How many PzKpfw-IIIe's does it take to kill one Matilda II in a turn

brianleeprice · Post by **brianleeprice** » Sat Dec 29, 2001 6:34 pm

MC:NA, defending the pass - a single Matilda II absorbed all the point blank fire 17 PzKpfw-IIIe's could dish out - almost.

After a couple near misses by an 88, point blank assault by ATR team, assorted infantry and machine gun fire, bombarded by a 81mm mortar, and fired upon with every shell four PzKpfw-IVd's standing off from the cliff top could deliver - the IIIe's charged!

Surrounding the Matilda II on both flanks and rear, the IIIe's dished out a mad minute of point blank fire. All rounds from all tanks had been exhausted upon the beast save two rounds, the next to the last round was a vulnerable hit from the rear at point blank range and the Matilda exploded - or simply fell apart from metal fatigue I'm really not sure.

If those beasts had decent guns, Rommel would've been but a footnote in some history book somewhere!

Just for laughs,
Brian

Les_the_Sarge_9_1 · Post by **Les_the_Sarge_9_1** » Sat Dec 29, 2001 8:05 pm

Now you know how we Allies players feel about (insert tirade here) Tigers and Panther tanks eh.

Best way to get players to stop worshiping Tiger and Panther late war games, is to get equal time forcing the elitist German players to play in France 1940 now and then.

Nothing like taking a column of Matildas and giving an over confident German player, used to getting results, a sound thrashing eh what!

So you you had to surround the Matilda, big deal. get over it heheh, doesnt bother us Matilda fans at all hehe. Gotta love them Matildas.

Warrior · Post by **Warrior** » Sat Dec 29, 2001 8:37 pm

While testing MC Desert Fox, Matilda II's were the bane of my existence. I send numerous ranting emails to Wild Bill about them. (To get an idea of their tone, just think of the latest Panzer vs T-34 flap.)

Like good old Rosanne Rosanadana said, in SPWaW "It's always something." <img src="biggrin.gif" border="0"> <img src="biggrin.gif" border="0">

[ December 29, 2001: Message edited by: Warrior ]</p>

Jack · Post by **Jack** » Sat Dec 29, 2001 10:13 pm

I remember reading somewhere the German crews when encountering the Matilda's either got out of the area or would abandon their vehicles if they could not get away or out of range fast enough. The Brittish crews called it Matilda-itis, referring to it as some sort of disease.

Gump · Post by **Gump** » Sat Dec 29, 2001 10:43 pm

I would imagine the best tactic would be to simply go around the thing....aim for the tracks until you get a rear shot..... or just drive right on by.... no worry about it catching you...

sebagonzalez · Post by **sebagonzalez** » Sun Dec 30, 2001 1:01 am

Thks god that u r not facing the german heavies of late war!!. At least the Matilda has a very bad gun against tanks so u can give it a lot of kick before it can do anything to you. Maybe u can give it enough kick before it reaches you to make it´s crew bail out and then u can just machinegun the guys.

brianleeprice · Post by **brianleeprice** » Sun Dec 30, 2001 2:27 am

Originally posted by sebagonzalez:
At least the Matilda has a very bad gun against tanks so u can give it a lot of kick before it can do anything to you.

Actually in early '41 vs IIIe's Matildas can put a hurting on you with those pop guns if you get too close. Generally its the one you don't know is there that brews up a tank or two - or you leave your IIIe's too exposed and a troop of Matilas waltz in from an unexpected direction.

I wrote the initial message just to show how crazy it can be just tank vs tank, of course, the only reason I did that in game was for fun - it was near the end of the battle and only one Matilda II (or any other english tank) was left.

By keeping your IIIe's grouped and a platoon of IVd's and a platoon of infantry or engineers nearby you can chew up Matildas with or without 88s. Use the IVd's and/or arty to block the Matilda's firing lanes with smoke, use armored cars or the IVd's to knock of the light stuff, use the IIIe's to pick off all the other tanks.

After a few turns you're left with nothing but a few Matildas to worry about and then its pretty straightforward - seperate them from the infantry, rattle them with arty/small arms/machine guns/long range tank fire/etc until they are pretty supressed, then send a halftrack with a squad of engineers or infantry along a blind approach route. Rarely will the Matilda be able to get op fire vs the halftrack once they are supressed.

Sometimes if the assault fails and there isn't any other infantry around, I'll run a few IIIe's up to point blank range from the rear and blast away. If the IIIe's don't have to move far they'll hit the stationary Matilda and it doesn't really take too many rear shots before it brews.

Same as anti-Tiger/Panther tactics really - just a different twist for a different set of equipment.

Still think it was hilarious to send an entire company of german armor to knock out one english tank and still almost fail *laugh*.

Have fun,
Brian

James P · Post by **James P** » Sun Dec 30, 2001 10:48 pm

I'm playing the Brit's in a 41 PBEM game, and so far have lost 6 Matilda's to Pz-IIIJ ACPR with no losses to the Germans. Don't know if it's bad luck or the IIIJ has a much better perfomrace than the IIIE

Frank W. · Post by **Frank W.** » Mon Dec 31, 2001 12:53 am

Originally posted by James P:
I'm playing the Brit's in a 41 PBEM game, and so far have lost 6 Matilda's to Pz-IIIJ ACPR with no losses to the Germans. Don't know if it's bad luck or the IIIJ has a much better perfomrace than the IIIE

much better!!

IIIe has only a 37mm gun
IIIJ has a 50mm,in case of the IIIJ (s) even a 50mm/L60 which is a very gun gun for it´s time.

Major Destruction · Post by **Major Destruction** » Mon Dec 31, 2001 1:49 am

I like pitting the British against the Soviets in 40 or 41.
Imagine matilda's and t-34's battling it out.

Makes for a fun pbem. <img src="biggrin.gif" border="0">

Wild Bill · Post by **Wild Bill** » Mon Dec 31, 2001 11:23 am

More than what you'll be given, Brian! <img src="wink.gif" border="0"> That is for sure. Now you know the Desert Fox's frustration first hand! <img src="mad.gif" border="0">

WB

jambo1 · Post by **jambo1** » Tue Jan 01, 2002 8:39 pm

Matildas mmmmmmm can you say ARTILLERY! That's how I've usually dealt with them when I've only had PzIIIe's around. Infantry work as well if they are in close enough. AMBUSH the tough bastards and assault them, remember totaly supressing him is all most as good as a KO, plus he may bail out if you give him a big enough headache. LOL

Col Bob out..........
<img src="biggrin.gif" border="0">

ananias · Post by **ananias** » Tue Jan 01, 2002 10:21 pm

Those bitches gave me a hard time in the "Rommel to the rescue"-campaign. My tiny 37mm At-guns were useless. Luckily, the eighty-eights saved the day.

However, even more annoying were the Matilda I-infantry tanks. When I first saw them, not knowing how tough they were, I thought "Infantry tanks? Hah! I laugh at them!", thinking that they were somewhat like the french m1917-inf.tanks. How wrong I was.

Those bastards took a beating from my 37mms, but not even one was knocked out! I got one immobilized and it´s crew killed, and the rest ran away thaks to my artillery strike. This gave me time to move one of the 88´s to a position and thank god it managed to knock out the rest. Still, Matildas gave me quite a surprise. I´ll never underestimate inf.tanks again.

rlc27 · Post by **rlc27** » Wed Jan 02, 2002 11:13 am

Both Matilda I's and II's can be really annoying. After a while I gave up trying to waste them with PzIIIe's with the 3.7cm gun.

Now, I kill the Matildas through a combination of artillery, selective use of 88s, and engineers assaults, often using satchel charges or flammenwerfers. I don't both wasting 3.7's, you can fire all day from any angle and still not take one out--better to use them to take our Cruiser I's, Vickers, trucks, and infantry formations--they're too darn useful in that role to risk them against a Matilda--even though the latter's gun does stink, it occasionally manages to take out a panzer if you're not too careful.

Also, I try to do what someone said in an earlier post--take care of everything else first and then concentrate on the Matildas. A lot of British tanks have the 2pdr. gun, so you can start reducing the opposition's total firepower immediately.

Smoke is also darn useful for making them blind. That, combined with a massed-armor flank attack against any defending infantry will allow you to quickly cut the Brits down to size--and that, I believe, is how Rommel also managed it, all the way to Tobruk. The Brits would stick their tanks in infantry support roles in "penny-packets," hearkening to WWI, while the Germans understood the value of concentrated firepower and mobility--again and again they lured the British tanks onto hidden gun emplacements, meanwhile separating them from the exposed (as is everything in the desert) infantry.