Combined Historical Scenario - Devices

[bstarr]

ORIGINAL: Don Bowen

ORIGINAL: Ron Saueracker
Can we edit default loads for squadrons or just plane types?

I have no idea but, since the weapons load is copied to the squadron based on the assigned aircraft, we might be able to do it for the originally assigned aircraft. We'd loose any tweaks on aircraft upgrade.

Me, I'm an OOB guy and we are getting a little too deep into ordnance details and game mechanics for me to follow.

Don

I tried that once. It don't work. I loaded the carrier-born Vals with 800kgs in order to make the Pearl attack more effective. I figured that as the first Vals new planes became available the Vals would switch to 250Kgs. They didn't. The database apparently substitutes using the devices listed in the original air group.

[Don Bowen]

ORIGINAL: Mike Scholl

ORIGINAL: Don Bowen

ORIGINAL: Tankerace

Just to interject here about your devices, a 13 pdr AA GUn is the same as a 3" gun. A 3pdr AA gun (Also used in War Plan Orange) is a little larger than 40mm, which is the size of a 2pdr gun.

Thanks. I had a reference somewhere that had said "about 3 inch" but I looked it up and I was wrong. Its 47mm (1.85 in). You wouldn't happen to have its device values handy, would you??

Don .....Your reference has got to be wrong.....a 6-lb'er is 57mm, so a 13-lb-er would
have to be "about 3" or 75mm......You should check again.

Sorry, I did not write that post very well. I had mistaken a 3pdr as a 3 inch. I also correctly had a 13pdr as "about 3 inch". Apparently the reference (or I!) made a 3/13 error.

Don

[Lemurs!]

Don,
The Japanese 105mm AA does indeed update to the 120mm AA. This will be the only way to bring the 120mm AA into the game.

Mike

[Herrbear]

I was looking over the devices in Scen. 15 and noticed the following. I don't know if they have been mentioned.

#7 5.5/50 3YT has load cost of 9. #10 4.7/45 3YT has a load cost of 8. Both of these are Type 18 - Naval Gun. Should they be 9999?

#53 3/40 Type 88 Gun has load cost of 6. This is a Type 17 - DP gun. Should it be 9999?

#410 3in AA shows as Type 17 - DP but is listed in an group of Type 12 - AA guns. I think it should be a Type 12.

#294 4.7 DP gun shows as a Type 18 - Naval Gun. I think it should be a Type 17 - DP.

[Lemurs!]

#294 may be an error, the others are not. They are coastal artillery pieces that were light enough to move around.

Mike

[Don Bowen]

ORIGINAL: Lemurs!

#294 may be an error, the others are not. They are coastal artillery pieces that were light enough to move around.

Mike

I agree and will make the change.

[Ron Saueracker]

ORIGINAL: Ron Saueracker

ORIGINAL: AlaskanWarrior

ORIGINAL: Lemurs!

Snip

As Matrix chose to use max ceiling for every other weapon in the game, I felt the British should not be penalized for honesty.

Why are we being spoon fed this max range bull?? No anti-aircraft gun in WWII fired to it's max range. For instance, the 40mm Bofors shell was designed to self-destruct at approxiamtely 5000 yards at tracer-burnout. Let me see, if it is historical that the shells were designed to self-destruct in this manner, then why are we not using this value for max range? The same can be said for all medium and larger AA guns, as the shell were designed spefically to self-destruct well before 'max' range would be attained. The reasons for the self-destruct varies, but usually was concerns over reducing the amount of fraticide and to un-nerve the target.

rm


[&:]

Well, I just had Japanese 4.7's repeatedely hitting DDs at 18,000 yards. Seems way too accurate. These shell sizes would basically be tumbling at this range at best, no? Should probably think about reducing the max range for everything once some research is done here.

Just had a DD armed with 4.7s hit a PT boat 25 consecutive times without a miss at 3000 yards during daylight. This is simply silly. Why so accurate? Especially vs a maneuverable target?

[Lemurs!]

First hit was luck... after that the PT boat was not moving as fast... at least all in one direction!

[Don Bowen]

I am creating a class for the old Dutch Coast Defense Ship Soerabaja. She had 11-inch guns but there are no 11-inch guns available and we're out of slots.

So, for you ordnance guys: What would be best to use instead of 11in - an 8in or a 12in.

Alternately I could steal one of the guns used only by the French Cruiser classess that are defined but not used. If I did that, would anyone have WITP specifications for an old Dutch 11-in gun??

[rhohltjr]

Anyone have any data on Allied/American air dropped visual/radio controlled weapons under development
in 1945/6?

What were those similar weapons G. Grigsby had in his theoretical add-on scenario he did for Carrier Strike?

[rhohltjr]

ORIGINAL: rhohltjr

Anyone have any data on Allied/American air dropped visual/radio controlled weapons under development
in 1945/6?

What were those similar weapons G. Grigsby had in his theoretical add-on scenario he did for Carrier Strike?

If the other side has Okka bombs this should not be that difficult to implement[:D].

Why yes[;)], I found this link:

ASM-2N Bat

And a pic. ASM-2N on PB4Y.

[timtom]

ORIGINAL: AlaskanWarrior

Second, a different ATG upgrade path needs ot be created for use by American Divisions. The upgrade should be only 37mm->57mm (somehwere around late 1942). No ATG heavier than 57mm was organic to these divisions, so upgrading to 76mm is not historically accurate.

First of all, let me comment you all on your positively heroic effort.

Second, my meager contribution: My readings suggests that the 37mm was generally retained in spite of the 57mm becoming available, the reason being that IJA armour being what it was, the 37mm was good enough for the job, but had the advantage over the 57mm of being man-portable, a considerable advantage, of course, in the kind of terrain found in the Pacific.

I'm fairly positive that this was the case with the USMC (from necesity, no doubt). With regards to the USA, however, I have no positive evidence, but fx XXIV Corps ammo expenditure on Okinawa was 21,997 57mm shells against 87,193 37mm shells.

As Martin states, the 76mm was never a part of divisional TOE.

[Tankerace]

I believe you are correct, for the same reasons as the M3 Stuart. Obsolete by 1943 in Africa, it could still deal with almost any Japanese armor, thus most (almost all) Gasoline powered Shermans went to the ETO and MTO. M3 Stuarts, M5 Stuarts (esp. when phased out by the Chaffee) and the Diesel power M4A2 series Shermans went to the Pacific. (For reference, the M4A2s were diesel powered, and used by the British lendlease [Sherman III], Russian lendlease, and the USMC. The theory was the Marines could feed them with the same diesel used for landing craft.)

[Lemurs!]

Plus the diesels gopt better milage thus in the Pacific, devoid of the modern European infrastructure, they wouldbe more useful.

Mike

[Jo van der Pluym]

ORIGINAL: Don Bowen

I am creating a class for the old Dutch Coast Defense Ship Soerabaja. She had 11-inch guns but there are no 11-inch guns available and we're out of slots.

So, for you ordnance guys: What would be best to use instead of 11in - an 8in or a 12in.

Alternately I could steal one of the guns used only by the French Cruiser classess that are defined but not used. If I did that, would anyone have WITP specifications for an old Dutch 11-in gun??

Don

This are the specifications about the guns of the Soerabaja


Gun specs
Manufacturer Krupp, Germany
Purpose Low Angle (seatargets only)
Bore 28 cm (11 inch)
Classes used on Zeven Provinciën
Length 42,5 calibers
Length ( m ) 11,9 m
Gunweight 31 tons
Initial velocity 2920 feet/sec
Shell specs
Shell weight 595 lbs
Max penetration ( with AP ) 8 inch @ 8000 meters
13 inch @ 5000 meters
15,5 inch @ 3000 meters
Shell supply 100 rounds per gun
Mount specs
Mount armor 250 mm
Train + 130 / - 130 degrees

The link is

http://www.netherlandsnavy.nl/

[Don Bowen]

ORIGINAL: Jo van der Pluym

ORIGINAL: Don Bowen

I am creating a class for the old Dutch Coast Defense Ship Soerabaja. She had 11-inch guns but there are no 11-inch guns available and we're out of slots.

So, for you ordnance guys: What would be best to use instead of 11in - an 8in or a 12in.

Alternately I could steal one of the guns used only by the French Cruiser classess that are defined but not used. If I did that, would anyone have WITP specifications for an old Dutch 11-in gun??

Don

This are the specifications about the guns of the Soerabaja


Gun specs
Manufacturer Krupp, Germany
Purpose Low Angle (seatargets only)
Bore 28 cm (11 inch)
Classes used on Zeven Provinciën
Length 42,5 calibers
Length ( m ) 11,9 m
Gunweight 31 tons
Initial velocity 2920 feet/sec
Shell specs
Shell weight 595 lbs
Max penetration ( with AP ) 8 inch @ 8000 meters
13 inch @ 5000 meters
15,5 inch @ 3000 meters
Shell supply 100 rounds per gun
Mount specs
Mount armor 250 mm
Train + 130 / - 130 degrees

The link is

http://www.netherlandsnavy.nl/

Thanks Jo - but I have no idea how to convert this into entries for the device table. Can anyone create the entries from these specs??

[spence]

From the American intelligence reports at the end of the war.
"Japanese anti aircraft fire was so deadly that it accounted for 70% of the Air Force losses and 88% of the Navy aircraft losses"

No time frame is mentioned for these statistics. They are very believeable IF they refer to the end of the war time frame since Japanese fighters were by that time relatively ineffective. If it refers to the war as a whole then I guess maybe it's time to downgrade the A6M2s killing ability.

[Lemurs!]

Don,

Acc: 15-20 (not sure on rate of fire)
Penetration: 400
Effect: 900

Mike

[Lemurs!]

Spence,

Those figures are for the entire war.
And i did down grade the Zero.

One of the most important things i am learning by following the AARs here, is the number of bone head strategies the players are willing to try and then scream that the game is broken because they lost something.

America did nothing but wait and build until May '42. Do you know why? because they could. It is as simple as that. Japan was busy with Burma, finishing off the Philipines, the East Indies, etc.
Japan had no major force left to do anything with.
The first PbeM game i played was against a very good player in most ways, but he attacked, for two days in a row, the Marshall islands in Dec '41. Why? He sank a few merchant ships and i think and old destroyer and many ships were damaged.
I lost 30 planes.

But he lost 160 planes when i sunk both carriers and a couple of heavy cruisers.

The American victory in WW2 was not so much due to great eqipment, although our equipment was the best in the world, nor was it through great field leadership, although in a few areas we had that as well. We won because we followed the best grand strategy of any country in the war.
We kept our eye on the goal and essentially never left our goals out of site.

Roosevelt, Marshall, Arnold, and King. Plus a few others.

Mike

[TheElf]

Mike(lemurs!). Did you get my Email re: The Aircraft files you sent? I don't have the Scenario 55 the two files you sent are unusable for me. Do I need the full scen 55 to look at the new A/C list?