Are there advanced aircraft (jets)?

[geozero]

Can Germany develop jet aircraft early on, so that full production is available by say 1943 or so? How is this modeled?

[Becket]

This is modeled through research. Pour your research into the speed and evasion rating of whatever type you want (fighter, tacbomber, heavy bomber, or carrier air).

[Oleg Mastruko]

You don't see jet plane as "jet plane". You can imagine, though, that any very advanced fighter (say, speed=3, air vs air attack=6 or 7) in German inventory is Me-262, if you like, and if you pour significant effort into research, you'll have your "Me-262s" much earlier than historic.

O.

[]FO[Samurai]

What about V2's? or special weapons like nuclear bombs for the US....Will certian countries research cost be cheaper for diferent weapons...

[Oleg Mastruko]

Research cost is the same for all playable sides. Some have better starting values in certain cathegories, but after that the research cost is the same. Research cost depends on many things though, like number of active units for the factor you're researching, so some sides may have it easier than others (if played wisely), but there is no "built in" advantage for anyone.

Now you can imagine the outcry, mostly coming from "Axis fanboy club", if some sides would be given research benefits in certain cathegories. That would inevitably lead to more advantages for Allies, overall.

V2 was interesting weapon, but on the scale of this game - without any military importance whatsoever. As it was used by Germans it was terror/revenge weapon, nothing more.

Nuclear bombs can be "developed" by any country that reaches Land attack factor 11 for Heavy bomber units. This is among the new set of rules introduced recently. Watch the newly started Case Geld AAR - I am going to try for the nukes in that game.

O.

[neuromancer]

ORIGINAL: Oleg Mastruko
V2 was interesting weapon, but on the scale of this game - without any military importance whatsoever. As it was used by Germans it was terror/revenge weapon, nothing more.

Absolutely correct. The payload (1000 kg IIRC) was too small to be individually overly effective, while the effort/ cost to build them was extremely high. Only with a WMD warhead would it have been particularly effective, and at that time probably only a nuke would would have had any real impact (no pun intended).

Incidentally, IIRC the actual German word that the 'V' in V1 and V2 stood for meant Vengence in German.

They were random terror attacks against Britain, and while they killed people, they weren't particularly effective in damaging British industry (what was left of it) or morale.

So to leave them out of this game is probably justifiable.

[YohanTM2]

Completely agree on the Vs. They did little of note and were a pain. I wouldn't spend the research on them.

Now, heavy bombers of all sides getting the A-bomb at 11 Research, very interesting. The question will be the viability of anyone but the WA spending the $$ to attain them.

[geozero]

V2 was interesting weapon, but on the scale of this game - without any military importance whatsoever. As it was used by Germans it was terror/revenge weapon, nothing more.

Wow, now that's an interesting comment. You would agree to leave V-weapons out but include Kamikaze for Japan?

I think they are both insignificant, but if you include one you should include the other.

Hitler used V-weapons much like everything he touched militarily - THE WRONG WAY. In the hands of an able commander/leader the V-weapons could have been used for better strategic and tactical reasons IMHO.

In fact if developed earlier in the war they could have (theoretically) stopped the Normandy landings.

I would really like to see at the very least the "capability" to develop these.

[:D]

[MButtazoni]

I would really like to see at the very least the "capability" to develop these.

you can... just not in GGWAW.

[Becket]

ORIGINAL: MButtazoni

I would really like to see at the very least the "capability" to develop these.

you can... just not in GGWAW.

[:D]

[YohanTM2]

In fact if developed earlier in the war they could have (theoretically) stopped the Normandy landings.

How would you see this as possible? Some sort of anti-ship capability? They had very limited guidance controls.

[MButtazoni]

IMO the only impact jets would have had for Germany would be to oppose the Allied strategic bombing campaign.

[geozero]

How would you see this as possible? Some sort of anti-ship capability? They had very limited guidance controls.

Precisely, the V-weapons could have been directed at Noramndy beaches and off shore ships, while not that accurate they could hit these beaches with a fair amount of success if employed correctly. Similarly I believe that introduction of the jets earlier on could have helped stem the tide, but not defeat the Allies.

I just believe that inclusion of Kamikaze planes would be similar to V-weapons. They are basically of limited strategic and tactical value and would not change the course of the war, but would be cool to have.

But hey, no biggie... just my thoughts.

[BravoZulu]

Precisely, the V-weapons could have been directed at Noramndy beaches and off shore ships, while not that accurate they could hit these beaches with a fair amount of success if employed correctly.

Boy, that sure would be risking those German troops at the Atlantic wall, wouldn't it?

[neuromancer]

Indeed.

These weren't smart bombs or cruise missiles. They were only really accurate enough to hit a very large target. Say, London. If they were more accurate, they would have been effective at hitting well known targets like Whitehall, Parliment Buildings, Buckingham Palace, and any factories that were still operating.

But they weren't that accurate, and no strategic missile would be for quite some time. So they were just aimed at London, and blew up a random chunk of it. I think aiming at a relatively small and mobile target like a ship would have been almost impossible for the time.

They did have a sort of buzz bomb thing that was dropped from an airplane that could zip along in a straight line and act like a very primative anti-shipping missile. I know of one that crippled a Canadian DD, probably used in other cases too. But you had to get a plane to stay in the air long enough to deploy it, and even then it was more like an airborne torpedo. It would have been very difficult to use effectively at ormandy considering the air superiority of the RAF and USAAF.

As for hitting a beach. Same thing. It would have stood a higher chance of doing nothing than hurting any of the attacking troops. And an unreasonable risk of hitting the bunkers within a few hundred yards of the target. And being as these were fixed installations, if they had enough of these things to fire frequently, I'm pretty sure they would have become a choice target of the Bomber Command.

So again, no, I don't think the V weapons were ever a significant threat, even if they had been developed a couple years earlier. The payloads were too small, the cost too high, and the accuracy just wasn't there.

As for jets, as said, the game would simply see these as very advanced fighters, high speed and maneuver. You want jets, pour research at these things.

[YohanTM2]

The Germans used "glide bombs" fairly effectively against Murmansk convoys

[paullus99]

They also used a "Felix" radio controlled glide bomb to destroy the Italian Battleship Roma in 1943.

Towards the end of the war, Germany almost had the first Surface to Air missile as well.