livin in a dream world

[Cheesehead]

Well said.

I just had to plug my raison d'etre [:)]

[SeaMonkey]

willycube,

I think what you are looking for is Strategic Command, albeit not a global game, ETO only. Allows for customizing units to certain extent, try the demo at Battlefront and be forwarned SC2 is on the horizon. Now SC2 looks to be the definitive effort in the strategic scale, IMO. An editor with the flexibility of TOAW, a fully developed Diplomatic model, and for sure detailed customization of your fighting units with leaders, tech upgrades, and experience to name a few. Oh yeah, did I mention you can name the units, leaders and give them custom traits. For your customizing needs the editor will be able to create maps, ala global scale, turn periods, climate and scripting features also abound. There's even control over the randomizing factors and talk about a user friendly interface, I have not been exposed to better. Nough said...check it out yourself, you won't go away disappointed.

[Dalwin]

ORIGINAL: willycube

Thank you Dalwin and Hardrock, Dalwin I think this game is very good for what it is, as for tweaking, what would you tweak? [would like to know] You mentioned the franchise of 3rd Reich, did you mean the board game too, I don't think 3rd Reich could be played on a massive scale as WaW is played, but I like the idea of units improving as they were victorious in battles, with strategic command 2 on the horizon it might be a better game and with some players who have the ability to mod things they just might be able to create a pacific theatre of war. Hardrock I dont know if I would pay $300 [don't give them any ideas please] but I would pay $100 for a well done 3rd Reich. Thanks for your comments.

What woud I tweak? Mostly the same things that are being looked at now, which is why I am confident that this game is headed in a good direction.

I would make a few changes to the AI so it does a better job of things like protecting the Caucuses for instance.

I would look closely at adjusting a few of the tech world standards if overteching particular things turns into a difficult to counter PBEM strategy.

I would make a couple of minor UI canges. The popup combat bar each time the mouse passes over a contested area is unnecessarily annoying. That bar should only auto popup if you try to end the phase without completing the required combats.

[sveint]

If you want to check out the best WWII board game, forget 3rd Reich or WiF, try AETO: Advanced European Theatre of Operations. APTO coming.

[HardRock]

Paul,
I played some of that open beta of WIF and I know what you mean by operational even though it's a stategic wargame:)

3R is more strategic than operational.

Anyway..what's the chance of BHAWAW being released first without an AI????
I'll pay;-)

Not asking for a release date (right:) but what's a guestimate on BHAWAW? to the nearest 1/2 year

Ditto on WIF. A year? less..more?

[Paul Vebber]

http://www.aworldatwar.com/OnlineAWAW.htm

Magnetar would have to comment on the specifics as they have a couple related projects here.

Same with WiF.

C'mon. You know what folks do when dates are bandied about [;)]

[Grotius]

Is BHWaW a global sequel of sorts to Third Reich? The map sure looks like that familiar old 3R map, with BRPs and whatnot.

I also cut my teeth on 3R -- and ASL, PanzerBlitz, and about 30 other Avalon Hill games. I love those games, but I don't see as they have any more or less "soul" than games like GGWaW and WITP. Sure, I sometimes have nostalgia for the actual cardboard counters, the dice, the pretty boards. But PC games don't take 50 square feet of table space, and they're immune from cats.

[ravinhood]

HOI2 will be an excellent game after some major AI revisions.

Lol I see the HOI2 AI suks as much as the HOI AI suked and yah know, they never fixed the origional AI to perfection. It really wasn't even sufficient before they ran of into HOI 2.

[ravinhood]

quote:

$175 US to purchase the game!!

Sorry, but, NO GAME is worth $175, I don't care if it's "STAIRWAY to HEAVEN", in this case I'm NOT BUYING ONE! hehe

[QBeam]

Oh, jeez, no!

Ok, I admit it, I played it more than any other strategic WWII game. But for much of that time I was highly annoyed by it's WWI-esque mechanics, and perpetually trying to design a better one. I must be a glutton for punishment. Wait, yes, that's true--I've played 6 complete games of GDW's Fire in the East/Scortched Earth. I've never met anyone outside my gaming group that's ever played more than one.

[Zap]

I think you are just looking at fond remembrances of your youth

I think yes there was magic, How I remember! But those rememberances are more real (heart and soul) experiences than fantasy. I too would be willing to pay the price for those classic boardgames brought to the computer that could faithfully bring the same satisfaction. And 3R was great for me.

There are attempts being made to equal them but I don't believe we've seen it happen yet.

I too encourage all involved in the wargame making process to seek perfection, push yourselves to the limits of your creative capabilities. In order to produce the most fantastic IGO UGO games yet to be made for the computer. Can you make this a new era of games gamers have to have!

But I hope the above not only happens with WWII games but also Napoleanic/ Civil War/ Ancient will be realzed

Now I have need for only computer play so boardgames are out for me. That is, unless there is a major change in my life like (no job/nowife) which demand my first attention.

Never played War in Europe but word of mouth says it was good.

I disagree with the idea that the games being made now are better. For me that is still a hope, yet to be realized.

My opinion is that, the early creators dedicated more their creative/ imaginative soul into how the game was faithful to war strategy simulation. Today the finacial pressures seem to force all involved in the game making to suppress some their creativty/imagination.

All being said, I play the games that are out here for us to play and find some of them very enjoyable.

A point to make is that GGWaW is an intermediate level game.

The emotional enjoyment with the older boardgames can also be attributed to playing with human opponent. I look forward to PBEM play with the new games to enhance my game playenjoyment

[ravinhood]

I see games today with better graphics, but, I don't see much of an improvement in gameplay vs the AI at least. I played SSI games of Gettysburg, Antietam, Sons of Liberty, Battles of Napolean, Fighter Command, Carrier Force, War of the Lance, (one of my favorites), SSG's Carriers at War and Europe Ablaze, for like forever and I really don't see any games today that really compare to the ease of play of those games and a half decent AI to go along with them. Those are just my favorites, I have many others. The SSI line of games was the creme-del-a-cream of just about all types of games back in the 80's. I just don't see any major improvements other than graphics 20 years later.

I've said it before and I'll say it again though, there's too much development time being spent in the WWII era. I think just about all of us have 100 WWII games by now. And Koios is hitting the mark with me going back into the Anceints, along with Slitherine as well.

Another one of my favorite types of games was Alpha Centauri, where one could design their own units and there really was no history or having to have historical accuracy in the game. One of the most superb games ever made IMHO. I believe Legions II: Civilizations & Empires is going to go the right path also, in an Ancient time period, but, not a big emphasis on any historical time line of accuracy to have to follow, sort of like Civilization takes a time stop in the Ancient period of time. I'm anxiously awaiting that one also.

I see developers putting years into ONE game for "graphics" sake. I still think for the most part that is a waste of resources and time. For graphics do not a great game make. It's the gameplay and the challenge (of the AI or human) that makes the game great for me. Personally if I owned a company no game would ever take more than a year to produce. The graphics would just have to be sufficient for that amount of time and the rest of the resources would go into creating challenge and a popular AI. So, why is COMBAT LEADER TAKING SO LONG I ASK NOW?

[Zap]

It's the gameplay and the challenge (of the AI or human) that makes the game great for me.

100% with you on that. Wheres the creativityand imagination?

[markhwalker]

It is the game, but part of the game is the graphics.

Yes, games are better today.

Better GUI

Frequently better AI.

New approaches to old topics.

Too much time in WW2? Couldn't agree more. I'd have loved Matrix to buy the LnL: Red Storm Rising concept (and they still may), but the problem is that WW2 is what people buy. I don't know why... people tell me equal combatants, but that usually is a sign of ignorance. There were MANY equal small unit engagements in both the Storm and Iraqi Freedom, and in the Falklands. I know,... I have interviewed veterans that were there, men that say the Iraqis fought hard (but were generally clueless). Same goes for the Falklands. The Brits might have you believe it was a cakewalk. Not so, specifically men I've spoke with in the Parachute Regiment state that the Argies fought hard from defensive positions, and the Argi Marines gave the RM ALL they could handle. But folks might not buy LnL modules based on those eras because of the unequal conflicts.

Best,

Mark

[Vyshka]

How does the stuff from avalanche press fit into this?
John Prados Third Reich and Great Pacific War?

I am guessing from what I have seen that the BH stuff
is the latest incarnation of A3R?

[Paul Vebber]

Yes, Bruce Harper's A World at War is a combining, major refinement to and continuation in the 'maturing" of the 3rd Reich base design.

[Sarge]

ORIGINAL: ravinhood

I've said it before and I'll say it again though, there's too much development time being spent in the WWII era. I think just about all of us have 100 WWII games by now.

Agreed,

I have pretty much lost interest in all new WWII pc games and no longer follow any development . With the exceptions of CMX2 and any development of the HTTR engine.

Although I do not agree with you on graphics, I would like to see this gender start getting with the times . And I am not talking about the cookie cutter RTS eye candy you see being released today.

[UndercoverNotChickenSalad]

Can't believe u old curmudgeons are still going on about this [8|] Sentimental fools.

[celebrindal]

ORIGINAL: Grotius

Is BHWaW a global sequel of sorts to Third Reich? The map sure looks like that familiar old 3R map, with BRPs and whatnot.

I also cut my teeth on 3R -- and ASL, PanzerBlitz, and about 30 other Avalon Hill games. I love those games, but I don't see as they have any more or less "soul" than games like GGWaW and WITP. Sure, I sometimes have nostalgia for the actual cardboard counters, the dice, the pretty boards. But PC games don't take 50 square feet of table space, and they're immune from cats.

You've never had your cat try to crawl up your leg with claws out as you click the mouse on something important have you

[ravinhood]

[With the exceptions of CMX2]

Yeah same here. I will continue buying the CM series mainly because of the random features the games always provide. It's not stale like WAW or WitP or generalized WWII operational/strategic wargames. It's tactical and I like that. What I would wish for is some form of extended campaign feature in CMX2 that one can take a company or group of soldiers from the beginnings of the war to the end. (This is why SPWAW is also popular with me.) Sort of like an Easy Company or Big Red One group. I dunno perhaps I am the only one after a battle that scours the battlefield and check out the mens names who died during the battle. It would give more meaning to the whole game if these men could go from battle to battle and then one would begin to get sort of an attachment like one does when playing X-Com. I think it would be kewl the be able to name my men in my groups as well. Heh, I would have a David, and above all else a VEBBER (he'd always be my POINT man) lol, maybe just that added roleplay ability of naming ones units and a full campaign game would make CM series even greater. I also think an exceptional feature for CMX2 would be a full file of the whole scenario that plays out in real time and not in a wego system. Like watching a war movie after playing it. That was one of the best things I liked about Medieval Total War. I still have 100's of movies saved of famous battles I had. Many are epic, and many are just slaughters that are fun to watch again. heh