Sea of Japan Crisis - Standing Fast, 1985 -- new beta for testing

[Nikel]

Yes, right now is too easy to sink the Chinese Naval Groups and get the triumph, even though did not get it the first time

Chinese warships are very powerful in AShM however if you sink them first with ACs, they are useless.

I am biased now because I know the capabilities of both sides.


Forcing the Japanese to remain in station is a good idea for my trick, removing points if you are not in the same box where the Chinese warships try to go? Even so I would add Maizuru and Sasebo Naval Bases.


The problems with the Chinese ACs is not easy to solve in 1985, of course if they had no tankers means there were also not fighters/bombers that could refuel.

There is a Type 053K Jiangdong Frigate in the db, it is armed with the missile you commented, HQ-61B, very short range though compared with the Japanese AShM. It is the more realistic. The warship is present since 1975 and the missile since 1987, according to the db.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chinese_frigate_Yingtan


I created a bug report for the PS-1 due to the DS, because you may lose control of the AC while engaging subs. I would remove the DS from their sensor list to avoid it.

https://forums.matrixgames.com/viewtopic.php?t=415125

[Mgellis]

Just uploaded version 3.

The changes include the primary mission now involves keeping the surface group on station. I've added a few extra aircraft to Japan, but have given them long initial ready times to simulate aircraft undergoing maintenance. I've also modified how the Chinese aircraft fit into the scenario...expect the H-6s to be somewhat more aggressive. Scoring is also a little tougher...Triumph now requires 900 points (yes, you can do it, but you have to keep your losses to an absolute minimum and take out those bombers if you can). I've modified the briefing as well, so I hope it explains the mission and its constraints a little better.

As always, please let me know what you think. Are there other corrections or changes that should be made, or is it ready for the Community Scenario Pack?

Thanks!

[Nikel]

v3 tested.

This time major victory with 850 points.




SPOILERS ALERT.


The bombers are indeed more active this time.

However some of the land attacks on the radars are suicidal because they are too much distant from China. And of course, because even yellow, they are easy to identify as they fly in pairs.

Regarding the 4 Badgers that are on a maritime strike, perhaps there is a problem with them. They seem unable to drop the bombs.

Switched sides in a save. The Japanese warship is hostile because already shot down 1 of them, however is not attacked. Bug or is it because is a Skunk and not identified properly?

NB.gif (1.77 MiB) Viewed 231 times

1 PS-1 was shot down while trying to identify properly the Chinese warships. This was not happening before, and is a good change.

However they are as vulnerable as they were to the ASM-1 and to the torpedos despite the changes in the composition. I used even some rockets to test.

The subs were hunted. The Japanese ships in position.

So let the time run, not end of message/victory appeared.

The bombers still attacked more radars when I was just waiting for the end.

A number of hours by the ships are required on station for the 100 points event to fire. This is the task of the scenario, is it not better to end it when it happens? To avoid these last attacks that are useless and frustrating.

AS OF: 11-Jan-85 05:02:06

SIDE: Japan
===========================================================

LOSSES:
-------------------------------
1x PS-1
1x Radar (AN/FPS-20A)
2x Radar (J/FPS-1)
1x Radar (J/FPS-2)


EXPENDITURES:
------------------
6x 127mm HVAR Rocket
4x AIM-7E Sparrow III
4x ASM-1 [Type 80]
23x J/HQS-32B CASS [AN/SSQ-50]
13x J/HQS-6 Jezebel LOFAR [AN/SSQ-41B]
3x Mk46 LWT Mod 2
7x RIM-7H Sea Sparrow
2x RUR-5A Mod 4 ASROC RTT [Type 73]
12x Type 72



SIDE: China
===========================================================

LOSSES:
-------------------------------
5x H-6C Badger
4x Type 021 Huangfeng [Pr.205 Osa I Copy]
2x Type 033 Romeo
2x Type 051 Luda I [106 Xian]
1x Type 053H Jianghu I [516 Jiujiang]
1x Type 053K Jiangdong [531 Yingtan]


EXPENDITURES:
------------------
21x 25mm/60 Twin Burst [20 rnds]
120x FAB-500M-54 GPB
6x FQF-2500 Anti-Torpedo Depth Charge Salvo [12 rnds]
7x Generic Chaff Salvo [4x Cartridges]
3x HQ-61B
2x Yu-4A



SIDE: Neutrals
===========================================================

LOSSES:
-------------------------------


EXPENDITURES:
------------------

[schweggy]

Regarding the 4 Badgers that are on a maritime strike, perhaps there is a problem with them. They seem unable to drop the bombs.

-------------
I notice this as well.... it may require modifying the mission to use flightplans and assigning one Badger, or two, to each ship in the strike mission. So, you'd have 3 separate missions to attack 3 separate targets rather than have them lumped together. It is weird that the bombers can obviously see the target, but don't attack. I think, and I may be wrong, but that's almost always a WRA issue.

Anyway, I played through V.3 yesterday and scored a Triumph. Only lost one radar installation and one Recon plane.

[Nikel]

It is related with the weather, clouds and altitude.

if you change it to clear, they will bomb from that altitude (around 9500 m in my case) once the ship is considered hostile.

However it is not, so you have to change the altitude manually to around 3000 m and they will bomb. Of course the Badgers are also more vulnerable to attack.

I suppose this is a missing feature in the AI, not able to see the target clearly, let's go down.


Clear sky.

Clear.gif (2.51 MiB) Viewed 187 times

And this is I thing another error. In this test, there is still one of the Badgers with bombs, instead of engaging the hostile ship classified by the sub, they will go after the yellow one, that was contacted more than an hour ago, and that of course it is not there. When the contact finally disappears, they will stop circling and engage the third ship.

AIWT.png (117.92 KiB) Viewed 182 times

[Mgellis]

Okay, I think I see what I need to do. You can't set altitudes in maritime strike missions. I'll have to rewrite this as a patrol mission (where you can set altitudes for search areas) but require a trigger (someone spots the ships) before the bombers launch. I'll try that out and see what happens.

[later edit...this seems to work]

I have also added off-axis attacks for the other bomber missions, so that may help.

[later edit] I also modified the targets for the bombers slightly so they are focused on the most outlying Japanese targets, reducing their exposure to danger.

Anything else that needs to be changed?

It is related with the weather, clouds and altitude.

if you change it to clear, they will bomb from that altitude (around 9500 m in my case) once the ship is considered hostile.

However it is not, so you have to change the altitude manually to around 3000 m and they will bomb. Of course the Badgers are also more vulnerable to attack.

I suppose this is a missing feature in the AI, not able to see the target clearly, let's go down.

[Nikel]

You can't set altitudes in maritime strike missions.

Do you know why this option is not available in this type of mission?

[Mgellis]

I'm not sure. I think it's because you can set altitudes for specific waypoints in strike missions, but in a maritime strike mission you don't always know where the waypoints will be because your targets may be moving.

In effect, a patrol mission with a "target spotted" trigger creates a strike mission where you can set things like your attack altitude once a target is spotted. In this case, of course, someone else has to spot the target, but then the bomber seems to fly to the right location, etc.

It's possible if I set the radar to active in a maritime strike mission (you can set EMCON) you would detect the target at high altitude and then swoop down to see what it is, but I'm not sure. In any event, the current fix seems to be working.

I'll upload version 4 soon so people can test it out. I'm also curious how people will respond to the minor changes I made in the other bomber missions (I think it will be slightly harder to stop them now).

You can't set altitudes in maritime strike missions.

Do you know why this option is not available in this type of mission?

[Mgellis]

Version 4 uploaded. Hopefully, this is the final version.

Any thoughts on this one? Is it ready for the Community Scenario Pack or are there other changes, corrections, etc. needed? Thanks!