Interested in opinions about a map experiment - Panama screenshot added

[Andrew Brown]

I am currently helping with the Combined Mod, which is being developed by a number of people (see the numerous posts in the Scenario Design / Game Editor forum for an idea of what we are doing).

The scenario is being developed for use with my modified game map. One of the things we are thinking of doing is modifying my map further, adding in 'off map' areas as follows:

• A base in the very top left corner of the map, called 'Aden', that will represent the British posessions in the Middle East. This base is where most British reinforcements and supply will appear, and it will then have to be shipped to India (or wherever).
• Bases representing the Panama Canal and surrounding area, including the Galapagos Islands. Many US reinforcements will be changed to appear here.

Distances to these bases will be made correct by using blocked hexes to force ships to follow particular paths to get to them.

I am interested in what others think of this idea. it is an experiment, and it is designed specifically for use with the combined mod scenario. It has yet to be playtested, but I hope to do that soon. It will mean that to play the combined mod, the special map will need to be downloaded and installed, either using my load/unload scripts provided with my map mod, or in a separate installation of the game.

What do you think about this idea? I would appreciate any comments: favourable or unfavourable.

Andrew

[Moquia]

I think this is a good idea. If India is a fair target for the Japanese, then something has do be done with the reinforcements etc.

[Ron Saueracker]

If the base is placed along the top of the map and inland, Aden (Red Sea would be my choice of name) would also allow the Allies to safely withdraw shipping from the veritable fish bowl the Indian Ocean is. Same can be done with Panama/East Coast by making a barrier of impassable sea hexes so air can't target it and base built up to SUPER UBER status to keep bombardment happy players from being silly.

[Tankerace]

I say do it. It will really slow the game pace down, as units will arrive at Panama, and then have to be carted to California, and then taken to its destination.

Very good idea, go for it!

[33Vyper]

tough to say ... but anything that puts the brakes on those dang americans...hehehe...must be a good thing

[Nomad]

Sounds great to me. Love the work you have done so far.

[scout1]

athough I'm always infavor of anything to slow down the Allied assault, what is the background for adding this? Is there something currently ahistorical with the "limited' map ?

[Andrew Brown]

ORIGINAL: scout1

athough I'm always infavor of anything to slow down the Allied assault, what is the background for adding this? Is there something currently ahistorical with the "limited' map ?

There are two separate issues:

- Regarding the Middle East: with the current map, there is no rear area that the British can use if India is threatened. In reality, they had their posessions in Africa and the Middle East that could have been used.

- The Panama Canal is less important game wise, but was an extremely important objective in a strategic sense, and it was one of the major entry points for forces and materiel from the US East Cost. From here there was an alternative shipping route, via Bora Bora in the Society islands, to Australia and areas in the Southwest Pacific.

On top of that, adding these bases expands the strategic scope of the game. Also remember that it is only experimental - I have no idea whether it really is a good idea to add these areas, or whether they will work properly.

[von Murrin]

I don't know about this. It seems a good idea on the surface, but I'm not sure the added complexity will help, particularly for those who play the AI. I can see lots of unintended consequences, most of them bad.

Perhaps finish the CHS with your current map and then a second version with this new map?

[Nomad]

One thing Andrew is to make sure that the hex that is Panama Canal has lots of supplies flowing into it every day.

[Ron Saueracker]

ORIGINAL: Andrew Brown

ORIGINAL: scout1

athough I'm always infavor of anything to slow down the Allied assault, what is the background for adding this? Is there something currently ahistorical with the "limited' map ?

There are two separate issues:

- Regarding the Middle East: with the current map, there is no rear area that the British can use if India is threatened. In reality, they had their posessions in Africa and the Middle East that could have been used.

- The Panama Canal is less important game wise, but was an extremely important objective in a strategic sense, and it was one of the major entry points for forces and materiel from the US East Cost. From here there was an alternative shipping route, via Bora Bora in the Society islands, to Australia and areas in the Southwest Pacific.

On top of that, adding these bases expands the strategic scope of the game. Also remember that it is only experimental - I have no idea whether it really is a good idea to add these areas, or whether they will work properly.

Aden will be good simply because by removing the auto supply from here and relocating it in Aden, the British will have to ship the supplies and units to India. Will help alleviate the hordes of shipping the Allies have because they have nothing to do. (with resource centres producing supplies along with resources the game designers have basically gutted the need for merchant shipping).

[ChezDaJez]

Along with Aden, would you consider Diego Garcia also? It was also a major jump off point and could represent those assets that come via Capetown in South Africa.

Chez

[Andrew Brown]

ORIGINAL: ChezDaJez

Along with Aden, would you consider Diego Garcia also? It was also a major jump off point and could represent those assets that come via Capetown in South Africa.

Chez

This has been requested before. Unfortunately I think that the map is just too cramped to add it. Aden itself is already quite a stretch, and could only be added with some difficulty.

[Sardaukar]

ORIGINAL: Andrew Brown

This has been requested before. Unfortunately I think that the map is just too cramped to add it. Aden itself is already quite a stretch, and could only be added with some difficulty.

Why not call Aden just "Middle East", since it'll be abstracted in a way, composing all British ME and African bases ?? Like Panama/East USA ??

Cheers,

M.S.

[Halsey]

It sounds good. My only concern would be the approach path to these destinations. Would it allow the opposing side to blockade only a few hexes to deny access? Or will the edge of the map be considered the exit path?

[m10bob]

Andrew,I use nothing but your map mod now,for the corrected distances and added locations you have provided.
I am very much in favor of the suggested additions,especially Panama..(This might give the Japanese player a real "what-if" possibility of hurting east coast replacements).

[tsimmonds]

ORIGINAL: Halsey

It sounds good. My only concern would be the approach path to these destinations. Would it allow the opposing side to blockade only a few hexes to deny access? Or will the edge of the map be considered the exit path?

What kind of people you gaming against who would do that?[:-][;)]

[Bulldog61]

ORIGINAL: Tankerace

I say do it. It will really slow the game pace down, as units will arrive at Panama, and then have to be carted to California, and then taken to its destination.

Very good idea, go for it!

Those ships arriving at Panama would just be available about 10 days or so earlier.

[Andrew Brown]

ORIGINAL: irrelevant

ORIGINAL: Halsey

It sounds good. My only concern would be the approach path to these destinations. Would it allow the opposing side to blockade only a few hexes to deny access? Or will the edge of the map be considered the exit path?

What kind of people you gaming against who would do that?[:-][;)]

Halsey, there is little I can do to prevent players from attempting what you describe, as it is impossible for me to extend the map itself. However consider the following:

• If submarines are massed in the paths, then they can also be found more easily by enemy ASW TFs.
• There is no surface TF interception during movement - probably a good thing in this situation.
• It will be much easier for enemy TFs to intercept, but these sea paths are a long way away from Japanese bases - especially the ones to Panama, so it might be difficult to attempt such blockades effectively.
• In the case of Panama, I have added more than one path, so there are alternatives, and if a Japanese TF camps in one then shipping can be sent via another.

Hopefully it won't be a major poblem, but this will only be discovered through testing.

I will put up a few screenshots soon, to illustrate how it will work.

[Captain Cruft]

I say go for it.

Given that you have worked out the format of the pwhex.dat file, would it not be relatively simple to actually expand the map?