Random Unfreeze War Entry Dates

[GenChaos33]

Any way to add some uncertainty to the unfreeze dates of both Russia & USA entering the War (if never attacked by Axis powers)?

Maybe like a 33% chance of that country entering the War one season early, 33% chance of entering on scheduled date, or 33% chance of entering one season late. This could be randomly set at the start of the game, but just never told to players until it happens.

Just an idea, GC

[a511]

i always welcome the idea to make the war entry dates a random event and i did write a couple of thread about this idea ... but nobody listen [:(] ...

anyway, instead of +/- one turn, i think it will be a lot more interesting to make it +/- two or even three turns!! (i know, that means it all leave to luck ... but thats life!)

one more pt to add is i think it is more appropriate to have the WA entered the war b4 or at least in the same turn as the russians enter the war. i really dont think stalin really 1)hate hilter so much, and 2) like the commonwealth that much ...

just my little idea.

AN

[Paul Vebber]

THe design intent in this game, as I explained in a couple other threads, was to have the game based as much on player strategy and decisions as possible. Both to provide a more straighforward game experience and to keep things as simple as possible. Even with 'determinsitic triggers' there is a lot to keep track of.

That said the issues of players wanting a game that is more complex, has more modes of interaction that are more varied and allow for more surprises has not been ignored by 2by3. There will be more "variability" in teh Civil war game and in future games in teh series, one of which will likely revisit WWII with a much more rich and complex set of rules.

To "tack all that on" the current game would probably end up with something that would satisfy neither the fans that like the game the way it is, and disappoint those who want more, but have to settle for it shoe horned into the present implementation.

More on the Civil war game, and future games in the series will be coming later ths year...stay tuned.

[Franky513]

I don't support the idea of a randomized war entry of Russia and the USA, since the game would depend on luck.

Ciao Frank

[5cats]

How about this idea:
That the WA player could "call in" the USA, but the factory multiplier for USA would take a hit. It would goto x2,x3 &x4 much later than schedualed, depending on how early they're called. There may be 'triggers' or situations that have to be met before this could be done, IDK.
It was obvious the USA was looking for an excuse to enter the war "legally" before Pearl, and has often invented excuses to enter other wars. The cost of this was the anger & discontent of their own peoples, reflected in this case by poorer production.
>>On the other front, increasing the ## of units required on the Russian border each year sounds good to me.

[Forwarn45]

I'm also not convinced random dates would improve the game significantly.

On the other front, increasing the ## of units required on the Russian border each year sounds good to me.

I actually think this may be the best game "fix" for the situation where the Axis tries to go all out for an AV that leaves them to the mercy of the Russians come Winter of 43. On the other hand, I'm not convinced it makes sense to allow early US entry without belligerant action in the Americas such as an invasion of Canada. IMO it would, however, be interesting to allow the Russians to attack Germany with some severe penalties - i.e., no militia generated, and production remains (or is even reduced) to 2x and/or troop quality is reduced (probably the more realistic option) to reflect less support for an offensive war than "The Great Patriotic War" as the Soviets called the defense of their homeland.

[sajbalk]

the AV seems very difficult to dfeat, and I think even raising the limits on PP needed wil not solve the dilemna so long as Russia neef not be attacked until the last turn.

A random entry date is a bit of luck, but the game could be rejiggered as to the following seeminly easily:

1. increase the garrison needed for Germany and Japan. Germany, I would say 1 per turn per territory beginning in winter 1941. For Japan, I would say 1 per turn beginning in 1944.

2. Allow the US to unfreeze upon UK being conquered OR Germany invading India OR Canada.

Great game, and I am learning how to get better, but I think the game could be improved a little in the above regard, both as to historical accuracy and game balance.

[James Ward]

I don't support the idea of a randomized war entry of Russia and the USA, since the game would depend on luck.

Why would it have to depend on luck? You could have a random advance of 0 or 1 or 2 turns based on actions taken, such as the Axis invading Spain, Sweden, or Turkey. Don't want to change the entry date, don't invade them [:D]

[Paul Vebber]

The current AV thinking is leaning toward requiring one of Moscow or London to be taken, plus 70PP to get an AV.

That forces the Germans to make some respectable show of force to a major power in oder to win an AV.

[a511]

Why would it have to depend on luck? You could have a random advance of 0 or 1 or 2 turns based on actions taken, such as the Axis invading Spain, Sweden, or Turkey. Don't want to change the entry date, don't invade them

in fact, thats sth like my original idea in a couple of earlier threads.

The current AV thinking is leaning toward requiring one of Moscow or London to be taken, plus 70PP to get an AV.

That forces the Germans to make some respectable show of force to a major power in oder to win an AV.

agree to this one!

AN

[RocketMan]

Why would it have to depend on luck? You could have a random advance of 0 or 1 or 2 turns based on actions taken, such as the Axis invading Spain, Sweden, or Turkey. Don't want to change the entry date, don't invade them [:D]

I would like to see the US entry based on factors that occur in the game rather than it be a fixed date. If Germany and/or Japan only invades the countries they did historically, the entry date could be left where it is. But if they are more aggressive than they were historically, it should be moved up, possibly based on the number of PP's the countries are worth.

This method would eliminate the randomness factor.