General Inquiry: Who plays with the Allies vs AI?

[daskomodo]

I've been reading a lot on these boards about Axis tactics and the optimal way to hit the magic number of 70 PP.

Some say it's too easy. I'll admit I can reliably win with the Axis at challenging. I haven't tried any tougher difficulty yet.

A common rite of passage for all of us is winning an autovictory with the Axis vs the AI. From there, we develop "killer" tactics to take into PBEM gaming.

Just out of curiosity, how many are trying to play vs AI as the Allies and whopping it good? (total victory in 1944 for example)

Maybe we feel that the Allies can't handle Axis autovictory or 1946 victory simply because we lack the experience?

My experiences: At challenging, I've gotten some 1945 victory, managed to collapse Germany in 1943 once, but due to terrible fleet management, Japan lived on until Winter 1945.


P.S. The intent here is to gather info on your Allies vs AI experiences. Maybe this can help out to make the AI make wiser choices. So, please, no, "this should be changed" comments for now. Let's see what we can do with what's offered first, then work our way from there.

[dembe73]

I played with the Allies against the AI a few time. With advanced supplies taking fortress Western Germany takes a few turns if you dont organize logistics well ahead. I think it was 1943 when the siege started.

Main reason for this early defeat: too many Germans responded to my WA D-Day and as a consequence the Russian front collapsed. Killing Japan took me longer also due to poor fleet movement.

[TOCarroll]

I do. The AI is nice & predictable. It would have had a hard time fighting someone as devious and erratic as Hitler (or Chjurchill, for that matter). Just keep it off balance. With the WA, that consists of building up enough troops & supply quickly, and use the Churchillian "nibbling around the perimiter of Europe". Did I say nibbling, perhaps a few sucker punches would be a better description. If you control Britan/Us, Russia, and China, that would consist of:

1) GETTING READY FOR THE INEVATIABLE. Atomic Bombs, or super tough paratroopers, advanced ASW...The computer will give you a lot more room for reasearch than the humans I have been unfornute enough to encounter.

2) If you can provoke the AI to attack you (US, Russia, China) before Winter 43, it gives you more room to hit back. Keep ptions open, so that you can hit the Axis from several locations. (Fer cryin' out loud, you have most of Europe and Aisia to work with. Have the Wallies do some bombing, and see if you can locate a soft spot. Instead of straight defense, (as Russia, give the Germans a little room, and hit a nice soft spopt with a counter-attack.

I feel that the AI has a hard time allocating troops and supplies to counter multiple (if smaller) threats. Once you have a toe-hold, tear them a new you-know-what.

3) Make SURE you use the production advantage to keep an enormous stock of supplies. That was, historically a big problem for the Axis, and it is here. If you dont do that (and this includes replacement transport, ASW, and Air cover, as well as trucks), you will find the computer lanning a nasty, well calculated counter attack. Use overkill, you can afford it.

I'm sure that there are a lot of people who now want to stomp me in a PBEM game.....that is just my point-the WILL stomp me. It is a lot harder to beat a human (at least, in my experience.

The quickest way to illustrate this is to play the AI a couple of games with the fog of war off. Watch what it does. It is very good at not wasting that 1 extra militia unit on this or that atttack......not so good at expecting you to take risks.

Hope this helps.

Prussian Tom

[Badbonez]

OK, I took you up on that. I played as the WAllies only, let the computer play all the other sides (I think it would have been even easier if I played Russia and China). The settings was challenging. Germany fell in Fall of 1944, mainly due to my 1942 invasion of Northern Italy (which really needs to sprout militia - what? You think all the Italians were out have a cafe when the allies rolled in?). It was all down hill from there. I learned a lot about pre-planning logistics, so this wasn't a completely wasted exercise. [;)]

Japan fell in fall 1945. Took me that long to build enough transports and move my units to the Pacific theater. But the ending was swift and painless for Japan...massive bombing strikes and the inevitable invasion. Total Allied Victory, my score was 6831.

[daskomodo]

Sorry, when I said Allies, I mean Western Allies/Russia/China as well. I'm not trying to shackle you to an AI partner.

It's just that I'm under the impression that, as a community, we practice less with the Allies. This may be giving us the illusion that the Axis is stronger than it really is (Germany going for Gibraltar and Persia always wins PP victory, even in PBEM), when the problem is that we're still figuring out how to handle the Allies.


My idea is this:
if
Winning with the Axis vs Challenging AI by 1943 with PP win = ready for Axis PBEM
then
Winning with the Allies (west + russia) vs Challenging AI by 1944 = ready for Allied PBEM ?

Feel free to PBEM at any time. [:D] I just think it's a good self-test.

[Badbonez]

Its actually easier if you coordinate as the Allies and play all three countries. If I am Russia and the Wallies, I can ignore supplies and get them from the US, same with China. The computer does not comprehend Lend Lease. And Japan ALWAYS attacks the US before Winter 43. That pretty much ends the game right there.

Regardless, I've played games with all the a allies, set to challenging and giving the AI a +1 attack bonus. I still win. The AI does nothing more than what it is programmed to do. THe only way to really stretch the brain is to play another human. If you play the AI too much you end up getting sloppy.

Edit: Do you think the Axis can Auto Victory before 1944?

[daskomodo]

Regardless, I've played games with all the a allies, set to challenging and giving the AI a +1 attack bonus. I still win.

Yeah, I'm just curious about the timeframe it's in. The win is inevitable. And I agree with you, AI leads to bad habits. That's why I think 1944 victory with the Allies is a good goal vs just winning eventually. It forces an Allied player to use his forces effectively, hitting the Axis early and often. Lessons that can be used against a human Axis player.

Do you think the Axis can Auto Victory before 1944?

Against a challenging AI? Yes, yes I do. In fact, I've done it reliably following a "master plan", totally ignoring the US and winning before the American units can reach me.