, consider this. Old farts like me and others will buy this game no matter how it looks. But old wargamers are dying and without something more appealing, new players will not get into this kind of wargames.

[jwilkerson]

Just to point out that WitW, WitE2 are developed by 2By3 and published by Matrix. War in Spain is developed by Joint Warfare Simulations and published by Matrix and Slitherine. And the teams have their own engines and technically might be regarded as competitors.

Yet it's a little confusing as the Joint Warfare Simulations guys mention they worked on WitP:AE and when I go back to it, that is also from 2By3, not Joint Warfare Simulations. So maybe there was a lot of overlap between the two teams over the years, and Joint Warfare Simulations looks to be a new team that grew out of people who worked for 2By3. Joint Warfare Simulations have no previous games published that I can see. The Dev Diary say they worked on War in the Mediterranean, but didn't publish it.

Some History !

AE was done by "Henderson Field Designs". 2by3 got billing because we started with their code base from WITP and then heavily modified the code and the data but 2by3 did not actually work on AE. though they certainly created the UV/WITP code base we started with (which they provided to us). Henderson Field Designs was a group of modders from the WITP forum. Most of them (including me) were from a modder GROUP called "CHS" (Combined Historical Scenario) which included (its been a few weeks, so I might forget some) Andrew Brown, Andy Mac, BigJ62, Don Bowen, Ian (TheElf). Treespider, MichaelM, Kereguelen, Brady, etc. oh and me

WIS is done by "Joint Warfare Simulations" ... which is about half of the same guys who did AE - including me. 2by3 has not worked on WIS (or our new engine).

The names "Henderson Field Designs" and "Joint Warfare Simulations" are "fictitious" names. But represent a number of the same people and the same underlying company (which hasn't published its name).

technically might be regarded as competitors

We view ourselves as Allies ! For instance = we strive to avoid working on competing titles.


Here's a post I made right after AE released, detailing all team members and their roles: https://forums.matrixgames.com/viewtop ... 3&t=159838

[potski]

Some History !
....

Thanks for the history, Joe. Very thorough as always. And glad to see that came with a lot of working together and still Allies in the wider war to bring us the best in war gaming. But you still have your own identities and distinct games you are working on. And maybe your Ally might agree to you producing AE2 under your new engine. We can hope

[sfbaytf]

Didn't have any interest in the subject so I didn't really look until I saw it was built on WitP style. Keeping an eye on it. Would love to see Burma and less other followed theaters covered. On one hand I appreciate the fact that a lesser covered subject is covered.

I'll probably buy eventually, perhaps at a time when its on sale.

One thing that caught my eye when watching a youtube video today is the fact its built on 32 bit code completely and AI is heavily involved if video is accurate. Not sure if 32 bit code will have problems with modern 64 bit systems and O/S in any way.

[RangerJoe]

Didn't have any interest in the subject so I didn't really look until I saw it was built on WitP style. Keeping an eye on it. Would love to see Burma and less other followed theaters covered. On one hand I appreciate the fact that a lesser covered subject is covered.

I'll probably buy eventually, perhaps at a time when its on sale.

One thing that caught my eye when watching a youtube video today is the fact its built on 32 bit code completely and AI is heavily involved if video is accurate. Not sure if 32 bit code will have problems with modern 64 bit systems and O/S in any way.

I don't have a problem on my laptop.

[cristianwj]

As a player from WITP and WITE era, I was genuinely thrilled when I came across the theme of the Spanish Civil War. For many years, mainstream wargames have predominantly focused on well-known battlefields like World War I and World War II, to the point where I, as a player, have grown somewhat weary of them. I have long looked forward to a wargame centered on a relatively lesser-known conflict—even one that took place in South America or Africa. Of course, I also understand the commercial concerns involved. However, given that the Spanish Civil War served as a laboratory for the outbreak of World War II, I believe it would be a great thing if this game could lay the groundwork for future new titles.

Moreover, for me, wargames are more like a good companion to reading historical books. The more niche the theme of a wargame, the more it inspires me to explore wars from different perspectives—understanding why a conflict broke out in a certain part of the world, what the people involved stood for, and what the war ultimately brought to each side and how it has shaped the world we live in today.

[RangerJoe]

I like the smaller size of the game area, it makes the game go faster. But with a different theater along with an increased variety of resources and industries, it should take a lot longer.

[Q-Ball]

My two pesetas.....I am an American, and so don't have a particular connection to the Spanish Civil War like many of our Spanish and European friends do. That being said, this area has always been a personal interest of mine (Civil Wars, by nature, are inherently interesting), and nobody before now has released a viable war game on this topic

This one is FINALLY the first on the Spanish Civil War.

So, bravo!

[FirstPappy]

Would gladly buy if I knew an "Axis invades Spain scenario" (Franco refuses Hitler's ultimatum after fall of France) was planned. Main players would be Germany, Italy, Great Britain and of course Spain with Gibralter being a key objective.

[RangerJoe]

Would gladly buy if I knew an "Axis invades Spain scenario" (Franco refuses Hitler's ultimatum after fall of France) was planned. Main players would be Germany, Italy, Great Britain and of course Spain with Gibralter being a key objective.

You could always design one.

[RedwoodForest]

My two pesetas.....I am an American, and so don't have a particular connection to the Spanish Civil War like many of our Spanish and European friends do. That being said, this area has always been a personal interest of mine (Civil Wars, by nature, are inherently interesting), and nobody before now has released a viable war game on this topic

This one is FINALLY the first on the Spanish Civil War.

So, bravo!

In case you were unaware, there's this: https://wargameds.com/collections/squad ... -civil-war

I can't speak to it, as I only have one of the other Squad Battles games.

[bradfordkay]

I will echo the hope that this is a prelude to War In The Mediterranean. I may have confused him with someone else, but IIRC Alessandro attempted to create just such a game with the original WITP engine so many years ago.

[PetrOs]

I will buy it tonight!

I would also suggest Russo-japanese war. And I happen to be an expert in it, writing articles on it, consulting several scale model companies, having my own scale model kits, and also knowing dozens of russian researchers on the topic. Drop me a message if it can help.