protect polesti and rumenian oil fields....

Gen.Urquhart · Post by **Gen.Urquhart** » Mon Dec 17, 2001 3:50 pm

Hi all,
i just got through the game arriving at march 43.The us air force started to attack my oilfields in rumania and i tried to react giving 2 squadrons of 109 to a rumanian army set in bucharest,but nothing happened!My planes do not even move when the americans come with their fortresses.What do i have to do for that?And another thing:I have 6 squadron of fighters between france and OKW,but when the us planes arrive only few planes (not more than 10)go up to intercept them as they used to do some months ago.Why????Any help?

Thanks in advance

czerpak · Post by **czerpak** » Mon Dec 17, 2001 4:03 pm

Originally posted by Gen.Urquhart:
Hi all,
i just got through the game arriving at march 43.The us air force started to attack my oilfields in rumania and i tried to react giving 2 squadrons of 109 to a rumanian army set in bucharest,but nothing happened!My planes do not even move when the americans come with their fortresses.What do i have to do for that?And another thing:I have 6 squadron of fighters between france and OKW,but when the us planes arrive only few planes (not more than 10)go up to intercept them as they used to do some months ago.Why????Any help?

Thanks in advance

Need some more details, but here are some ideas :
1. check if your planes are in range
2. make sure they are on CAP
3. maybe you have lots of planes damaged ?
Maciej

Gen.Urquhart · Post by **Gen.Urquhart** » Mon Dec 17, 2001 4:25 pm

the range is good(bucharest with polesti).The planes are on CAP.The damage is ok for the planes in rumania and also for those in france.It seems that the system do not let u to protect your industry due to the historical couse of war.I prefer to let my units in the east without any air support so that my industries can optimize the prduction covered by fighters,but if the system doesn't let me do so i must change my strategy.....is there a precise point where you have to set your planes in order to defend a particular city or it just depends if the city is in the range of the fighters?For example:Essen is defended by the squadrons located in france:why?Why it is not defended by those from OKW or OKH?
thanks

czerpak · Post by **czerpak** » Mon Dec 17, 2001 4:36 pm

Originally posted by Gen.Urquhart:
the range is good(bucharest with polesti).The planes are on CAP.The damage is ok for the planes in rumania and also for those in france.It seems that the system do not let u to protect your industry due to the historical couse of war.I prefer to let my units in the east without any air support so that my industries can optimize the prduction covered by fighters,but if the system doesn't let me do so i must change my strategy.....is there a precise point where you have to set your planes in order to defend a particular city or it just depends if the city is in the range of the fighters?For example:Essen is defended by the squadrons located in france:why?Why it is not defended by those from OKW or OKH?
thanks

Never happened to me, have no idea whats going on.
I play a 1943 scenario with Lorenzo ( he as germans). We are now in January 1944 and so far he didnt have any problems with fighters in the west and Romania. He keeps his fighters in OKW and they perform well, also Ploesti cover works ok.

czerpak · Post by **czerpak** » Mon Dec 17, 2001 4:37 pm

Defending city depends on range.

Muzrub · Post by **Muzrub** » Mon Dec 17, 2001 5:03 pm

Where exactly do you have to place your fighters to protect your industry?

Lokioftheaesir · Post by **Lokioftheaesir** » Mon Dec 17, 2001 5:24 pm

Originally posted by Gen.Urquhart:
the range is good(bucharest with polesti).The planes are on CAP.The damage is ok for the planes in rumania and also for those in france.It seems that the system do not let u to protect your industry due to the historical couse of war.I prefer to let my units in the east without any air support so that my industries can optimize the prduction covered by fighters,but if the system doesn't let me do so i must change my strategy.....is there a precise point where you have to set your planes in order to defend a particular city or it just depends if the city is in the range of the fighters?For example:Essen is defended by the squadrons located in france:why?Why it is not defended by those from OKW or OKH?
thanks

Mon General

If you want to know about defending the Reich ask Svar. You there buddy?.
My game with him ended in dec '44 and i dont think
one bomb landed on the Reich up to that time.

Nick

[ December 17, 2001: Message edited by: Lokioftheaesir ]</p>

moi · Post by **moi** » Mon Dec 17, 2001 8:20 pm

Some comments:

Bf109 (or 110) is almost useless vs B17/24
Use FW-190. Standard scheme - 2 group in OKW, 2 in Italian Front (or in 4 Rum Army/8 It Army in Rome), 2 in 3 Rum Army (Ploesti). With this variant the probability of damaging factory less than 0.1 per turn

Sorry for my terrible English.
Regards,
moi

Gen.Urquhart · Post by **Gen.Urquhart** » Mon Dec 17, 2001 9:46 pm

Thanks guys,
I'll try that,but my deployment is not that different from the one you suggested.BTW i'll try to transfer the rum Army in Polesti and see.......But i'm not sure how long My industry will last with this rythm....the heavy industry has fallen to 42 and The reich minister Albert Speer is almost in a nerve crisis!!!^__^

RickyB · Post by **RickyB** » Mon Dec 17, 2001 11:14 pm

Originally posted by Gen.Urquhart:
Thanks guys,
I'll try that,but my deployment is not that different from the one you suggested.BTW i'll try to transfer the rum Army in Polesti and see.......But i'm not sure how long My industry will last with this rythm....the heavy industry has fallen to 42 and The reich minister Albert Speer is almost in a nerve crisis!!!^__^

If you would like, please send me a save game on this, and I will look to see if anything jumps out regarding the problem, as having your industry that low already is not good, and would seem to indicate you are having major problems.

Lorenzo from Spain · Post by **Lorenzo from Spain** » Tue Dec 18, 2001 1:02 am

About Germany:
Only intercept the fighters of ONE single HQ, I think the nearest. So, concentrate your fighters, the best place is West HQ.
Sometimes appears a new fighter in East HQ, and try to intercept an attack. Bad luck, send the next turn the fighter to another place.
I think that even if are training fighters in a HQ, they try to intercept the strategic bombers... without forces, of course.
About Ploesty, I don´t know what is happen. May be you´re a training fighter near this city?

Mist · Post by **Mist** » Tue Dec 18, 2001 10:53 am

Originally posted by moi:
Some comments:

Bf109 (or 110) is almost useless vs B17/24
Use FW-190. Standard scheme - 2 group in OKW, 2 in Italian Front (or in 4 Rum Army/8 It Army in Rome), 2 in 3 Rum Army (Ploesti). With this variant the probability of damaging factory less than 0.1 per turn

Sorry for my terrible English.
Regards,
moi

I have to disagree. I've passed through the campaign'44 in human vs.human mode playing only air war over Germany and its Allies to see whether is it possible to defend from strategic bombings in this campaign. As a result I can say that it is a bit harder to defend with Bf109G/K but definitely possible(if you have hordes of them). I have also tried to defend with jets only(switching all production). It is probably little bit easier job, but more risky. You must reequip nearly all airgroups during heavy fighting. FW190A/F are not bad also, but FW190D(cannon 8) is much worser than FW190F(cannon 18) which stops to fly cap missions in 1945 because of becoming obsolete.

Svar · Post by **Svar** » Wed Dec 19, 2001 7:14 am

Originally posted by Lokioftheaesir:

Mon General

If you want to know about defending the Reich ask Svar. You there buddy?.
My game with him ended in dec '44 and i dont think
one bomb landed on the Reich up to that time.

Nick

[ December 17, 2001: Message edited by: Lokioftheaesir ]

Nick,

I have been trapped in Civ 3 lately but do check the forum occasionally.

The defense of Germany is done differently than the eastern front. OKW, OKH , West Front, and Italian Front are all super HQs, that's why they are now immobile. The fighter groups based in any of the super HQs can and do intercept all USAAF raids up to 20 hexes away with a limitation on how far east they will go. The closest HQ will send up intercepting fighters irregardless of the number stationed there or if they are all on training. If there is an ordinary HQ with fighters closer than one of the super HQs it will sent the intercepters.

A couple of problems can occur. First when a new fighter group arrives with 10 fighters it will sent the intercepters if it is the closest HQ. Second there used to be a bug that caused very large fighter groups set to CAP to only sent 10 to 20 fighters to intercept. The bug was supposed to be fixed but I always set my super HQ fighters to Escort just in case because even though they could only sent up to 80% of the available ready A/C that was better than 5%.

It is possible to completely defend Germany from USAAF attack but you need to place Elite groups there to do it and be prepared to increase the numbers as the war progresses because the USAAF gets stronger as the war goes on. The best planes to do that is the Fw-190a until the Me-262 becomes available. I only station fighter groups in West Front and Italian Front but do place a regular HQ at Ploiesti and another one near Budapest/Vienna with a couple of fighter groups each. The super HQs don't go that far east.

Svar

PS. It's time to go back to Civ 3.

Gen.Urquhart · Post by **Gen.Urquhart** » Wed Dec 19, 2001 1:09 pm

That's the point i Think!A bug or something like that!I got a group of 175 (or something like that)Me109 and when it's time to go up only 10 of them go intercepting....luckly this happens not always but enough to let the americans destroy the "Speer's best Toy"(my heavy industry now is 65)

PS:Svar,how is it Civ 3?I wanted to buy it but i was wondering if it was a better choice to buy Call to Power 2
Thanks

Ed Cogburn · Post by **Ed Cogburn** » Wed Dec 19, 2001 6:50 pm

Originally posted by Gen.Urquhart:
That's the point i Think!A bug or something like that!I got a group of 175 (or something like that)Me109 and when it's time to go up only 10 of them go intercepting....luckly this happens not always but enough to let the americans destroy the "Speer's best Toy"(my heavy industry now is 65)

PS:Svar,how is it Civ 3?I wanted to buy it but i was wondering if it was a better choice to buy Call to Power 2
Thanks

I don't know what Svar's experience has been, but you may want to wait for a few more patches before trying Civ3 (one patch so far). Fundamentally its good, but it has problems right now. If they can fix the problems (some are balance issues) it will be great.

Tank123 · Post by **Tank123** » Sat Dec 29, 2001 11:16 am

I heard that the rumanian IAR 80 fighters were very good and that they made gave the USAF heavy losses on the bombardement of Ploesti. Are the IARs included in the game?

Ed Cogburn · Post by **Ed Cogburn** » Sat Dec 29, 2001 1:36 pm

Originally posted by Tank123:
I heard that the rumanian IAR 80 fighters were very good and that they made gave the USAF heavy losses on the bombardement of Ploesti. Are the IARs included in the game?

No they aren't currently in the game. At this point I don't think they'll be added officially, mainly because they were produced only in small numbers. Romania just couldn't crank them out in large numbers, particularly given German reluctance to give them critical materials that the Luftwaffe itself needed badly.

The IAR fighter versions equipped with 20mm cannon were good against unescorted bombers but not as good as the Fw190 fighters were. Once the American bombers got fighter escorts after taking the southern part of the Italian peninsula, the success of the IAR dropped substantially. Later on, some of the older models were switched with later models fighting on the eastern front because the P51 fighters in the west totally outclassed them. Towards the end, some Romanian air groups were equipped with German Me109 fighters, rather than IAR types, because the Germans were willing to give them 109 fighters, and because the late model 109 types were clearly better than the late model IAR fighters.