Carpet Bombing

[BK6583]

"British get two allocations of carpet bombing (Operations Goodwood & Epsom)."

The above is from an old thread regarding "On to Paris." I've just begun the July 2 turn of this 76 turn game and it dawned on me that Epsom occured around Jun 25. I either missed something regarding carpet bombing or the option hasn't been available to me just yet -not sure which it is. What does BIN do to 'tell' me that a carpet bombing capability is available to either the British or Americans on any given turn?

[JSS]

Right click on the Game info panel (top right corner... turn number and weather info area that's next to the end turn button).

Where you see "Combat Bonuses" heading in the top right corner of the pop up, you would see carpet bombing info. This works well for historical weather (you know a week out when it will be available)... takes a lot of flexibility using random weather (info comes one turn out)!

[BK6583]

I've right clicked and checked that part of the screen out numerous times before but nothing quite jumped out at me. Is there an airplane icon that's labeled "Carpet Bombing"?

On the turn where it's supposed to be available, does it then show up somewhere on the combat screen where you you add artillery, air, and leadership bonuses?

[Fred98]

I have used it in the Breakout scenario

Currently paying this scenario up to turn 25 using random weather and it hasnt turned up yet.

[JSS]

ORIGINAL: BK6583

I've right clicked and checked that part of the screen out numerous times before but nothing quite jumped out at me. Is there an airplane icon that's labeled "Carpet Bombing"?

On the turn where it's supposed to be available, does it then show up somewhere on the combat screen where you you add artillery, air, and leadership bonuses?

Yes, that is exactly where its added to a combat.

Back to your underlying question: Seems Epsom has been delayed by a couple of weeks in this scenairo (first carpet bombs show up on turn 38).

[BK6583]

OK - I started the Breakout scenario to see what was really involved with carpet bombing. Unless I'm missing something, I must say I'm really underwhelmed! I expected something truly devestating and instead (again - I went through the manual so I hope I'm not missing something) I saw the 'Bombardment' light activated when I initiated a US combat, which I assume is the 'carpet bombing' capability. I click on that and find that it adds one, count'em, one combat odds shift and no more. Now granted, in this game one combat odds shift can at times make a difference, but, sheesh, this is certainly not how I pictured carpet bombing working in this game. Up until now, I've been pretty much in agreement with the game design and game balance decisions that have been made by these excellent designers; but this one's got me stumped.

[pterrok]

OK, so the manual says it's a special aerial attack. If you read the editor manual or hang out at Run 5 you would read this (Originally posted by Gregor Whiley):

I put quite a lot of detail about Carpet Bombing into the Editor Manual. I would say that it's very well explained there, but its the sort of complex calculation, with a fair amount of randomness, that is very hard to explain succinctly in the user manual, so I didn't try. Most people understand that carpet bombing will give a big boost to a combat, and that's all they need to know.

I know some people like to know everything, but I expect those people to read the editor manual as well!

Bombing Hits [1 - 8 times]: Choose the number of hits that each bomb run will cause. These hits could all occur in one hex or in a number of different hexes.

Bombing Scatter Radius [Target - 5 Hexes]: Choose the radius from the target hex that bombs can scatter into. If Target is chosen then all hits will be in the target hex.

Bombing Target Percent: Choose the percentage chance that each hit will occur in the Target hex.

Bombing Enemy Percent: For those hits that are not falling on the Target hex, choose the percentage chance that they will at least fall in an enemy occupied hex.

Note that any hits that are not already allocated to Target or Enemy hexes will be distributed randomly according to the Scatter Radius and may fall on friendly or enemy hexes.

Bombing Chance Per Unit: Choose the chance that a hit will cause a step loss to each unit in the hex. For example, if there are four units in a hex, and it suffers a successful hit, then all four units will each lose a step. The only exception to this is the Target hex, which will always have one step remaining, so that the ground combat can take place.

Note that while both enemy and friendly units can take step losses, and the combat is recalculated after the Carpet Bombing results are implemented, the Combat Odds can
increase, but may never decrease.

Now I went into the editor and loaded up Breakout and here's the data for THIS scenario. (It's QUITE different in the Run 5 user created Kursk scenario!)

Both British and US have identical stats, though they could've been different:
Bombing hits: 6 times
Scatter: radius 1
Bombing Target %: 30
Chance per unit: 4-6
Bombing Enemy %: 40

So the proper way to use carpet bombing is to drop it on a hex with lots of units IN it and with lots of units in hexes NEXT to it!

[Gregor_SSG]

ORIGINAL: BK6583

OK - I started the Breakout scenario to see what was really involved with carpet bombing. Unless I'm missing something, I must say I'm really underwhelmed! I expected something truly devestating and instead (again - I went through the manual so I hope I'm not missing something) I saw the 'Bombardment' light activated when I initiated a US combat, which I assume is the 'carpet bombing' capability. I click on that and find that it adds one, count'em, one combat odds shift and no more. Now granted, in this game one combat odds shift can at times make a difference, but, sheesh, this is certainly not how I pictured carpet bombing working in this game. Up until now, I've been pretty much in agreement with the game design and game balance decisions that have been made by these excellent designers; but this one's got me stumped.

As you can see from the explanation quoted by pterrok, carpet bombing does a lot more than just add one shift. You would expect that using carpet bombing in any decent attack would obliterate the defender. I love doing just that to regiments of the 1st SS Panzer, who are otherwise reluctant to leave Caen.

Gregor

[shrek]

Is it correct then that terrain does not affect a carpet bomb attack, i.e., an attack in urban terrain will be just as effective as an attack in clear terrain?

[JSS]

ORIGINAL: shrek

Is it correct then that terrain does not affect a carpet bomb attack, i.e., an attack in urban terrain will be just as effective as an attack in clear terrain?

That's correct. Terrain does not affect the results.

The only factor that changes carpet bombing is quality of the side's air force. The attack may only strike once or it may strike multiple times during the bombing run. Less accurate bombers may strike up to three hexes away from the target!

[shrek]

Thanks! [8D] One more question -- if you carpet bomb a hex with a unit & a strongpoint, will the attack hit the unit also or just the strongpoint?

[Fred98]

There is a scenario called Breakout

Set it to Human v Human and play yourself.

But don't play a seriopus game - just miove a few units around to test. The British get carpet bombing on turn 1 and turn 3

[JSS]

ORIGINAL: shrek

Thanks! [8D] One more question -- if you carpet bomb a hex with a unit & a strongpoint, will the attack hit the unit also or just the strongpoint?

Strongpoint is automatically removed before the recorded carpet bomb hits (always 'hits' strongpoint on 1st wave[:D])... hex struck then happens independently of the strongpoint being removed.

[shrek]

That's what I needed to know...[:)]

[plug]and anyone who wants a real carpetbomb-arama should give JSS's Patton scenario a try! [:D] [/plug]