Game Editor

[Dreamslayer]

The game editor in the current state looks archaic. I do understand that this part of the game has lowest priority for the Devs but ignoring it imakes the work of scenario designers much more difficult. Also it will push away various modders. I hope that the game editor will get some attention.
Some “issues” of the editor (imho):

1) The game editor has many “sections” (like “Pilots”, “Aircraft” etc). All these “sections” except of “Scenario” are lists. Many of them are really huge. It’s very difficult to search/navigate in it and as the result – harder to edit.
Last years I spent much time for researches and modding in one wargame. This old wargame seria also has own game editors. One of them its OOB Editor.
Its structure:

0001.jpg (791.13 KiB) Viewed 411 times

The search/navigation in it is very simple. You can make any blocks/groups, sub-groups. Its Panzer Campaign seria. There is free demo, just download it for better look on its OOB editor (its capabilities). Or newer game seria (similar but other scale) – Panzer Battles. It also has free demo and similar OOB editor.

Here is my some kind of example. Aircraft secttion (fighters/fifgter-bombers) from WiS made by that editor. How it looks as a structure.

air.jpg (285.49 KiB) Viewed 411 times

2) ID’s. Currently ID’s strictly tied to the lines (places in the lists). Its also not ok in some cases. In that other editor the each new “element” receives ID regardless of the line (place). Each new element receives free ID number and you can cut-out this element and paste to anywhere in the structure without ID change.

3) Excess data. The game has name “War in Spain” but the data has various excess info. You can find British ships or nations like Japan and many more. Its a difficult to work with data when you have it. Why do need to keep it in the editor? Its not Wikipedia. If you think that this excess data needed for something – just place it separately (to SCV files or somewhere else).

4) Separate scenarios should to have only data which they actually use. Like the tutorial scenario should not have data about 1937-39 or from other areas.

5) The editor need simple option to copy parts of the data from one scenario and paste to other. E.g. you want to copy some aircraft models from scenario 1 to new custom scenario. No need to add everything.

6) Some sections need to split to parts. Make new sections or “sub-sections” inside the current.
E.g.:
Devices – split it to ground devices/ship devices/aircraft devices
LCU – split to LCU and TOE

[Piteas]

I've suffered (and still suffer) a lot with this editor, yes to all your ideas.

However, it's not a priority right now.

[Carew]

The editor is not easy to use. In fact the WitPAE editor is a breeze compared to this. When I made my carrier mod what should have taken around 30 minutes to complete actually took closer to two hours because the editor locked up multiple times and even crashed twice when saving.

I do like the extra ship data of nations not directly involved in the SCW being included in the editor. As I understand it there will be more games made with this engine so to remove this data seems counterproductive when chances are it will have to be added again for future games.

[Dali101]

I'm quite happy with the editor, I have no problem with it.

When you've been working in it for 5 years, you'll be fine too.

[Dreamslayer]

I'm quite happy with the editor, I have no problem with it.

When you've been working in it for 5 years, you'll be fine too.

What if by the improved game editor you could be done the work much quicker?

Come on.
Lets look on "Pilots" section in the current editor. You have to spent much more time for this UI.
Now look on the my example with using the other editor (there is the book - Abrosov S. V. "The Air War in Spain. Chronicle of Air Battles 1936-1939". 2008, 608 pages. names of these 15 pilots are from there)

Pilots.jpg (330.17 KiB) Viewed 364 times

You can normally group "items" (pilots in this case). You don't need to waste 30 mins for scrolling and you don't need to call Sherlock Holmes for search something in the endless list. You can close non-needed parts.
It seems like most of wargame studios only focused on own projects and never look around.

[IcemanTactics]

You can export everything into a csv and change things that way, so you can sort etc. just import it back in after

Also, you can look at the map while you are editing, just hit load map then esc

[potski]

I'm quite happy with the editor, I have no problem with it.

When you've been working in it for 5 years, you'll be fine too.

What if by the improved game editor you could be done the work much quicker?

Come on.
Lets look on "Pilots" section in the current editor. You have to spent much more time for this UI.
Now look on the my example with using the other editor (there is the book - Abrosov S. V. "The Air War in Spain. Chronicle of Air Battles 1936-1939". 2008, 608 pages. names of these 15 pilots are from there)
Pilots.jpg
You can normally group "items" (pilots in this case). You don't need to waste 30 mins for scrolling and you don't need to call Sherlock Holmes for search something in the endless list. You can close non-needed parts.
It seems like most of wargame studios only focused on own projects and never look around.

I wrote an editor like that in VB.Net about a dozen years ago for Hearts of Iron 3. It took the text files used by the OOB of that game and displayed it in that structured format with drag and drop and buttons to add/remove units and change their position in the hierarchy. That looks like others later copied my design for other games

With the DAT file format used in War in Spain then direct editing like that would not be possible (HOI3 used all config files in text, which made for easy modding, but was really poor for game loading times). And notice the developer's own tools are fully integrated into the executable, not an unsupported add-in. For them to change it, they would have to rewrite those parts of the executable in a format that they haven't even given us in the main game, and then re-issue the whole game files.

You can export everything into a csv and change things that way, so you can sort etc. just import it back in after

Also, you can look at the map while you are editing, just hit load map then esc

Both excellent to know. I had overlooked both, and wondered why I had a button to load the map that seemed to do nothing. I never tried hitting Esc And had bitched to the developers about why I couldn't do what I could in WitP:AE and easily switch between editing and viewing the map.

With the buttons for export/import once you have the files in a text format then you can easily write an editor for them. Though, to be honest, having used the editor a lot in WitP:AE I got used to it, and they have pretty much stuck with that format, so I had not even really noticed the CSV option.

For any casual modder, I don't see a big problem. If they don't like the Dev's inbuilt editor they can use a spreadsheet. And while I agree that the Tutorial Scenario should not display 1937-39 data, it is fairly easily corrected for anyone who feels strongly about it. I understand why the developers prefer to have all of the Scenario files pretty much identical otherwise managing changes to them becomes much harder. So they have all of the base details even in Scenarios that cover only part of the map etc.

[Dreamslayer]

For any casual modder, I don't see a big problem. If they don't like the Dev's inbuilt editor they can use a spreadsheet.

When you export the data to the spreadsheet, some parts show the numbers instead of nation (its like an example). So you can't just transfer it and edit.

And while I agree that the Tutorial Scenario should not display 1937-39 data, it is fairly easily corrected for anyone who feels strongly about it. I understand why the developers prefer to have all of the Scenario files pretty much identical otherwise managing changes to them becomes much harder. So they have all of the base details even in Scenarios that cover only part of the map etc.

Its not just about the Tutorial Scenario. There are too much data about things which have absolutely nothing related to Spanish Civil War. Like data about CV's and other ships of nations which was not part of the war. In the parametres of the editor you can see Japan, Canada, USA. It gives feeling that I'm playing the demo/beta version of War in Pacific 2. And some parts of the game manual cornfirm it, parts which say about things that are not in the game.
Even more. This needless data (like CV's and other ships) not just in the game editor, it also in the game (Plane and Weapon Database / Naval Database). So you have more useless game sreens. Why? Do players who play WiS should to enjoy by data about radars of 1945?
Something really wrong and I see no perspectives for the normal modding. And the absence of any normal mods is proof of that. Although the game was released on January 22.
If the Spanish Inquisition still existed today, it would use this editor as one of the options for torture.