Pluner Problem?

[siRkid]

I've seen messages where my own troops have plundered my own provinces. I think this was do to me moving them and then setting them to plunder and then when the turn is executed they plunder before they move. At any rate, friendly troops should never plunder friendly provinces.

[Ralegh]

The ability to plunder in your own provinces is a game feature, not a bug.

It costs you 5 national morale when you do it, but saves you the upkeep on the units. It does not have any chance to actually dstroy imporvements the way plundering in enemy territory does.

I don't think the problem here is with plundering - it is with the magical relocation units: I think we should have 3 months of 'peace treaty limited access' to evacuate, and stop the magical flying around.

[siRkid]

It costs you 5 national morale when you do it, but saves you the upkeep on the units. It does not have any chance to actually dstroy imporvements the way plundering in enemy territory does.

Ok I can live with that as long as improvments are not destroyed.

[ian77]

ORIGINAL: Kid

It costs you 5 national morale when you do it, but saves you the upkeep on the units. It does not have any chance to actually dstroy imporvements the way plundering in enemy territory does.

Ok I can live with that as long as improvments are not destroyed.

The screen certainly displays a message that bank or roads, etc have been plundered.... I will check some old saves and see if the level of improvement is effected.

[ericbabe]

It may indeed destroy improvements in your territories. We do allow plundering in home territory as it is a way to save some upkeep money.

A good thing would be to turn off plundering orders whenever units are "teleported" at the end of a war. I'll add this to my list.

[ian77]

ORIGINAL: ericbabe

It may indeed destroy improvements in your territories. We do allow plundering in home territory as it is a way to save some upkeep money.

A good thing would be to turn off plundering orders whenever units are "teleported" at the end of a war. I'll add this to my list.

Yes please![:D]..... but don't let it hold up the first patch[;)]

[siRkid]

I think there may be a problem of when they plunder. Does it occor at the begining of the move or the end? I think it should be at the end so you can set orders to move into a proviance and plunder it.

[dpstafford]

ORIGINAL: Kid

I think there may be a problem of when they plunder. Does it occor at the begining of the move or the end? I think it should be at the end so you can set orders to move into a proviance and plunder it.

But what happens if you don't make it all the way to the province you intended to plunder? The plunder orders need to be province specific!?! There are many such problems in the current design of CoG that seem really, well, insurmountable......

[siRkid]

Well, then it may have to fall on us to manage it better and only give the order to plunder on the turn after you arrive and your not moving. I could live with that if I had to.

[dpstafford]

ORIGINAL: Kid

Well, then it may have to fall on us to manage it better and only give the order to plunder on the turn after you arrive and your not moving. I could live with that if I had to.

It is going to be easier on everyone if the plunder/forage/depot supply decision is resolved based on where you start the turn, since you never really know where you will end it.

[carnifex]

I disagree. All supply, plunder, and upkeep should happen when it does, at the end of the turn, for precisely the reason that you won't be sure where the units will be.

I want more friction, not less. Otherwise I might as well play chess.

[ian77]

ORIGINAL: Kid

I think there may be a problem of when they plunder. Does it occor at the begining of the move or the end?

It occurs at the begining of your turn.

[ericbabe]

ORIGINAL: dpstafford
It is going to be easier on everyone if the plunder/forage/depot supply decision is resolved based on where you start the turn, since you never really know where you will end it.

I could see plunder happening always at the beginning, but we made the design decision to have supply/upkeep after all the movement so that moving enemies had a chance to cut your depot chains. If supply always happened at the beginning then your depot chains would always be intact.

And also I find that it's a nice limitation on movement, though I admit it can be confusing to people new to the system.

[ericbabe]

ORIGINAL: ian77
It occurs at the begining of your turn.

Plunder should occur at the beginning. But it may occur after surrenders and relocation of invading units; offhand, I'm not sure exactly when it occurs.

[dpstafford]

ORIGINAL: ericbabe
I could see plunder happening always at the beginning, but we made the design decision to have supply/upkeep after all the movement so that moving enemies had a chance to cut your depot chains. If supply always happened at the beginning then your depot chains would always be intact.

And also I find that it's a nice limitation on movement, though I admit it can be confusing to people new to the system.

I appreciate the explanation. But I disagree for a couple of reasons. One, if you had sensible rules about where you could build depots (such as only where you have troops at the beginning of the turn), then you could still have supply lines cut even with supply determination at the start of the turn (that is, you would be out of supply at the beginning of the next turn). Putting it at the end just turns everything into a crap shoot, not what you want in a strategy game. I could also mention that your team has proven to be rather inept at trying to implement any of the more complex game concepts attempted in CoG. Sometimes simpler really is better!

[Jordan]

Congratulations. You win.

[dpstafford]

ORIGINAL: Jordan
Congratulations. You win.

I usually do.......

[dpstafford]

ORIGINAL: carnifex
I disagree. All supply, plunder, and upkeep should happen when it does, at the end of the turn, for precisely the reason that you won't be sure where the units will be.

I want more friction, not less.

Maybe. If it were well implemented. I agree that my proposed change would "reduce" friction". But there is so much rough baggage already in the game......

I'm not suggesting that the game be made as dry as chess, or even as dry as EiA. But as it stands, you'd need a life jacket to play CoG.

[Jordan]

Usually? Don't underestimate yourself.

[dpstafford]

ORIGINAL: Jordan

Usually? Don't underestimate yourself.

Hey, when you're right, you're right.