3:1 odds doesn't make Allies surrender?

[Damien Thorn]

I made shock attack on an American position and got 3:1 odds. Still, I took many more casualties and the Americans didn't surrender. I thought if you got 2:1 (plus fortification level) you would force them to surrender. Since I controlled the base, they didn't have any fortifications so why didn't they surrender?

[SunDevil_MatrixForum]

I just lost Wake Island with 3:1 odds. I was pissed. [:D]

[RPK]

hey sorry for being off topic, but where did you get the rising sun base icon?

[Damien Thorn]

It's on Spooky's website. I forgot the URL but he has it in the footer of all of his posts. Just search for one of his posts.

[SunDevil_MatrixForum]

It could be a random element. On Wake Island again, (I reloaded the turn) I was able to hold on with 3:1 odds. So that is another example of the allies holding when shocked attacked with 3:1 odds.

[Damien Thorn]

A couple of turns later: 18 to 1 odds and I still lose more men than the AI. I am playing on 'hard' but the AI is not supposed to get any combat bonsus so I don't think that has anything to do with it. What's going on here?

[SunDevil_MatrixForum]

What is your disruption and fatigue level of your troops?

[Damien Thorn]

ORIGINAL: SunDevil

What is your disruption and fatigue level of your troops?

Disruption is under 5 for all of my attacking units and fatigue is under 15. Since I have been bombing his units for weeks, I assume they are highly disrupted.

[Damien Thorn]

I just peeked at the AI's side. He has a total of 21 squads that are not disdabled. I am attacking with over 300. True, is guys have more experience but that shouldn't make a difference with such a huge numerical advantage.

I think the Allies are using the same code that the Japanese are supposed to use. i.e. that they never surrender.

60-1 odds now.

[SunDevil_MatrixForum]

Nope, in the AAR's I have read, the allies surrender just fine. This is very weird though.

[Damien Thorn]

Finally, some of the allied units are starting to surrender. I needed pretty high odds though. This is very different from UV, to say the least.

[2Stepper]

Just posing a thought here as I'm a bit stumped too... But isn't there a MAJOR penalty for sea-born invasions? I mean you're basically laid out there with your cheese in the breeze on the beach while the defenders are on the beach in bunkers and other revetments... It might explain SOME of the toughness of the defenders... Still sounds like it went on a tad long...


UNLESS... Did you have a lot of support troops? The actual odds of combat troops may have been more like only 10-1. Granted you still should have mopped the beaches probably, but it would explain more of your losses... You did obvously win though which is good...

[Mr.Frag]

Final odds and Actual odds are not the same thing. Looking at your losses, that was a failed attack, you just had a heck of a lot of troops to shift the odds into displaying a non 0:1 result.

[Damien Thorn]

ORIGINAL: Mr.Frag

Final odds and Actual odds are not the same thing. Looking at your losses, that was a failed attack, you just had a heck of a lot of troops to shift the odds into displaying a non 0:1 result.

I would think that "Final odds" would be the final number that determins success or failure. If not, what is the point of displaying any odds at all if they are not real. Anyway, I hope this was just a fluke. I don't mind a magic odds number different than the 2-1 we are used to from UV, but I would like to know what it is at least.

2Stepper, I wasn't the one invading so any invasion penalty would have only helped me, but since they had landed many days earlier is shouldn't matter in this case.

[Mr.Frag]

I would think that "Final odds" would be the final number that determins success or failure.

No, they just determine whether or not your attack order gets cancelled and give you a good indication of whether you can press on or need to rethink what you are doing.

The excessive losses Japan took and the minimal losses on the Allied side clearly show it at a failure. The fact that the number of troops are so out of balance results in the 2:1 even though it was a failure.

I bring a million farmers with pitch forks and throw them at your 1000 hardened vets, you are still going to loose but the odds are grossly in your favour and you will kill 500,000 of my pitch fork boys. Since I still have 500,000 left, I end up with the odds.

[Cmdrcain]

I had Japanese get 295-1 Odds and Allied didn't Surrender, they did Retreat through.

If theres a retreat chance I'd guess no surrender but if cannot move/retreat then a surrender, not much different then in Original Pacwar.

Of Course Japanese are different its no surrender... but maybe mass hari kari Or whatever its spelled.