A really cool photo.

[Nikademus]

It wouldn't suprise me. I just wanted to point out that the attack as a whole was not a routine attack. (its often used to access how good "flak" should be) For example the Nell/Betties certainly didn't weave in and out of Force Z looking for targets though some of them did fly over and strafe the battleships after having launched their torps (vs. veering off). Overall though it was a fairly conventional torpedo attack.

It also highlights that curious mentality that could affect the Japanese crews at times. When your facing an "invasion", what is more worthwhile a target than a loaded transport?? Sinking a battleship or a cruiser is all fine and good. Then again, easy for me to say, safe in my chair at work. Hindsight makes Admirals of us all. [;)]

[Cap Mandrake]

What amazes me about the picture is how insanely accurate the flak fire is. 5 or 6 bursts above 200 ft perhaps with 70% under 50 ft?[X(] One burst is maybe 10 ft off the water.

So much for the flying under the angle of depression of the guns idea. Look at the poor sod in the distance. He is right in the middle of it.

[ChezDaJez]

Yeah, but look at the 2 Bettys in the foreground. Not a burst near them. None of the flak looks very close.

Chez

[Cap Mandrake]

ORIGINAL: ChezDaJez

Yeah, but look at the 2 Bettys in the foreground. Not a burst near them. None of the flak looks very close.

Chez

True...but perhaps the fire was concentrated on the planes nearer the source of the flak.

BTW..is this pic from another Betty or from a US ship?

[rtrapasso]

ORIGINAL: Cap Mandrake

ORIGINAL: ChezDaJez

Yeah, but look at the 2 Bettys in the foreground. Not a burst near them. None of the flak looks very close.

Chez

True...but perhaps the fire was concentrated on the planes nearer the source of the flak.

BTW..is this pic from another Betty or from a US ship?

I've seen this before - i think it was taken from a US ship. IIRC, it is a part of blowup of a much smaller photo.

[ChezDaJez]

I've seen this before - i think it was taken from a US ship. IIRC, it is a part of blowup of a much smaller photo.

The photo is in the US Navy archives so was probably taken by a Navy photogtrapher. The photo is full sized compared with the original in the archives. Don't know what ship it was taken from but judging from the height of the photo my guess is a transport or cruiser, something reasonably tall.

Chez

[Onime No Kyo]

ORIGINAL: ChezDaJez

I've read somewhere on the web (can't find it now) that the Betty aircrews routinely practiced and used extreme low level flying because they thought that US AA guns couldn't be depressed low enough to effectively engage them. From looking at the photo, it looks like there may be some validity to the argument as it appears most AA fire is too high.

I seem to recall something similar but more along the lines of Americans ceasing fire for fear of hitting their own ships.

[PeteG662]

Now I would think those Betties are too LOW to launch torpedoes since the splash may have an impact on the plane. Was there a minimum safe altitude to launch?

[LittleJoe]

ORIGINAL: Moquia

I was a bold attack. Here is how many of them ended:







The 2 first is probably the same bomber though.

Great photos, espically the 2nd one, the colour gives a greater sense of "realism"

[janushm]

you think the crew of the ditched plane would have gotten away?

[1275psi]

from memory, casualties almost ran at 100% for this attack, and the only hit was the plane that crashed into a merchie.
They were after the warships, and had to fly over the transports

Do remember the attack came from the south[X(], they flew right around lunga looking for the carriers, then decided to "see whats at the beach" on the way home.
It did ruin the naval LBA for weeks

[mc3744]

They REALLY had some guts!!!

Although they were the bad guys, you've got to admit that it takes some real courage to do something like that.
I don't even want to immagine what it must have been like. I'm pretty sure I'd piss in my pants ... if not worse [:'(]

[freeboy]

does anyone know if any flak like a small cannister round.. lots of smalller calliber round balls was ever used againstthis tyope attack.. ever used in larger guns.. I imagine a 8" shotgun would be hell on a plane shotting 1 inch balls in a canister round????

[Vladd]

The crew of the ditched plane didn't make it - they survived the crash but were shot by the destoyers crew just before the photos were taken. Some reports say the Japanese airmen had climbed onto the wreckage and fired pistols at the US ship before being killed, but I don't know how true that is.

[janushm]

well i asked because of the top gunner hatch being open and the plane was in reasonable ....ahem..... condition

[Moquia]

ORIGINAL: Vladd

The crew of the ditched plane didn't make it - they survived the crash but were shot by the destoyers crew just before the photos were taken. Some reports say the Japanese airmen had climbed onto the wreckage and fired pistols at the US ship before being killed, but I don't know how true that is.

He, he. Attacking a destroyer with 300 angry saylors onboard with pistols. It wasn't shure lack of guts!