Abusing the Disband Feature

[Q-Ball]

The engine allows you to pretty freely disband any land unit in a friendly town. That's handy for things like captured booty, or even the small static garrison units (if you want to save the manpower). No problem there. But can this feature be abused?

Imagine this scenario: 20,000 Republican troops are besieged in Malaga. The Nationalists are about to win, and there is is no escape. So, the Republican player just disbands the entire garrison, saving all the manpower and equipment into the pool, where it can be re-used later. POOF!

Am I right that there is no limitation on this?

If Manpower and equipment are meant to be structural limitations for the Republic (and they should be), then this could be a problem unless there is a limitation I am not seeing

[Funguy117]

If you have an enemy in your hex, if I am correct with understanding the manual, you cannot disband. LCU must be one hex away (not in a hex with an enemy). This helps stop the cheese.

For your example of a town under siege, disband would not be possible for two reasons.

Enemy in Hex and no connection back to a base; as the base they are at is surrounded the base would NOT be connected.
In this case you would not be able to disband, get supply only from the local siege base and no replacement would arrive.

Hope this helps!
I am learning too so let me know if you see any issues.
Thanks

[Q-Ball]

I've disbanded units that have an enemy in the hex.....I should do it again to see if the devices end up in the pool, but I bet they do

I'd like to hear from the Devs and Testers on this.......otherwise a House Rule might be in order vs. Humans

(Obviously you can choose to do it or not vs. AI)

[Funguy117]

I agree, to be clear when disbanding with enemy in the same Hex is it RSV you are disbanding or a combat unit?

[btd64]

I've disbanded units that have an enemy in the hex.....I should do it again to see if the devices end up in the pool, but I bet they do

I'd like to hear from the Devs and Testers on this.......otherwise a House Rule might be in order vs. Humans

(Obviously you can choose to do it or not vs. AI)

Post this as a bug in the tech sub forum. Include saves before and after. Also, screenshot's of the pool before and after....GP

[Q-Ball]

I agree, to be clear when disbanding with enemy in the same Hex is it RSV you are disbanding or a combat unit?

Combat Unit

I have no issue with disbanding RSV, that's not "gamey"

[Q-Ball]

OK here is an example; I am about to get overwhelmed in the village of Zarate, in Republica Del Norte. Before disbanding, here is the pool of "PSOE-UGT MILITIA SQDS"; these are rifles and whatnot issued to Socialist Milita. There are 55 in the pool:

Disband1.jpg (113.18 KiB) Viewed 224 times

Now, I go to a UGT Militia Bn that has 36 of these devices....not wanting to lose them all, I disband the unit:

Disband2.jpg (342.55 KiB) Viewed 224 times

Let's check back on the pool; we now have 91 of those devices in the pool. I have successfully disbanded a unit in the same hex as an opposing unit, and those devices are now in a wharehouse in Bilbao (or wherever):

Disband3.jpg (95.26 KiB) Viewed 224 times

Now, the curious thing is that the MANPOWER pool DID NOT CHANGE. So while the devices ended up in the pool, all the men associated with the unit are gone. IS THAT WAD?

If the MANPOWER is not saved, it doesn't make much sense to disband units then anyway, expect if it's a very rare or needed device (like an artillery piece); if I lose the Manpower, I'm not going to do that just to get some rifles in the device pool.

ALSO: The Manual states you cannot DISBAND a unit that has a withdrawl date. That is not true; you can. I've done it.

[Funguy117]

This is a good find, I would do as btd64 says.
This dev is on another level with numbers and abstraction; I just don’t believe they would allow this unless intended. The numbers from your post also make me think this is not intended, as well you pointed out the you can disband withdraw dated LCUs.

Definitely report it as it will only help improve the game!

Thanks for the chat!

[RangerJoe]

It is WAD since to my understanding the devices contain the manpower.

Disperse! Make your way to the rendezvous point!

It happened more than once. I could see where some of the heavier equipment could not make it out of an encirclement but it also depends upon the enemy forces and where they are for any retreat. This would also mean hexside control which the defenders may be able to open up an escape route.

[Dreamslayer]

Now, the curious thing is that the MANPOWER pool DID NOT CHANGE. So while the devices ended up in the pool, all the men associated with the unit are gone. IS THAT WAD?

If the MANPOWER is not saved, it doesn't make much sense to disband units then anyway, expect if it's a very rare or needed device (like an artillery piece); if I lose the Manpower, I'm not going to do that just to get some rifles in the device pool.

Maybe I'm wrong but currently the Manpower isn't using for creating combat elements. The Manpower centers is only produce Workers. Also the Manpower can be used to expand some Industry. There are only scenarios with very simple production model.

[Dali101]

Man power has no meaning for creating units. This is governed by the editor and the availability of devices in the pool.

Disbanding units on the hex where the fight is taking place.
It depends on who controls the hex. If the player, it works.
If the enemy, it doesn't.
(at least it should be like that...)

[Q-Ball]

Man power has no meaning for creating units. This is governed by the editor and the availability of devices in the pool.

Disbanding units on the hex where the fight is taking place.
It depends on who controls the hex. If the player, it works.
If the enemy, it doesn't.
(at least it should be like that...)

What is MANPOWER then used for? Does it have a meaning in the game?

14.8.1.3 says that MANPOWER is necessary to expand both industry and the ARMED FORCES

If it does not factor into unit creation, does it somehow factor into replacements?

And if not either, does it not matter at all for the Army? Is it just Civilians you can bomb?

If that is the case, the only on-map production that truly matters is Light Industry/Supply (and some Fuel/Coal)....is that correct?

[RangerJoe]

Man power has no meaning for creating units. This is governed by the editor and the availability of devices in the pool.

Disbanding units on the hex where the fight is taking place.
It depends on who controls the hex. If the player, it works.
If the enemy, it doesn't.
(at least it should be like that...)

What is MANPOWER then used for? Does it have a meaning in the game?

14.8.1.3 says that MANPOWER is necessary to expand both industry and the ARMED FORCES

If it does not factor into unit creation, does it somehow factor into replacements?

And if not either, does it not matter at all for the Army? Is it just Civilians you can bomb?

If that is the case, the only on-map production that truly matters is Light Industry/Supply (and some Fuel/Coal)....is that correct?

Apparently, at this point in time with this game, the answer is yes.