Jim,
The low quality Allied pilots Vs. Zero bonus Zeros concerns me quite a bit. But as you say I don't have to stack my planes in any one airbase, and I don't actaully need my LBA to take out KB, it just needs to beat up transports. IF KB puts in enough effort to suppress 5 airbases (which may not be possible, but is certainly a maximum effort) then I can send in my CVs with a fair chance of success.
If KB does not suppress the air bases then Mogami takes constant heavy attrition, and lives with the possiblitly of Allied CVs getting involved at any time. Also if the air is flying in strength then Mogami can't refuel and re-arm KB in Hawaii, he has to go somewhere else. Same problem with his BBs. A big part of Adm. Laurent's successful attack on Pearl was re-arming his BBs close to Oahu. But if everywhere close to Oahu is getting hit by US airstrikes that becomes much more dangerous.
Of couse this may all be moot, Mogami has to decide to come for the place first.
Lunacy In The Pacific Mogami Vs. Tom Hunter
Moderators: wdolson, Don Bowen, mogami
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Tom Hunter
- Posts: 2194
- Joined: Tue Dec 14, 2004 1:57 am
December 31 1941
It's not Chinese new year, but we are going there anyway.
The Chinese have pulled off two important tricks in the last few days.
The first was surviving a major Japanese attack on the 29th:
Ground combat at Kaifeng
Japanese Shock attack
Attacking force 211088 troops, 2489 guns, 17 vehicles
Defending force 82614 troops, 443 guns, 0 vehicles
Japanese assault odds: 1 to 1
Japanese ground losses:
9244 casualties reported
Guns lost 273
Vehicles lost 6
Allied ground losses:
1801 casualties reported
Guns lost 30
The second was getting a large Chinese army past Wuhan. The entire force at Changsha marched into Wuhan and then split. Half is going North to Homan, though they are really going to rescue the Kaifeng defenders, and the other half is moving back to Changsha to join with other troops coming in from the hinterland.
The numbers show the number of Japanese units in the hex.
The troops that passed through Wuhan will all be across the river tomorrow, and I think I have mastered the movement rules enough to be sure of that. It is an open question weather they will be able to save the Kaifeng pocket, but at least they have a chance.
The troops in Kaifeng are improving in quality a lot, they range from 55 to 67 XP and similar moral. For comparison the Changsha army is 30 to 45 xp and lower moral, and they have not done any fighting.
Maybe China will save itself and get a half way decent army out of the whole thing. Maybe not, but at least it is not boring.
In other news the Dutch continue largely ineffective airstrikes on Japanese shipping around Java. Mogami is not even bothering to suppress my airfields.
In Burma the first Japanese fighters showed up, Zeros at Moulmein, Oscars at Raheng. I lost a number of planes in the air today, (14) and have switched bombing targets to places that have no Japanese fighters. The bombing missions are mainly to boost the xp of the bomber formations, though they also consume a little Japanese supply or slow his troop movements ever so slightly. Two divisions of Chinese troops have flown in toMandalay, and Rangoon will be evacuated once the Japanese enter the country. The goal is to delay the Japanese long enough for the remaining Chinese divisions to finish walking to North Burma.
In India the first big loads of Malay army troops are disembarking at Trimcomalee. More convoys are closing on Georgetown and more troops will be coming out soon.
Australia and the South Pacific are all about getting supplies in place and finding Japanese bases to train against. Mogami has not gone for Rabaul, so Rabaul is going for Mogami, but there is not a lot to work with. Two naval bombardments of Admiralty Island succeeded in raising the Australian navies night combat rating from 35 to 37! Similar raids are planned for other ships, in the hope of getting them to some level of efficiency before they meet their first Japanese warships.
A US infantry division has started unloading at Hilo, and a base force is already on the other base on the big island. Two air groups that unloaded at Palmyra are also flying in, and supply levels are rising at all bases.
Large numbers of US subs are approaching the Phillipines with orders to pull out base forces.
Mogami has slowed the pace of air operations against the Allies for two days now, that makes me wonder where he will hit next.
The Chinese have pulled off two important tricks in the last few days.
The first was surviving a major Japanese attack on the 29th:
Ground combat at Kaifeng
Japanese Shock attack
Attacking force 211088 troops, 2489 guns, 17 vehicles
Defending force 82614 troops, 443 guns, 0 vehicles
Japanese assault odds: 1 to 1
Japanese ground losses:
9244 casualties reported
Guns lost 273
Vehicles lost 6
Allied ground losses:
1801 casualties reported
Guns lost 30
The second was getting a large Chinese army past Wuhan. The entire force at Changsha marched into Wuhan and then split. Half is going North to Homan, though they are really going to rescue the Kaifeng defenders, and the other half is moving back to Changsha to join with other troops coming in from the hinterland.
The numbers show the number of Japanese units in the hex.
The troops that passed through Wuhan will all be across the river tomorrow, and I think I have mastered the movement rules enough to be sure of that. It is an open question weather they will be able to save the Kaifeng pocket, but at least they have a chance.
The troops in Kaifeng are improving in quality a lot, they range from 55 to 67 XP and similar moral. For comparison the Changsha army is 30 to 45 xp and lower moral, and they have not done any fighting.
Maybe China will save itself and get a half way decent army out of the whole thing. Maybe not, but at least it is not boring.
In other news the Dutch continue largely ineffective airstrikes on Japanese shipping around Java. Mogami is not even bothering to suppress my airfields.
In Burma the first Japanese fighters showed up, Zeros at Moulmein, Oscars at Raheng. I lost a number of planes in the air today, (14) and have switched bombing targets to places that have no Japanese fighters. The bombing missions are mainly to boost the xp of the bomber formations, though they also consume a little Japanese supply or slow his troop movements ever so slightly. Two divisions of Chinese troops have flown in toMandalay, and Rangoon will be evacuated once the Japanese enter the country. The goal is to delay the Japanese long enough for the remaining Chinese divisions to finish walking to North Burma.
In India the first big loads of Malay army troops are disembarking at Trimcomalee. More convoys are closing on Georgetown and more troops will be coming out soon.
Australia and the South Pacific are all about getting supplies in place and finding Japanese bases to train against. Mogami has not gone for Rabaul, so Rabaul is going for Mogami, but there is not a lot to work with. Two naval bombardments of Admiralty Island succeeded in raising the Australian navies night combat rating from 35 to 37! Similar raids are planned for other ships, in the hope of getting them to some level of efficiency before they meet their first Japanese warships.
A US infantry division has started unloading at Hilo, and a base force is already on the other base on the big island. Two air groups that unloaded at Palmyra are also flying in, and supply levels are rising at all bases.
Large numbers of US subs are approaching the Phillipines with orders to pull out base forces.
Mogami has slowed the pace of air operations against the Allies for two days now, that makes me wonder where he will hit next.
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Tom Hunter
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Japanese Naval Force is Suprised
January 1 1942
The PG did not survive this encounter but did score hits on the Japanese
The PG did not survive this encounter but did score hits on the Japanese
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Tom Hunter
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January 2 1942
In Burma British air units continue to attack the Japanese any place that does not have fighter cover. The whole point is to get the aircrew XP up out of the 50% range so they stand a chance when things get serious.
In Malaya the evacuation continues. Several squadrons of Blenhiem 4s have been sent to Georgetown to prey on Japanese shipping but the weather shut them down yesterday. There is a fair amount of stuff at Sea South of Singapore, I am hoping it gets attacked tomorrow.
In Java the Dutch score a small success when they counter attack and retake Djokarta.
Ground combat at Djokjakarta
Allied Shock attack
Attacking force 6461 troops, 75 guns, 9 vehicles
Defending force 1534 troops, 0 guns, 101 vehicles
Allied assault odds: 3 to 1 (fort level 0)
Allied forces CAPTURE Djokjakarta base !!!
Allied ground losses:
278 casualties reported
Guns lost 8
Defeated Japanese Units Retreating!
This buys the Dutch at least one more day of life, because the Japanese will have to retake Djokarta to continue thier advance. The Dutch are in Pursiut and may be able to grab the next base down the rail line as well, it depends on how quickly Mogami reacts.
The dream would be to chace him back to Soerbaja and then have the troops at Malag pull the same manuever that I just pulled at Wuchow, which would allow them to run for Batavia but I doubt that will happen.
In China the troops cut off in Kaifeng are about to be back in supply. Two Chinese Corps are about to knock the armor off the rail line, opening the route to Homan. Further South over 1,000 AP (labled 10 corps but I just checked its 7) are also heading for the rail line at a slower pace. Another 1970 AP are heading for Hsinyang, but it's doubtful they will stay there.
The big question now is will Mog be able to retreat the 1900 AP in the pocket. Those troops now have XP in the 50s and 60s, they are nearly twice as good as the other Chinese corps. Thier supply is low but if they can get reconnected and don't retreat they will form the core of a much more capable Chinese army in the North.
The army from Yenen is also heading for Chengting. They will fight a few days of bombardment combat and then leave. But in the process they will stop Mogami from responding with more troops from the North.
When I first moved into Kaifeng Mogami sent a note comparing me to Halsey and suggesting that I had just made a move that would cripple China. I did not argue with him then, partly because the move was a mistake, if I had thought about it I would not have done it. But also I did not want him to take me very seriously either.
Now the situtation looks ok for China, even if the Kaifeng troops retreat and leave their supply behind they won't die, and if they hold onto their supply China will be noteabley stronger than it was on December 7th.
Meantime another 3000 AP are fortifying Changsha which is now a level 5 fort. 400 more AP are close and more are on the way. With luck China is still one step ahead of Mogami and will stay that way for a while.
Finally in the South and Central Pacific the Allies continue to move troops, aircraft and supplies. The first F4F3s are on a ship between Noumea and Oz, the 2nd Marines are loading for Noumea, and air and ground forces continue to pour into Hawaii.
The difficult problem for these forces is finding ways to hit back without getting smashed by a Japanese offensive. Still thinking about that, and time will eventually show where KB is going after it stops off in Japan.
In Malaya the evacuation continues. Several squadrons of Blenhiem 4s have been sent to Georgetown to prey on Japanese shipping but the weather shut them down yesterday. There is a fair amount of stuff at Sea South of Singapore, I am hoping it gets attacked tomorrow.
In Java the Dutch score a small success when they counter attack and retake Djokarta.
Ground combat at Djokjakarta
Allied Shock attack
Attacking force 6461 troops, 75 guns, 9 vehicles
Defending force 1534 troops, 0 guns, 101 vehicles
Allied assault odds: 3 to 1 (fort level 0)
Allied forces CAPTURE Djokjakarta base !!!
Allied ground losses:
278 casualties reported
Guns lost 8
Defeated Japanese Units Retreating!
This buys the Dutch at least one more day of life, because the Japanese will have to retake Djokarta to continue thier advance. The Dutch are in Pursiut and may be able to grab the next base down the rail line as well, it depends on how quickly Mogami reacts.
The dream would be to chace him back to Soerbaja and then have the troops at Malag pull the same manuever that I just pulled at Wuchow, which would allow them to run for Batavia but I doubt that will happen.
In China the troops cut off in Kaifeng are about to be back in supply. Two Chinese Corps are about to knock the armor off the rail line, opening the route to Homan. Further South over 1,000 AP (labled 10 corps but I just checked its 7) are also heading for the rail line at a slower pace. Another 1970 AP are heading for Hsinyang, but it's doubtful they will stay there.
The big question now is will Mog be able to retreat the 1900 AP in the pocket. Those troops now have XP in the 50s and 60s, they are nearly twice as good as the other Chinese corps. Thier supply is low but if they can get reconnected and don't retreat they will form the core of a much more capable Chinese army in the North.
The army from Yenen is also heading for Chengting. They will fight a few days of bombardment combat and then leave. But in the process they will stop Mogami from responding with more troops from the North.
When I first moved into Kaifeng Mogami sent a note comparing me to Halsey and suggesting that I had just made a move that would cripple China. I did not argue with him then, partly because the move was a mistake, if I had thought about it I would not have done it. But also I did not want him to take me very seriously either.
Now the situtation looks ok for China, even if the Kaifeng troops retreat and leave their supply behind they won't die, and if they hold onto their supply China will be noteabley stronger than it was on December 7th.
Meantime another 3000 AP are fortifying Changsha which is now a level 5 fort. 400 more AP are close and more are on the way. With luck China is still one step ahead of Mogami and will stay that way for a while.
Finally in the South and Central Pacific the Allies continue to move troops, aircraft and supplies. The first F4F3s are on a ship between Noumea and Oz, the 2nd Marines are loading for Noumea, and air and ground forces continue to pour into Hawaii.
The difficult problem for these forces is finding ways to hit back without getting smashed by a Japanese offensive. Still thinking about that, and time will eventually show where KB is going after it stops off in Japan.
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Tom Hunter
- Posts: 2194
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January 4 1942
Japanese subs with Glens on board have been lurking off the US West coast. I had two DD TFs in the area, and many small convoys running through. On January 3rd my convoys reported Glens in 3 places, allowing me to triangulate on the most likely location of the sub.
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Tom Hunter
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RE: January 4 1942
I also sent 2 CV groups on ASW patrol to the same area. This paid off as well, as can be seen from the map below. The merchant TFs are 1-3 ship TFs I run lots of little convoys rather than large well protected ones.
What has been a happy hunting ground for Mogami is about to be a happy hunting ground for me.
Elsewhere:
Philipines consolidates into Manila.
Japanese land at Lautem
British were launching numerous small bombing raids at unguarded Japanese airfields. On the third Mogami put CAP over some of these, so no raids on the 4th. The CAP over Moulmein was Oscars so 12 Hurricanes, 32 Buffalos and 8 Demons are on a sweep today. Chances are bad weather will wreck everything.
On Java the Dutch were forces out of Madoen and into Djokarta. The Japanese are following in strength and this time it will fall for sure. Malang fell with 5,000 prisoners. Blehiems moved to Bali to hit Japanese shipping, and Japanese troops unloaded at Lautem.
Evacuation from Malaya continues. There are 5 brigades holding the line at Alor Star, the when they run Mogami may clue in. So I am organizing a huge evac TF to pull all of them out at once. Most of the base forces and some of the ground troops are already gone, and many troops have unloaded at Trimcomalee.
The Royal Navy is in process of moving from India to Australia in an orderly fashion. Various ships are still in India repairing or preparing to link up with the CVs as they arrive, but the R class BBs and Hermes have already left. They will be back, but not under circumstances that invite defeat in detail.
China is back to being a swamp. Much of the Chinese army is now North of Wuhan, there are 70,00 Chinese facing 20,000 Japanese at Hsinyang, 40,000 more troops just North West of Hsinyang, and other concentrations of Chinese and Japanese here and there. I may be able to take Hsinyang, or to move another 100,000 troops to Kaifeng, in which case we stalemate there but the Chinese get to continue increaseing in quality.
Though it's still theoretically possible that the troops at Kaifeng could be defeated, it looks less and less likely.
Hawaii now has an infantry division ashore at Lanahia and well as Hilo. Everyone is unloading supplies and digging in, most of the islands are garrisoned, fortifying and building up their airbases, and hundreds of mines are layed every day.
Troops are at sea heading for the South Pacific, but most stuff will not arrive until late January or early February. If Mogami has not taken Rabual, Port Moresby and Guadalcanal by then I will start moving men and equipment forward to bring pressure on the Japanese.
What has been a happy hunting ground for Mogami is about to be a happy hunting ground for me.
Elsewhere:
Philipines consolidates into Manila.
Japanese land at Lautem
British were launching numerous small bombing raids at unguarded Japanese airfields. On the third Mogami put CAP over some of these, so no raids on the 4th. The CAP over Moulmein was Oscars so 12 Hurricanes, 32 Buffalos and 8 Demons are on a sweep today. Chances are bad weather will wreck everything.
On Java the Dutch were forces out of Madoen and into Djokarta. The Japanese are following in strength and this time it will fall for sure. Malang fell with 5,000 prisoners. Blehiems moved to Bali to hit Japanese shipping, and Japanese troops unloaded at Lautem.
Evacuation from Malaya continues. There are 5 brigades holding the line at Alor Star, the when they run Mogami may clue in. So I am organizing a huge evac TF to pull all of them out at once. Most of the base forces and some of the ground troops are already gone, and many troops have unloaded at Trimcomalee.
The Royal Navy is in process of moving from India to Australia in an orderly fashion. Various ships are still in India repairing or preparing to link up with the CVs as they arrive, but the R class BBs and Hermes have already left. They will be back, but not under circumstances that invite defeat in detail.
China is back to being a swamp. Much of the Chinese army is now North of Wuhan, there are 70,00 Chinese facing 20,000 Japanese at Hsinyang, 40,000 more troops just North West of Hsinyang, and other concentrations of Chinese and Japanese here and there. I may be able to take Hsinyang, or to move another 100,000 troops to Kaifeng, in which case we stalemate there but the Chinese get to continue increaseing in quality.
Though it's still theoretically possible that the troops at Kaifeng could be defeated, it looks less and less likely.
Hawaii now has an infantry division ashore at Lanahia and well as Hilo. Everyone is unloading supplies and digging in, most of the islands are garrisoned, fortifying and building up their airbases, and hundreds of mines are layed every day.
Troops are at sea heading for the South Pacific, but most stuff will not arrive until late January or early February. If Mogami has not taken Rabual, Port Moresby and Guadalcanal by then I will start moving men and equipment forward to bring pressure on the Japanese.
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RE: January 4 1942
Hi Tom from another lunitic. I will not detail anything about what Maniac Mogami is doing, just my actions. I am at 1/7/42 and just started unloading 2nd Marine at Nouema. I loaded it on the first day and sent it at full speed to the South Pacific. Also the first of my North Pacific reinforcements will arrive in two days at Karachi. This is a lunatic game after all. I also landed the 40th Inf division at Hilo to provide a second strong air base( also sent the EAB from Pearl to Hilo). I am mostly awaiting Mogami to take the SRA and then Start an attack on Russia. I have 3 single CV TFs between PH and SF launching ASW air attacks and I am 'lighting up' a number of subs.
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Tom Hunter
- Posts: 2194
- Joined: Tue Dec 14, 2004 1:57 am
RE: January 4 1942
But of course these details give me plenty to read between the lines. And we are basically doing the same things.
I strongly suspect Mogami will do the same things until differences in our tactics start to impact his play. He is opening with a strong drive into the NEI and there is really not much anyone can do about the Japanese in the opening month of the game.
I strongly suspect Mogami will do the same things until differences in our tactics start to impact his play. He is opening with a strong drive into the NEI and there is really not much anyone can do about the Japanese in the opening month of the game.
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Tom Hunter
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RE: January 8 1942
Chengting falls, the Kweiyang pocket is relieved, Japanese troops that had been spotted heading for Veitnam are now on the RR heading back towards the Wuchow/Canton area.
Ground combat at Chengting
Allied Shock attack
Attacking force 51098 troops, 395 guns, 0 vehicles
Defending force 20655 troops, 220 guns, 0 vehicles
Allied assault odds: 5 to 1 (fort level 3)
Allied forces CAPTURE Chengting base !!!
Japanese aircraft
no flights
Japanese aircraft losses
Ki-15 Babs: 5 destroyed
Ki-51 Sonia: 10 destroyed
Japanese ground losses:
95 casualties reported
Guns lost 3
Allied ground losses:
1367 casualties reported
Guns lost 18
In addition the Chinese captured 13,000 supplies when they took the city.
Troops at Hsinyang are moving North to clear the Japanese off the rail line. I hope to win several small victories over dispersed Japanese forces. Hsinyang is actually out of supply, but that is not a good thing, I want the Japanese to retreat, not dig in and hold, so I am moving past it.
There is some chance that a Japanese shock attack at Kaifeng would cause the troops there to retreat, that would be bad but not a huge disaster. Homan airfield is about to hit L2 and some Wirraways and Lysanders are heading in to bomb the Japanese and gain some expereience. China is turning into it's usual swampy self, which makes me pretty happy.
The news from the NEI is not so good, Bali and Djokarta both fell on the 8th.
The final evacutation convoys are arriving at Georgetown today, soon the last mobile units will be evacuted.
In general things have been very quiet outside of China. The Japanese have been cleaning up Java and keeping thier transports away from Allied air cover. Instead my planes have been trying to bomb the Ise and various cruisers. In the last week or so I have seen 1 250lb bomb hit the Nachi, thats the sum total of damage done.
Now there are a large number of Hudsons in the Derby, Wyndham, Darwin area and the Japanese have a convoy heading for Koepang on the South side of Timor so I may get a few more ships. Still its nothing like the wholesale slaughter that accompanies some of my other games.
Ground combat at Chengting
Allied Shock attack
Attacking force 51098 troops, 395 guns, 0 vehicles
Defending force 20655 troops, 220 guns, 0 vehicles
Allied assault odds: 5 to 1 (fort level 3)
Allied forces CAPTURE Chengting base !!!
Japanese aircraft
no flights
Japanese aircraft losses
Ki-15 Babs: 5 destroyed
Ki-51 Sonia: 10 destroyed
Japanese ground losses:
95 casualties reported
Guns lost 3
Allied ground losses:
1367 casualties reported
Guns lost 18
In addition the Chinese captured 13,000 supplies when they took the city.
Troops at Hsinyang are moving North to clear the Japanese off the rail line. I hope to win several small victories over dispersed Japanese forces. Hsinyang is actually out of supply, but that is not a good thing, I want the Japanese to retreat, not dig in and hold, so I am moving past it.
There is some chance that a Japanese shock attack at Kaifeng would cause the troops there to retreat, that would be bad but not a huge disaster. Homan airfield is about to hit L2 and some Wirraways and Lysanders are heading in to bomb the Japanese and gain some expereience. China is turning into it's usual swampy self, which makes me pretty happy.
The news from the NEI is not so good, Bali and Djokarta both fell on the 8th.
The final evacutation convoys are arriving at Georgetown today, soon the last mobile units will be evacuted.
In general things have been very quiet outside of China. The Japanese have been cleaning up Java and keeping thier transports away from Allied air cover. Instead my planes have been trying to bomb the Ise and various cruisers. In the last week or so I have seen 1 250lb bomb hit the Nachi, thats the sum total of damage done.
Now there are a large number of Hudsons in the Derby, Wyndham, Darwin area and the Japanese have a convoy heading for Koepang on the South side of Timor so I may get a few more ships. Still its nothing like the wholesale slaughter that accompanies some of my other games.
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Oleg Mastruko
- Posts: 4534
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RE: January 8 1942
What did it take to capture Chengting?
O.
O.
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Tom Hunter
- Posts: 2194
- Joined: Tue Dec 14, 2004 1:57 am
RE: January 8 1942
Look up, I posted the map then edited.
Frnakly it was a gamble, but I took it, and it worked.
Also you should understand that Mogami moved a lot of troops around to concentrate 200,000 men at Kaifeng. I have also moved hundreds of thousands of troops so we both have lots of units that are fatigued, or have prep points for some place miles away. Niether of us has a really great supply situation either. Wuhan is cut off from rail but has road connections, Chengting is Chinese now, Kaifeng is totally isolated.
Its a mess, but a mess is good for the Chinese. I really want to get them fighting because its not unusual for Chinese troops to go from 30-40 xp to 50-60 or even higher sometimes. That makes a huge difference in how well they will fight. 60 xp troops behind L9 forts have some chance of holding Changsha, and an even better chance of keeping Chunking, Yenen or Wuchow.
I wish I had kept the email where Mogami told me I had lost China by moving into Kaifeng. It would be really nice to quote that right now.
Frnakly it was a gamble, but I took it, and it worked.
Also you should understand that Mogami moved a lot of troops around to concentrate 200,000 men at Kaifeng. I have also moved hundreds of thousands of troops so we both have lots of units that are fatigued, or have prep points for some place miles away. Niether of us has a really great supply situation either. Wuhan is cut off from rail but has road connections, Chengting is Chinese now, Kaifeng is totally isolated.
Its a mess, but a mess is good for the Chinese. I really want to get them fighting because its not unusual for Chinese troops to go from 30-40 xp to 50-60 or even higher sometimes. That makes a huge difference in how well they will fight. 60 xp troops behind L9 forts have some chance of holding Changsha, and an even better chance of keeping Chunking, Yenen or Wuchow.
I wish I had kept the email where Mogami told me I had lost China by moving into Kaifeng. It would be really nice to quote that right now.
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PimpYourAFV
- Posts: 581
- Joined: Thu Sep 29, 2005 11:49 pm
- Location: Japan
RE: To Dec 20
Mr. Hunter, I'm reading your AAR now but will take some time to finish this report. I like the strategy talk. I briefly tried reading AAR's for other games (not WitP) but gotten bored after like 10 seconds and given up but this is really good stuff. Same with Oleg's cool AAR.
I have put everything that flies on Naval attack, including the helium balloon my kid just brought home from a birthday party.
Nice [:D]
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Tom Hunter
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- Joined: Tue Dec 14, 2004 1:57 am
Jan 10 1942
Two more momentous days.
In China most of the troops left Kaifeng, I guess they had movement points accumulated from previous turns, so once the path opened up they pulled out immediately. 3 HQs and 4 corps stayed behind and were pushed out in a shock attack. They are disrupted but they are not out of supply. Mogami has 230,000 men at Kaifeng, 30,000 at Hsinyang and 70,000 just crossed the river South of Hsinyang. I have about the same number in 3 hexes North of Hsinyng. Everything has been ordered to Homan to consolidate for the next round of battle.
To the North I am pulling back from Chengting it is not tenable but I got a nice victory and plenty of supply out of it.
To the South most of the troops in Changsha are moving to Wuhan where I hope to make a successful bombarment attack. This is a combination of training for my guys and distraction for Mogami, plus it will stop supply from being made at Wuhan.
The British have pulled just about everything out of Malaya now and I think Mogami has figured out that I am evacuating, not resupplying. On the 8th the Japanese bombed my transports and damaged some, on the 9th I flew the AVG and some Dutch fighters to Georgetown, and I threw 25 LB30s and 30 Blenhiems and Hudsons at the Japanese airbase at Victoria Point.
The results were good, 5 or 7 Anns were destroyed on the ground at Victoria point, and a number of Zeros and Betties were shot down over Georgetown. It is the first time the Japanese have taken substantial casualties in the air for a week or two. Victoria Point is getting hit again today with a Sweep by the AVG (now at Ragoon) to clean out any fighters that Mogami may move in. Then things ought to get quiet, since there will not be much left in Malaya, just the fortress units and one base force that I am using to fly long range bombers on nusance raids.
British and Chinese troops continue to entrench in Burma, and the British are launching regular bombing raids to improve the quality of thier aircrew. This is working, but slowly, most British air units are moving from the high 50s to the low 60s right now.
The Dutch continue to fall apart. Dili is gone, the Japanese are at Koepang and closing in on Tjiliap, and the small island bases between Timor and Java are falling fast. Dutch aircraft are flying out to Sumatra, the plan is for the whole Dutch air force to join the SE Asia HQ and fight again in India. So far that is the only part of the Dutch plan that has gone at all well.
SW Pac and South Pac are all about moving supplies and fuel in. Land and air units are coming but they are all weeks away.
The Australians have moved fuel, supplies and planes to Port Moresby and Rabual but no re-inforcements. The Americans have done a little base force shuffleing in the South Pacific trying to build up the islands near Noumea. 4 base forces on 4 AKs that slipped out of the Phillipines are passing Palmyra now, they will be the first troops into South Pac, then a flow of Marines, engineers and aircraft will start arriving in late January and early February. The plan is to start by strengthening the Noumea area and then move North towards Guadalcanal if circumstances still look favorable.
Hawaii is strong and getting stronger, small units like AA and artillery continue to arrive from the West Coast, all the big units are ashore and supplies are pooring in as well. I am moving an RCT to Palmyra, that Island will be the last stopping point for any air reinforcements I send to Hawaii, so I want to hold it against any small raid Mogami might send. If he sends a division or more then he just gets the place and that is that.
Things are coming together pretty rapidly in the Central Pacific. Within a couple of weeks I should have:
3 Large air bases with 1 or 2 Division defending + CD, artillery and AA assets with forts 4 or higher and on their way to L9
270 fighters and bombers of various types in the Islands
Plentiful supply in all major bases
2 smaller bases with supplies and L2 or higher airfields as back up locations
Mines all over the islands in the base hexes and the dot hexes too
A route to fly in more planes from the South Pacific. Expect this to get in motion immediately if the Japanese do show up in Hawaii
It may seem like obsession, but I am conviced that Hawaii is important, and it is very possible Mogami will try to take it out. Adm. Laurent took it in a few weeks and the result will be America at arms length for a long time. I can't afford even the possiblity of that happening. Mogami needs a fee hand in China and India to get 4 to 1, so the Americans MUST be scoring points in 1942 to stave that off.
I am leaning towards putting a lot of 4 engine bombers up in Alaska and then when the Japanese hit Russia I will fly them into Russian airbases and launch a strategic bombing offensive against Northern Japan. I don't think that will save the Russians but it will score me some victory points and pull some Japanese fighters back to the home islands.
I will take a closer look at India soon, troops from Malaya have been unloading and the base constrution project is moving forward.
In China most of the troops left Kaifeng, I guess they had movement points accumulated from previous turns, so once the path opened up they pulled out immediately. 3 HQs and 4 corps stayed behind and were pushed out in a shock attack. They are disrupted but they are not out of supply. Mogami has 230,000 men at Kaifeng, 30,000 at Hsinyang and 70,000 just crossed the river South of Hsinyang. I have about the same number in 3 hexes North of Hsinyng. Everything has been ordered to Homan to consolidate for the next round of battle.
To the North I am pulling back from Chengting it is not tenable but I got a nice victory and plenty of supply out of it.
To the South most of the troops in Changsha are moving to Wuhan where I hope to make a successful bombarment attack. This is a combination of training for my guys and distraction for Mogami, plus it will stop supply from being made at Wuhan.
The British have pulled just about everything out of Malaya now and I think Mogami has figured out that I am evacuating, not resupplying. On the 8th the Japanese bombed my transports and damaged some, on the 9th I flew the AVG and some Dutch fighters to Georgetown, and I threw 25 LB30s and 30 Blenhiems and Hudsons at the Japanese airbase at Victoria Point.
The results were good, 5 or 7 Anns were destroyed on the ground at Victoria point, and a number of Zeros and Betties were shot down over Georgetown. It is the first time the Japanese have taken substantial casualties in the air for a week or two. Victoria Point is getting hit again today with a Sweep by the AVG (now at Ragoon) to clean out any fighters that Mogami may move in. Then things ought to get quiet, since there will not be much left in Malaya, just the fortress units and one base force that I am using to fly long range bombers on nusance raids.
British and Chinese troops continue to entrench in Burma, and the British are launching regular bombing raids to improve the quality of thier aircrew. This is working, but slowly, most British air units are moving from the high 50s to the low 60s right now.
The Dutch continue to fall apart. Dili is gone, the Japanese are at Koepang and closing in on Tjiliap, and the small island bases between Timor and Java are falling fast. Dutch aircraft are flying out to Sumatra, the plan is for the whole Dutch air force to join the SE Asia HQ and fight again in India. So far that is the only part of the Dutch plan that has gone at all well.
SW Pac and South Pac are all about moving supplies and fuel in. Land and air units are coming but they are all weeks away.
The Australians have moved fuel, supplies and planes to Port Moresby and Rabual but no re-inforcements. The Americans have done a little base force shuffleing in the South Pacific trying to build up the islands near Noumea. 4 base forces on 4 AKs that slipped out of the Phillipines are passing Palmyra now, they will be the first troops into South Pac, then a flow of Marines, engineers and aircraft will start arriving in late January and early February. The plan is to start by strengthening the Noumea area and then move North towards Guadalcanal if circumstances still look favorable.
Hawaii is strong and getting stronger, small units like AA and artillery continue to arrive from the West Coast, all the big units are ashore and supplies are pooring in as well. I am moving an RCT to Palmyra, that Island will be the last stopping point for any air reinforcements I send to Hawaii, so I want to hold it against any small raid Mogami might send. If he sends a division or more then he just gets the place and that is that.
Things are coming together pretty rapidly in the Central Pacific. Within a couple of weeks I should have:
3 Large air bases with 1 or 2 Division defending + CD, artillery and AA assets with forts 4 or higher and on their way to L9
270 fighters and bombers of various types in the Islands
Plentiful supply in all major bases
2 smaller bases with supplies and L2 or higher airfields as back up locations
Mines all over the islands in the base hexes and the dot hexes too
A route to fly in more planes from the South Pacific. Expect this to get in motion immediately if the Japanese do show up in Hawaii
It may seem like obsession, but I am conviced that Hawaii is important, and it is very possible Mogami will try to take it out. Adm. Laurent took it in a few weeks and the result will be America at arms length for a long time. I can't afford even the possiblity of that happening. Mogami needs a fee hand in China and India to get 4 to 1, so the Americans MUST be scoring points in 1942 to stave that off.
I am leaning towards putting a lot of 4 engine bombers up in Alaska and then when the Japanese hit Russia I will fly them into Russian airbases and launch a strategic bombing offensive against Northern Japan. I don't think that will save the Russians but it will score me some victory points and pull some Japanese fighters back to the home islands.
I will take a closer look at India soon, troops from Malaya have been unloading and the base constrution project is moving forward.
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PimpYourAFV
- Posts: 581
- Joined: Thu Sep 29, 2005 11:49 pm
- Location: Japan
RE: Jan 10 1942
Nice details. I just hope they are all true, not a deception for Mog. [:)] Hunter, it sounds like you got real tough defenses building up in India and Hawaii. I do hope he attacks both, especially Hawaii. I somehow feel a fight in India may never come about.
The info from Oleg's story and yours are slightly mixed up in my easily confused mind but hopefully I get this straight. Is it best to evacuate Malaya like that? The defensive jungle terrain coupled with the forts must be able to slow him down a lot, no? I know your logic is to stop him from the auto-victory by holding the key points but I still think a long defensive retreat may be better than running and fortifying. I reckon just move engineers to India to build forts with the fight still on in Malaya to allow time for fort building and cause heavy casualties to Mog instead of giving up Malaya easily so he can shift his forces to elsewhere like Russia or ANZAC area. The reason I think so is there is no threat against Burma and China is holding nicely so India is very safe now. And most likely Mog will want to complete a conquest of Russia and then China before hitting India. Hehe, but most probably I'm wrong cause I've never actually played it out yet.
Also you are retreating from Manila I think I remember to Midway right? Why not make a stand there too with the excellent urban defense bonus and good support? I know you want to hold Midway to help Hawaii's situation but you can lose units if Mog really puts the boots to you (I suppose ditto that for Manila). Sorry if this is rubbish cause I'm a newbie with no sense of the game really yet.
China sounds well done. I like the counterattacking. Here I go again with the Hitlerlike not one step back rhetoric [8|] but could it have been possible to keep holding Kaifeng instead of retreating? They were getting good xp and now you may be able to keep open a line for supply and possibe retreat while messing up Mog's timetable for moving against Russia. Instead now the evil Mog monster has Kaifeng. NO!!! [:@][:-]
RE: Jan 10 1942
TokyoBoyTensai, you might also want to read my poor attempt at an AAR since I am playing the third Lunatic game. [;)]
You will see a different stratigy there( not better or worse - yet - just different ) [:D]
You will see a different stratigy there( not better or worse - yet - just different ) [:D]
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PimpYourAFV
- Posts: 581
- Joined: Thu Sep 29, 2005 11:49 pm
- Location: Japan
RE: Jan 10 1942
Hi Nomad, thanks for that. I've just started reading yours now that I finally waded through the AAR's by Tom and Oleg. Just as good of course!! To tell you the truth, I was a little shy of approaching yours cause you said you include false information to delude the Mog monster. I like my miltary history non-fiction. [:D][;)] But I will for sure read all of yours in the next day or 2. I just hope the fake action is better done than WWF. [;)] I'll post some of my sub-useful strategy talk at the end of it despite the questionable value it will be to you.
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Tom Hunter
- Posts: 2194
- Joined: Tue Dec 14, 2004 1:57 am
Message from Mogami
He sent a long strategy discussion, prompted by my comment that Kaifeng did not turn out to be the decisive battle of the China campaign.
The comment is not about China, its was prompted by the fact that he finally figured out I was evacuating Malaya.
"I don't have enough time to post in forum so Oleg and Nomad can get this
from you. My previous best time to secure all SRA (area from Rangoon to
Darwin) was March 19th 1942 versus Brady. (He did the complete Sir Robin)"
For any new readers this AAR is not being read by Mogami. As quid-pro-quo I am not reading the other two AARs and discussion of events in those games is unwelcome on this AAR.
Events of January 11th.
Mogami hit back as hard as he could at the evacuation fleet. I had a very large number of AKs in single ship TFs, and I left 2 2ship TFs consisting of either PGs or MSWs. The game engine performed pretty much as expected, 111 aircraft sorties sunk 4 PG/MSW and one AK. Everything else is now 3 or more hexes away and will be 4 hexes more in another day, basically the whole Army in Malaya is out except for one base force I left behind to luanch harrasing air attacks. Amazingly I don't think Mogami figured this out until January 9th 1942.
In China most of the North China army is now disengaged and about to group at Homan. After that happens I will start to move again. Wuchow is strong, the troops from Changsha are heading to Wuhan again but I will likely turn them back around immediately.
Mogami send a CVL group to cut off any ships attempting to evacuate Java, they caught the one AK and one TK that tried. The TK went down fast but the AK is still floating but I doubt that will last.
In Burma I am always trying to find safe targets for bombers and fighter bombers so that I can train my airforce up. Unfortuneatly Mogami caught a group of Vildabeests and Hurricanes hitting Moulmein and shot down a bunch of Wildabeests. That ended that. I hit Victoria point two days in a row from Rangoon, but I am pulling the airforce back now. Rangoon did become and L5 base so I will likely base bombers forward again, but I don't want a lot of stuff the if Mogami tries to bomb it flat. Right now its a fencing contest, every day or 3 one of us figures out a way to nick the other for 5-10 planes.
Q&A
"Is it best to evacuate Malaya like that? " Well, if your going to evacuate Malaya it is best to evacuate it like that, ie no casualties. I am not sure it is best to evac Malaya initially, in Fear and Loathing I stayed and evacuated eventually. This is a no holds barred game and I think it will be decided in India. Losing the troops in Malaya gives the Japanese many VPs and weakens India. Pulling the whole army out saves the Allies a lot of VPs and greatly strengthen's India. So I did that. Game mechanics keep the attackers VP loss low, it is not possible to bleed an enemy to death standing on the defensive. You can hurt him and set him up for a counter attack, but the VPs come with the counter attack not the defense.
Burma can fall in days, and China can be stalemated by the Japanese very easily. Malaya can be taken down in a month or sometimes even less. India is not safe unless the British can keep Malaya, and the British cannot do that.
"Also you are retreating from Manila I think I remember to Midway right?" Not I, there are 92,000 troops in Manila. Some base forces are coming out on submarines, but that is incidental to the defense. I did pull the airforce out but the ground troops are staying to the end.
Retreating at Kaifeng was accidental, but so was getting surrounded there, and losing Chengting was an accident for Mogami. China is full of accidents. I don't care about ground at all, but I care a lot about the size and quality of my army. It's still the same size it used to be, but there are now 8-10 Chinese corps with 60-70 experience, those guys are about twice as effective as the other Chinese units, and fight nearly as well as the Japs.
The comment is not about China, its was prompted by the fact that he finally figured out I was evacuating Malaya.
"I don't have enough time to post in forum so Oleg and Nomad can get this
from you. My previous best time to secure all SRA (area from Rangoon to
Darwin) was March 19th 1942 versus Brady. (He did the complete Sir Robin)"
For any new readers this AAR is not being read by Mogami. As quid-pro-quo I am not reading the other two AARs and discussion of events in those games is unwelcome on this AAR.
Events of January 11th.
Mogami hit back as hard as he could at the evacuation fleet. I had a very large number of AKs in single ship TFs, and I left 2 2ship TFs consisting of either PGs or MSWs. The game engine performed pretty much as expected, 111 aircraft sorties sunk 4 PG/MSW and one AK. Everything else is now 3 or more hexes away and will be 4 hexes more in another day, basically the whole Army in Malaya is out except for one base force I left behind to luanch harrasing air attacks. Amazingly I don't think Mogami figured this out until January 9th 1942.
In China most of the North China army is now disengaged and about to group at Homan. After that happens I will start to move again. Wuchow is strong, the troops from Changsha are heading to Wuhan again but I will likely turn them back around immediately.
Mogami send a CVL group to cut off any ships attempting to evacuate Java, they caught the one AK and one TK that tried. The TK went down fast but the AK is still floating but I doubt that will last.
In Burma I am always trying to find safe targets for bombers and fighter bombers so that I can train my airforce up. Unfortuneatly Mogami caught a group of Vildabeests and Hurricanes hitting Moulmein and shot down a bunch of Wildabeests. That ended that. I hit Victoria point two days in a row from Rangoon, but I am pulling the airforce back now. Rangoon did become and L5 base so I will likely base bombers forward again, but I don't want a lot of stuff the if Mogami tries to bomb it flat. Right now its a fencing contest, every day or 3 one of us figures out a way to nick the other for 5-10 planes.
Q&A
"Is it best to evacuate Malaya like that? " Well, if your going to evacuate Malaya it is best to evacuate it like that, ie no casualties. I am not sure it is best to evac Malaya initially, in Fear and Loathing I stayed and evacuated eventually. This is a no holds barred game and I think it will be decided in India. Losing the troops in Malaya gives the Japanese many VPs and weakens India. Pulling the whole army out saves the Allies a lot of VPs and greatly strengthen's India. So I did that. Game mechanics keep the attackers VP loss low, it is not possible to bleed an enemy to death standing on the defensive. You can hurt him and set him up for a counter attack, but the VPs come with the counter attack not the defense.
Burma can fall in days, and China can be stalemated by the Japanese very easily. Malaya can be taken down in a month or sometimes even less. India is not safe unless the British can keep Malaya, and the British cannot do that.
"Also you are retreating from Manila I think I remember to Midway right?" Not I, there are 92,000 troops in Manila. Some base forces are coming out on submarines, but that is incidental to the defense. I did pull the airforce out but the ground troops are staying to the end.
Retreating at Kaifeng was accidental, but so was getting surrounded there, and losing Chengting was an accident for Mogami. China is full of accidents. I don't care about ground at all, but I care a lot about the size and quality of my army. It's still the same size it used to be, but there are now 8-10 Chinese corps with 60-70 experience, those guys are about twice as effective as the other Chinese units, and fight nearly as well as the Japs.
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Tom Hunter
- Posts: 2194
- Joined: Tue Dec 14, 2004 1:57 am
January 15 1942
4 day update, and not much happened, at least not much that was suprising.
In China the two sides have seperated, the Chinese in Homan the Japanese on the rail line. The Chinese are well supplied but heavily fatigued, Mogami is bombing them to try and keep them that way. The bombers are unescorted, look for an ambush on January 17th or 18.
The Phillipines get a map that pretty much says it all:
Japanese troops were revealed to be sneaking through the Jungles of Thailand and that road is now under air attack from Burma, more on that in the next report.
On the 15th Some Nells caught a transport and put a torpedo or two into it, likely sinking half the MAF avaition unit. Chances are good that is the last casualty of the Malaya evacuation. In Maylaya Georgetown fell, 4500 prisoners to the Japanese but nothing to be done about it the unit there is a CD and can't be evacuated.
Something good finally happened in Java where good news is scarce:
Allied aircraft
T.IVa x 4
Blenheim IV x 3
Martin 139 x 11
Allied aircraft losses
T.IVa: 1 damaged
Martin 139: 1 damaged
Japanese Ships
AP Tama Maru #2
PC Ch 8
AP Shoho Maru, Torpedo hits 1, on fire, heavy damage
AP Kashi Maru, Bomb hits 1
AP Kokuryu Maru
Japanese ground losses:
12 casualties reported
Guns lost 1
Next turn the Japanese will probabley have CAP, and I am sending 32 Wirraways to join the fun, maybe I will sink something. Japanese troops are now in the last City before Batavia, so Java has 4-6 days left.
South Pacific had no combat at all. Prince of Wales and some cruisers and DDs are now in Sydney, the only port that will put Torpedos back on the British Cruisers. They are going to rest there a bit to push the sys damage down some.
Zuikaku was spotted by search planes based on a US AV at Tarawa. Then the sky over the AV darkened as over 50 Japanese planes swooped in for the attack. Things did not go very well for the AV.
Strategically my big concerns are getting the SE Asian airforce trained up, and doing the same thing with Chinese ground troops. I'm not very happy with either situation but I am not getting beaten either, I just wish it was going faster.
Next time I will take a closer look at the situation in Burma, the future site of the next big land battle. India will get a close look after all the troops from Malaya have dispersed.
In China the two sides have seperated, the Chinese in Homan the Japanese on the rail line. The Chinese are well supplied but heavily fatigued, Mogami is bombing them to try and keep them that way. The bombers are unescorted, look for an ambush on January 17th or 18.
The Phillipines get a map that pretty much says it all:
Japanese troops were revealed to be sneaking through the Jungles of Thailand and that road is now under air attack from Burma, more on that in the next report.
On the 15th Some Nells caught a transport and put a torpedo or two into it, likely sinking half the MAF avaition unit. Chances are good that is the last casualty of the Malaya evacuation. In Maylaya Georgetown fell, 4500 prisoners to the Japanese but nothing to be done about it the unit there is a CD and can't be evacuated.
Something good finally happened in Java where good news is scarce:
Allied aircraft
T.IVa x 4
Blenheim IV x 3
Martin 139 x 11
Allied aircraft losses
T.IVa: 1 damaged
Martin 139: 1 damaged
Japanese Ships
AP Tama Maru #2
PC Ch 8
AP Shoho Maru, Torpedo hits 1, on fire, heavy damage
AP Kashi Maru, Bomb hits 1
AP Kokuryu Maru
Japanese ground losses:
12 casualties reported
Guns lost 1
Next turn the Japanese will probabley have CAP, and I am sending 32 Wirraways to join the fun, maybe I will sink something. Japanese troops are now in the last City before Batavia, so Java has 4-6 days left.
South Pacific had no combat at all. Prince of Wales and some cruisers and DDs are now in Sydney, the only port that will put Torpedos back on the British Cruisers. They are going to rest there a bit to push the sys damage down some.
Zuikaku was spotted by search planes based on a US AV at Tarawa. Then the sky over the AV darkened as over 50 Japanese planes swooped in for the attack. Things did not go very well for the AV.
Strategically my big concerns are getting the SE Asian airforce trained up, and doing the same thing with Chinese ground troops. I'm not very happy with either situation but I am not getting beaten either, I just wish it was going faster.
Next time I will take a closer look at the situation in Burma, the future site of the next big land battle. India will get a close look after all the troops from Malaya have dispersed.
- Attachments
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- SupplyforManila.jpg (58.43 KiB) Viewed 463 times
RE: Message from Mogami
"Also you are retreating from Manila I think I remember to Midway right?" Not I, there are 92,000 troops in Manila. Some base forces are coming out on submarines, but that is incidental to the defense. I did pull the airforce out but the ground troops are staying to the end.
Did you put all of your Luzon troops into Manila? Against Tophat I split my troops between Clark, Bataan and Manila, and in retrospect I would have been better off if I hadn't left any troops in Bataan at all except for that CD that can't move.
Thanks -
Dave Baranyi
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Tom Hunter
- Posts: 2194
- Joined: Tue Dec 14, 2004 1:57 am
RE: Message from Mogami
Everyone made it to Manila, Mogami tried to isolate some of my base forces on the Northern half of the island but I counter attacked and rescued them.
In the last three days the supply situation in Manila was:
13500
14200
12800
all numbers are approximate. My boat is one day closer than in the picture, if it gets there an unloads Manila should last into March. If it does not unload then the place will fall some time in the later part of February. A bit more is on the way, every day I drag this out is a day that 120,000 Japanese troops are in Luzon and not somewhere more important.
In the last three days the supply situation in Manila was:
13500
14200
12800
all numbers are approximate. My boat is one day closer than in the picture, if it gets there an unloads Manila should last into March. If it does not unload then the place will fall some time in the later part of February. A bit more is on the way, every day I drag this out is a day that 120,000 Japanese troops are in Luzon and not somewhere more important.