ORIGINAL: Mogami
When in these threads in the last few weeks someone posts "This always happens and it is BS" I post a result from a game that was produced that day that is opposite the posted "Always" result.
Mogami, I don't like to talk about what I don't really know, but so far in my campaign game I've had 8 surface combat encounters, 6 of them at night vs transport TF and have seen in all and every of them the same tendence to beat only the crap out of the already hit and burning ships unless any other ship takes the chance and fires back.
The other two were one a PT engagement (hard to extract opinions from this) and another night engagement of my BB TF vs a Surface Cruiser fleet , combat wich saw a japanese PG receive unholy ammounts of punishment while there were four japanese cruisers around perfectly visible in the TF screen, and so, for the commander of my TF . Even while two of those cruisers were hit several times, it was because they fired to my ships...as long as they kept silent and played the "good boy", they received no fire back so the good ole PG could be correctly punished.
Sorry, to see two full-fledged BBs firing at a PG which has received enough hits to already blown it to bits some ten times, while there are four Japanese CAs around isn't exactly my idea of "realistic" combat outcomes. Same with Transport TFs where only two ships are fired upon while most of the others can be perfectly seen by the commander (because their names are seen in the battle screen) who does nothing to hurt them too even while the targets being fired upon have already received enoug lead to send them to mars, and back.
You can post some results that says otherwise, I'm not going to refuse to read and aknowledge them for they are real and I'm sure that after some 20 surface battles I'll get one with a realistic set of engagements ,targetting and damage.
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however in a realistic game the norm should be all of us reporting reports like the ones you post and the ones like the fights I'm (and many others) are describing, should be more or less rare.
If you're in a TF with 2 BBs, 1 CA, 4 CLs, 5 DDs and see a TF of a couple of PGs and 10 APs, in real life no commander would concentrate ALL his fire in those two PGs until they were blown to bits for good....several times.
Firstly he would concentrate most of his heavy fire in those ships to disable then, and spare some for the rest of the force. Secondly he would shift most of the fire devoted to the PGs to the transports as soon as it was clear the PGs were no more a threat: A PG is a small target and a worthless price. A big AP displacing many thousands tons which may be carrying troops for an invasion is a BIG and PRIORITIVE target and so as soon as the escorting ships were disabled (DISABLED, not SUNK) they should be fired upon.
None of those things are seen at this stage in WitP surface fights. At least I've not see them and as I said I've already run quite some surface-to-surface fights to make up my own mind about the subject.
I have no quarrel against Matrixgames nor Gary Grisby (all the opposite, I've had thousands of hours of fun playing PW and WIR, both the original and re-made Matrix version, enough to make me grateful to them forever) ,so this is no bashing. I've already stated in another post that I can live with the combat rules as they are now, and some other relatively minor gripes I have, for the rest of the game more than compensates it. In short, what I say is not said out of any kind of personal private frustration vs anyone or vs the game (which I find simply unbelievably good).
You can insist that it's correctly modelled based on a few ammount of examples you've posted. I insist that it's incorrectly modelled based in my own experience and what I've seen develop in front of my own eyes.
As you might understand my opinion is based on what I've seen in front of my screen which has made me shake my head in disbelief seven times in three days, and that you say that -sometimes- you get realistic results it's not gonna change it. It should't be -sometimes-. it should be -most of the times-.
As a bottom point I'll add that Nikademus has said that the combat vs the transport TFs thingie is being looked upon by matrix and that it will probably be modified to see better results.
You can keep on denying that the combat as it is now it's nearly faultless...if the programmers are looking at it so they can fix it, it is because they too think the surface combats usually render unrealistic results, and that the issue can be improved with a bit of tweaking. And if the programmers think that way any point you can make out of this, combat results aside, is pointless.
On a personal note, I've been for very little time around this board, but have read a lot of threads looking for tips to enhance my enjoyement of WitP playing, as well as some tips on how to better manage the enormous density and depth of the game. I've found a lot of posts posted by you in the meantime. I think you're a good poster of this forum because your contributions usually are -VERY- good, and I seek no quarrel at all, not I want this thread to be taken as an offense, at all. I just think that you're too much on the defensive on this issue trying to explain things that, honestly, I find undefensible.
WitP is EXTREMELY GOOD, but it ain't perfect (nothing in this life is)...and this issue is one of those which can be worked on to make the game a bit nearer perfection.
BTW I can see what do you mean when you talk about people talking $h1T about the game just for the sake of it, or because some private agendas against the developers. I understand you going defensive, but not to take your grease gun, get into the bunker and fight it until the last bullet is fired (to make a banzai charge later
), wich more or less summons your stance at this moment in this thread (at least from yours truly's eyes
).
