I agree, especially on supply, he has not bombed factories or resources and he did not cut the Ledo road.
China is a little bit up in the air because he has such a big army on Changsha and I let too many troops get too far away from the city. But that will be fixed pretty quickly, he has a short time to take the place and his two attacks have not done all that much.
I geuss the point of my post up above on his offensives is that they are coming too slow. He has given me tons of time to get my defenses together in every theater of war. China is the place where he has the best chance of dealing me a setback, but really how important is Changsha? If it falls that is bad for me, but it is not the end of China by a long shot.
India is so strong the thought of a Japanese invasion is laughable.
New Caledonia is over 2000 APs and still climbing, Noumea is almost a maximum base, The other bases are coming along rapidy and the whole place gets stronger by the day. Koumac now has more supply than Manila did at the start of the siege and Noumea has 240,000.
As mentioned above I am just starting to plot offensive moves, the Wellingtons going into Mandalay to bomb Hanoi will be the first real offensive move of the war. From little seeds grow mighty Oaks, the air war in SE Asia is going to get much more difficult for the Japanese over time.
I just loaded an RCT in Frisco heading for Noumea. But I loaded it on 5 2000 point APs, these ships will be used to launch the "invasion" of the islands between Noumea and Efate in about a month. 2-3 engineers and a big base force that will turn the island into a launch pad for my fighters.
Up near Port Moresby more base forces are moving in and the work continues on airfields at Cooktown, Port Moresby and Thursday island. When things are ready I will move in fighters and heavy and medium bombers to hit the bases on the other side of the Owen-Stanley Mountains.
The Brits kick things off in another 2 days, and things will be a little shakey at first but the clock is ticking for the Empire of Japan.
Lunacy In The Pacific Mogami Vs. Tom Hunter
Moderators: wdolson, Don Bowen, mogami
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Gen.Hoepner
- Posts: 3636
- Joined: Tue Sep 04, 2001 8:00 am
- Location: italy
RE: June 16 42
ORIGINAL: Ron Saueracker
Hey, you are going to drop a ball once in awhile when you juggle what, a dozen of them? How many games does Mog have going?[X(][8D]ORIGINAL: Gen.Hoepner
In China he's made a lot of mistakes imho.
Hey Ron! I didn't mean to be any offensive or overcritical with Mogami. God knows how much i've learnt reading his posts and his AARs. I just stated that, under my PERSONAL and MODEST point of view, he has made a mistake.
Nothing more, nothing less.
Probably i need some more 100 pbems and some more 5,000 posts to be allowed to say that. If so i'm terribly sorry.
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Ron Saueracker
- Posts: 10967
- Joined: Mon Jan 28, 2002 10:00 am
- Location: Ottawa, Canada OR Zakynthos Island, Greece
RE: June 16 42
How strong are The Fijis and New Zealand? Can he possibly bypass New Caledonia, capture North Island and Fiji, effectively cutting New Calednia and all those points off?
Yammas from The Apo-Tiki Lounge. Future site of WITP AE benders! And then the s--t hit the fan
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Tom Hunter
- Posts: 2194
- Joined: Tue Dec 14, 2004 1:57 am
June 18 42
China:
Changsha wins a critical battle:
Ground combat at Changsha
Japanese Deliberate attack
Attacking force 396280 troops, 4066 guns, 61 vehicles
Defending force 158506 troops, 640 guns, 0 vehicles
Japanese assault odds: 0 to 1 (fort level 7)
Japanese ground losses:
8959 casualties reported
Guns lost 270
Vehicles lost 6
Allied ground losses:
5247 casualties reported
Guns lost 139
Mogami is taking big chunks out of the Chinese army, but the Wuchow army is back on the rails coming North and the Hsinyang army is in the hex North of the river heading South. They ought to be able to save the town. In addition to the two big armies there are a few corps heading in from the direction of Chunking that will help somewhat.
Blehiems based in Mandalay attacked Hanoi and got squat, the Wellingtons stat on the ground even though Mandalay is now a level 5 base.
Ron in answer to your question about Fiji the island has about 700 AP behind 6 and 5 forts. Nandi is a major airfield (5 going on 6) with 270 AV, Suva has one BF. The position is not as strong as New Caledonia but it is not weak by any strech.
Mainly though the concept of cutting off New Caledonia is not really correct. The Island has so many troops, aircraft, support and supplies that having another island near it is bad, not good.
In the last two emails Mogami has talked about going on the defensive, I have asked for permission to post them here. He still has tons of combat power, but does not think auto victory is still possible for Japan in 1943.
As a result I am making a few tweaks, sending an engineer unit that was heading for Brisbane to Noumea and getting things ready for a move on Lifu (dot island 2 hexes from Noumea and 4 from Efate).
US bombers hit Efate and did well on the 17th:
Day Air attack on Efate , at 73,109
Japanese aircraft
Ki-43-Ib Oscar x 25
Allied aircraft
B-17E Fortress x 83
LB-30 Liberator x 35
Japanese aircraft losses
Ki-43-Ib Oscar: 8 destroyed, 10 damaged
Ki-46-II Dinah: 2 destroyed
B5N Kate: 7 destroyed
Allied aircraft losses
B-17E Fortress: 8 damaged
LB-30 Liberator: 1 destroyed, 10 damaged
Japanese ground losses:
201 casualties reported
Guns lost 3
Airbase hits 9
Airbase supply hits 7
Runway hits 48
They are under orders to hit it again and hopefully they will be joined by some B26s.
Mogami has a BB group sitting East of Luganville, waiting to spot the bombardment TFs staging at Lifu. I am pulling Prince of Wales group up from the South and will send Somervilles BB group to Noumea as well. Once everyone is there The US and two British gun fleets will stage to Lifu and then we will see what happens. Probabley nothing, but who knows.
I am still building up defensively but I badly want to stop Mogami from evacuating Efate and Luganville. There is a big AP-AK fleet at Efate now that I don't think I can stop from escaping but I am going to try.
Changsha wins a critical battle:
Ground combat at Changsha
Japanese Deliberate attack
Attacking force 396280 troops, 4066 guns, 61 vehicles
Defending force 158506 troops, 640 guns, 0 vehicles
Japanese assault odds: 0 to 1 (fort level 7)
Japanese ground losses:
8959 casualties reported
Guns lost 270
Vehicles lost 6
Allied ground losses:
5247 casualties reported
Guns lost 139
Mogami is taking big chunks out of the Chinese army, but the Wuchow army is back on the rails coming North and the Hsinyang army is in the hex North of the river heading South. They ought to be able to save the town. In addition to the two big armies there are a few corps heading in from the direction of Chunking that will help somewhat.
Blehiems based in Mandalay attacked Hanoi and got squat, the Wellingtons stat on the ground even though Mandalay is now a level 5 base.
Ron in answer to your question about Fiji the island has about 700 AP behind 6 and 5 forts. Nandi is a major airfield (5 going on 6) with 270 AV, Suva has one BF. The position is not as strong as New Caledonia but it is not weak by any strech.
Mainly though the concept of cutting off New Caledonia is not really correct. The Island has so many troops, aircraft, support and supplies that having another island near it is bad, not good.
In the last two emails Mogami has talked about going on the defensive, I have asked for permission to post them here. He still has tons of combat power, but does not think auto victory is still possible for Japan in 1943.
As a result I am making a few tweaks, sending an engineer unit that was heading for Brisbane to Noumea and getting things ready for a move on Lifu (dot island 2 hexes from Noumea and 4 from Efate).
US bombers hit Efate and did well on the 17th:
Day Air attack on Efate , at 73,109
Japanese aircraft
Ki-43-Ib Oscar x 25
Allied aircraft
B-17E Fortress x 83
LB-30 Liberator x 35
Japanese aircraft losses
Ki-43-Ib Oscar: 8 destroyed, 10 damaged
Ki-46-II Dinah: 2 destroyed
B5N Kate: 7 destroyed
Allied aircraft losses
B-17E Fortress: 8 damaged
LB-30 Liberator: 1 destroyed, 10 damaged
Japanese ground losses:
201 casualties reported
Guns lost 3
Airbase hits 9
Airbase supply hits 7
Runway hits 48
They are under orders to hit it again and hopefully they will be joined by some B26s.
Mogami has a BB group sitting East of Luganville, waiting to spot the bombardment TFs staging at Lifu. I am pulling Prince of Wales group up from the South and will send Somervilles BB group to Noumea as well. Once everyone is there The US and two British gun fleets will stage to Lifu and then we will see what happens. Probabley nothing, but who knows.
I am still building up defensively but I badly want to stop Mogami from evacuating Efate and Luganville. There is a big AP-AK fleet at Efate now that I don't think I can stop from escaping but I am going to try.
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Tom Hunter
- Posts: 2194
- Joined: Tue Dec 14, 2004 1:57 am
June 19 42
Mogami is under the impression that auto victory is now out of reach for Japan, he sent this email:
"Hi I think your safe from Auto victory unless you sail 5,000 VP into where I
can nail it.
If this was a normal game I would be ready to switch to defense after having
a go at Port Moresby.
I was not active enough after Java because Manila derailed everything.
Accepting that as normal Japan should just go ahead and capture the empty
base in South/Central Pacific before Allies can move forces there. KB
sitting around Pago Pago should block movement west. Fiji only has a Bde
and Japan can spare 5 div if they are not tied down in PI.
Port Moreby and Noumea can be had early if Japan just goes and gets them.
(In non looney games where I am Allies Japan always has the area before my
first convoy reaches Christmas Island)
So I quess I'll have to disappoint the readers of AAR and turn into Chicken
Jap.
The turns will be faster. I have to do some clean up to secure my defense
perimeter.
Doing the turn now. It's been fun so far sorry to be so weak.
I'm not really bold enough to execute my own designs.
I was going to use my last Moby Dick quote when troops began landfing onNew
Caledonia.
". . . from hell's heart I stab at thee; for hate's sake I spit my last
breath at thee."
But it might have been a little too much ."
As part of a series that include some discussion of his strategies. I am not going to post the others since they contain plans he would like to use in other games.
Two important things happened in the South Pacific on the 19th. KB showed SE of Gili Gili I think he may go for Port Moresby to strengthen his perimeter. PM is not ready but it is strong. 1 Divisions, 1 Brigade some battalions and base forces. AF 5 Fort 6 67,000 supplies 114 AV. Thursday Island has 60 AV and L2 Airfield and Cooktown has about 100 AV on an L4 airfield with more on the way.
5th airforce and a big US naval base force are heading for Australia now and are in the South Pacific so they will arrive in weeks.
In response to the KB sighting I put 100 P36s, P35s and Kittyhawks into PM along with some Beauforts. There are 95 P40Es and 24 P40Bs on the mainland as well. Not enough to stop an all out lunge by Japan but enough to hurt it and to stop pretty much anything else.
Allied aircraft contiued attack Efate on the 19th hitting the airfield:
Japanese aircraft
Ki-43-Ib Oscar x 23
Allied aircraft
B-26B Marauder x 44
Japanese aircraft losses
Ki-43-Ib Oscar: 3 damaged
H6K4 Mavis: 1 destroyed
Allied aircraft losses
B-26B Marauder: 2 destroyed, 8 damaged
Japanese ground losses:
68 casualties reported
Guns lost 2
Airbase hits 2
Airbase supply hits 1
Runway hits 4
and then wave after wave on planes hit a Japanese convoy off the coast of Efate:
WAVE 1
Allied aircraft
Hudson I x 6
B-26B Marauder x 48
No Allied losses
Japanese Ships
AP Igasa Maru, Bomb hits 3, on fire
AP Hakka Maru, Bomb hits 5, on fire, heavy damage
AP Hukuyo Maru, Bomb hits 4, on fire, heavy damage
AP Haaburu Maru, Bomb hits 1
AP Huso Maru, Bomb hits 3, on fire, heavy damage
AP Gyoko Maru, Bomb hits 2, on fire, heavy damage
Japanese aircraft
Ki-43-Ib Oscar x 15
WAVE 2
Allied aircraft
Hudson I x 6
B-26B Marauder x 33
Japanese aircraft losses
Ki-43-Ib Oscar: 1 destroyed, 1 damaged
Allied aircraft losses
Hudson I: 2 damaged
B-26B Marauder: 2 damaged
Japanese Ships
AP Hakka Maru, Bomb hits 5, on fire, heavy damage
AP Igasa Maru, Bomb hits 4, on fire, heavy damage
AP Huso Maru, Bomb hits 4, on fire, heavy damage
AP Gyoko Maru, Bomb hits 4, on fire, heavy damage
AP Hukuyo Maru, Bomb hits 3, on fire, heavy damage
AP Haaburu Maru
One of the really nice things about B26s is the 500 LB bomb they carry. Unlike the 250 pounder these hit pretty hard and the merchant ships don't just shrug them off. 2 of these ships sank the same day and others are certain to go down as well.
Approximately 100 ships left Manila within the last 2 days so there may be a big invasion fleet steaming somewhere. I doubt that Mogami will go for New Caledonia but it is always possible that he will change his mind.
Stratigically I am not certain that I should fight a naval battle for Port Moresby. The position there is not as strong as the one around New Caledonia and face it, if Mogami takes PM that is not going to win the game for him. Losing my CVs could lose it for me though, so I will probably fight him for it but not take really big risks.
At the same time a Japanese offensive there will take most of Mogami's strength which gives me a free hand to start moving against Efate and Luganville. If KB stays up near Gili Gili then I am going to send a surface fleet into action around the two Japanese bases, if it stays a little more the Lifu landing force will go in and start converting the place into an Allied fighter base.
Once Lifu is Allied I can start sending the Marine fighter groups over Efate to bomb and never again will I have to send average XP 60 pilots up against 90 XP Zeros from KB.
Over in Burma my single group of Blenhiems is bombing Hanoi but not hitting anything or getting any response. The 48 Wellingtons that are also in Mandalay; which is an L5 airfield with ample AV and an RAF HQ, refuse to fly. Maybe someday they will attack.
"Hi I think your safe from Auto victory unless you sail 5,000 VP into where I
can nail it.
If this was a normal game I would be ready to switch to defense after having
a go at Port Moresby.
I was not active enough after Java because Manila derailed everything.
Accepting that as normal Japan should just go ahead and capture the empty
base in South/Central Pacific before Allies can move forces there. KB
sitting around Pago Pago should block movement west. Fiji only has a Bde
and Japan can spare 5 div if they are not tied down in PI.
Port Moreby and Noumea can be had early if Japan just goes and gets them.
(In non looney games where I am Allies Japan always has the area before my
first convoy reaches Christmas Island)
So I quess I'll have to disappoint the readers of AAR and turn into Chicken
Jap.
The turns will be faster. I have to do some clean up to secure my defense
perimeter.
Doing the turn now. It's been fun so far sorry to be so weak.
I'm not really bold enough to execute my own designs.
I was going to use my last Moby Dick quote when troops began landfing onNew
Caledonia.
". . . from hell's heart I stab at thee; for hate's sake I spit my last
breath at thee."
But it might have been a little too much ."
As part of a series that include some discussion of his strategies. I am not going to post the others since they contain plans he would like to use in other games.
Two important things happened in the South Pacific on the 19th. KB showed SE of Gili Gili I think he may go for Port Moresby to strengthen his perimeter. PM is not ready but it is strong. 1 Divisions, 1 Brigade some battalions and base forces. AF 5 Fort 6 67,000 supplies 114 AV. Thursday Island has 60 AV and L2 Airfield and Cooktown has about 100 AV on an L4 airfield with more on the way.
5th airforce and a big US naval base force are heading for Australia now and are in the South Pacific so they will arrive in weeks.
In response to the KB sighting I put 100 P36s, P35s and Kittyhawks into PM along with some Beauforts. There are 95 P40Es and 24 P40Bs on the mainland as well. Not enough to stop an all out lunge by Japan but enough to hurt it and to stop pretty much anything else.
Allied aircraft contiued attack Efate on the 19th hitting the airfield:
Japanese aircraft
Ki-43-Ib Oscar x 23
Allied aircraft
B-26B Marauder x 44
Japanese aircraft losses
Ki-43-Ib Oscar: 3 damaged
H6K4 Mavis: 1 destroyed
Allied aircraft losses
B-26B Marauder: 2 destroyed, 8 damaged
Japanese ground losses:
68 casualties reported
Guns lost 2
Airbase hits 2
Airbase supply hits 1
Runway hits 4
and then wave after wave on planes hit a Japanese convoy off the coast of Efate:
WAVE 1
Allied aircraft
Hudson I x 6
B-26B Marauder x 48
No Allied losses
Japanese Ships
AP Igasa Maru, Bomb hits 3, on fire
AP Hakka Maru, Bomb hits 5, on fire, heavy damage
AP Hukuyo Maru, Bomb hits 4, on fire, heavy damage
AP Haaburu Maru, Bomb hits 1
AP Huso Maru, Bomb hits 3, on fire, heavy damage
AP Gyoko Maru, Bomb hits 2, on fire, heavy damage
Japanese aircraft
Ki-43-Ib Oscar x 15
WAVE 2
Allied aircraft
Hudson I x 6
B-26B Marauder x 33
Japanese aircraft losses
Ki-43-Ib Oscar: 1 destroyed, 1 damaged
Allied aircraft losses
Hudson I: 2 damaged
B-26B Marauder: 2 damaged
Japanese Ships
AP Hakka Maru, Bomb hits 5, on fire, heavy damage
AP Igasa Maru, Bomb hits 4, on fire, heavy damage
AP Huso Maru, Bomb hits 4, on fire, heavy damage
AP Gyoko Maru, Bomb hits 4, on fire, heavy damage
AP Hukuyo Maru, Bomb hits 3, on fire, heavy damage
AP Haaburu Maru
One of the really nice things about B26s is the 500 LB bomb they carry. Unlike the 250 pounder these hit pretty hard and the merchant ships don't just shrug them off. 2 of these ships sank the same day and others are certain to go down as well.
Approximately 100 ships left Manila within the last 2 days so there may be a big invasion fleet steaming somewhere. I doubt that Mogami will go for New Caledonia but it is always possible that he will change his mind.
Stratigically I am not certain that I should fight a naval battle for Port Moresby. The position there is not as strong as the one around New Caledonia and face it, if Mogami takes PM that is not going to win the game for him. Losing my CVs could lose it for me though, so I will probably fight him for it but not take really big risks.
At the same time a Japanese offensive there will take most of Mogami's strength which gives me a free hand to start moving against Efate and Luganville. If KB stays up near Gili Gili then I am going to send a surface fleet into action around the two Japanese bases, if it stays a little more the Lifu landing force will go in and start converting the place into an Allied fighter base.
Once Lifu is Allied I can start sending the Marine fighter groups over Efate to bomb and never again will I have to send average XP 60 pilots up against 90 XP Zeros from KB.
Over in Burma my single group of Blenhiems is bombing Hanoi but not hitting anything or getting any response. The 48 Wellingtons that are also in Mandalay; which is an L5 airfield with ample AV and an RAF HQ, refuse to fly. Maybe someday they will attack.
RE: June 19 42
taking 2 earliest objectives as Manila and Singapore is a key to all later operations - any delay change this game a lot.
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AmiralLaurent
- Posts: 3351
- Joined: Tue Mar 11, 2003 8:53 pm
- Location: Near Paris, France
RE: June 19 42
ORIGINAL: Tom Hunter
Over in Burma my single group of Blenhiems is bombing Hanoi but not hitting anything or getting any response. The 48 Wellingtons that are also in Mandalay; which is an L5 airfield with ample AV and an RAF HQ, refuse to fly. Maybe someday they will attack.
Try flying recon with your Blenheim rather than bombing, then Wellington may fly and hit something with their heavier bomb load.
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Tom Hunter
- Posts: 2194
- Joined: Tue Dec 14, 2004 1:57 am
RE: June 19 42
I have been flying recon with another Blen group based out of Myitiknya but I will try recon with this group too, maybe it will help. Or maybe I will get a lot of pictures of an undamaged Hanoi[8|]
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Ron Saueracker
- Posts: 10967
- Joined: Mon Jan 28, 2002 10:00 am
- Location: Ottawa, Canada OR Zakynthos Island, Greece
RE: June 16 42
Haaaa. I must come across like some serious anal exhaust valve or something. I was not upset by your view at all. I was merely stating that the guy has somany games going it's a wonder he is not batty. I can barely run two PBEMs without having to check if I'm confusing them.[:D] My mind is not what it used to be and was no Aegis cruiser to begin with.
ORIGINAL: Gen.Hoepner
ORIGINAL: Ron Saueracker
Hey, you are going to drop a ball once in awhile when you juggle what, a dozen of them? How many games does Mog have going?[X(][8D]ORIGINAL: Gen.Hoepner
In China he's made a lot of mistakes imho.
Hey Ron! I didn't mean to be any offensive or overcritical with Mogami. God knows how much i've learnt reading his posts and his AARs. I just stated that, under my PERSONAL and MODEST point of view, he has made a mistake.
Nothing more, nothing less.
Probably i need some more 100 pbems and some more 5,000 posts to be allowed to say that. If so i'm terribly sorry.
Yammas from The Apo-Tiki Lounge. Future site of WITP AE benders! And then the s--t hit the fan
-
Ron Saueracker
- Posts: 10967
- Joined: Mon Jan 28, 2002 10:00 am
- Location: Ottawa, Canada OR Zakynthos Island, Greece
RE: June 16 42
Congratulations Tom. Very superlative play. But I was so hoping to see a titanic clash...looked very likely. I was not surprised Mogami backed off however given the firepower and patience you were displaying to him.
Again, great job and I am really enjoying this AAR for it's sensability.
Again, great job and I am really enjoying this AAR for it's sensability.
Yammas from The Apo-Tiki Lounge. Future site of WITP AE benders! And then the s--t hit the fan
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Mike Solli
- Posts: 16598
- Joined: Wed Oct 18, 2000 8:00 am
- Location: the flight deck of the Zuikaku
RE: June 16 42
Mogami plans in excruciating detail and follows them through, so I wouldn't rest on my laurels.[;)]
By the way, Mogami is certifiable. I've met him.[:D]
By the way, Mogami is certifiable. I've met him.[:D]
Created by the amazing Dixie
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Tom Hunter
- Posts: 2194
- Joined: Tue Dec 14, 2004 1:57 am
RE: June 16 42
I don't know that I have an laurel's as yet.
It is argueable that I have won certain aspects of the logistics game. Perhaps I have gotten enough stuff into New Caledonia fast enough. If I have and it either wins me a future battle of New Caledonia or causes Mogami to stop before trying then I guess that would be worth a laurel.
But it is still too early too tell and if Mogami does have 200-300,000 men on APs he can always change his mind and come anyway.
Still his comments are interesting and I think you might enjoy them so I posted them.
I do think that Mogami suffers some from having too many games going on at once. This may be the reason he follows existing plans instead of altering them to fit the circumstances. Or another way of saying it; if you have too many games going at once you may not notice that you opponent is doing something that should cause you to chance a plan that seems to be going successfully.
One example that comes from this game is China and Malaya. I don't think Mogami figured out that I was evacuating Malaya until most of the job was done.
He sent a large army from China to speed the conquest of Malaya and Burma. if I had defended Malaya he would have achived concentration of force, won the battle and gained 2000 or so VP for destroying my army there.
Instead his army went on a long walk to a place it was not needed.
When my army in China got caught at Kaifeng Mogami sent me an email that more or less said that I had crippled China in the first few days by getting this army trapped in a place where it would be wiped out. This also made sending troops to Malaya look sensible as a way to capitalize on my screw up.
I did screw up in China but I rescued the situation while launching a much larger general offensive than Mogami anticipated. I took 5 Chinese cities, 3 of which I still have (the other two are not on the rail lines or useful for much, we trade them from time to time.) over 20,000 supply and did significant damage to the Japanese army.
Since then Mogami has chosen to send troops back to China to rescue the situation but so far he has not recaptured any city that China wants to hold. Instead of Japan getting a significant force advantage over the British in Feb 42 the Chinese got a significant advantage over Japan from January to April.
Of course a major victory in China is not enough to win the game for Japan, but it is a step in the right direction.
It is argueable that I have won certain aspects of the logistics game. Perhaps I have gotten enough stuff into New Caledonia fast enough. If I have and it either wins me a future battle of New Caledonia or causes Mogami to stop before trying then I guess that would be worth a laurel.
But it is still too early too tell and if Mogami does have 200-300,000 men on APs he can always change his mind and come anyway.
Still his comments are interesting and I think you might enjoy them so I posted them.
I do think that Mogami suffers some from having too many games going on at once. This may be the reason he follows existing plans instead of altering them to fit the circumstances. Or another way of saying it; if you have too many games going at once you may not notice that you opponent is doing something that should cause you to chance a plan that seems to be going successfully.
One example that comes from this game is China and Malaya. I don't think Mogami figured out that I was evacuating Malaya until most of the job was done.
He sent a large army from China to speed the conquest of Malaya and Burma. if I had defended Malaya he would have achived concentration of force, won the battle and gained 2000 or so VP for destroying my army there.
Instead his army went on a long walk to a place it was not needed.
When my army in China got caught at Kaifeng Mogami sent me an email that more or less said that I had crippled China in the first few days by getting this army trapped in a place where it would be wiped out. This also made sending troops to Malaya look sensible as a way to capitalize on my screw up.
I did screw up in China but I rescued the situation while launching a much larger general offensive than Mogami anticipated. I took 5 Chinese cities, 3 of which I still have (the other two are not on the rail lines or useful for much, we trade them from time to time.) over 20,000 supply and did significant damage to the Japanese army.
Since then Mogami has chosen to send troops back to China to rescue the situation but so far he has not recaptured any city that China wants to hold. Instead of Japan getting a significant force advantage over the British in Feb 42 the Chinese got a significant advantage over Japan from January to April.
Of course a major victory in China is not enough to win the game for Japan, but it is a step in the right direction.
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Ron Saueracker
- Posts: 10967
- Joined: Mon Jan 28, 2002 10:00 am
- Location: Ottawa, Canada OR Zakynthos Island, Greece
RE: June 16 42
It is argueable that I have won certain aspects of the logistics game.
Seeing as this game has settled down to normal (no longer lunacy in pursuit of 4-1) perhaps we can discuss the logistics element. It is mid June and just look at the forces you guys have been arraying against each other. And aside from the race to get stuff to New Caledonia or wherever, what logistics game are we talking about? Seems to me that neither of you suffer from the slightest shortages.
How about posting some supply figures, production numbers etc guys?
Yammas from The Apo-Tiki Lounge. Future site of WITP AE benders! And then the s--t hit the fan
-
Tom Hunter
- Posts: 2194
- Joined: Tue Dec 14, 2004 1:57 am
RE: June 16 42
Ron, posting supply and production here is going to be hard because Mogami can't post here.
The definition of winning logistics (in my mind at least) is having enough supply, facilities and units at the pointy end of the stick.
So the Noumea build up and Manila supply watch were both tracking the logistical situation, and I just posted some information about the Port Moresby-Cooktown-Thursday Island situation. I even posted a map of India once or twice and I used to show Hawaii back when it seemed possible Mogami would go for it.
I do keep my posts focused on the most interesting areas of the war, I don't really want to spend the time to update you guys on airfield construction at Kiska. [:'(]
The only other place where logistics is important is China. Things are as healthy as I have seen them there, maybe one of these days I will go indepth a bit.
The definition of winning logistics (in my mind at least) is having enough supply, facilities and units at the pointy end of the stick.
So the Noumea build up and Manila supply watch were both tracking the logistical situation, and I just posted some information about the Port Moresby-Cooktown-Thursday Island situation. I even posted a map of India once or twice and I used to show Hawaii back when it seemed possible Mogami would go for it.
I do keep my posts focused on the most interesting areas of the war, I don't really want to spend the time to update you guys on airfield construction at Kiska. [:'(]
The only other place where logistics is important is China. Things are as healthy as I have seen them there, maybe one of these days I will go indepth a bit.
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Gen.Hoepner
- Posts: 3636
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RE: June 16 42
ORIGINAL: Ron Saueracker
Haaaa. I must come across like some serious anal exhaust valve or something. I was not upset by your view at all. I was merely stating that the guy has somany games going it's a wonder he is not batty. I can barely run two PBEMs without having to check if I'm confusing them.[:D] My mind is not what it used to be and was no Aegis cruiser to begin with.ORIGINAL: Gen.Hoepner
ORIGINAL: Ron Saueracker
Hey, you are going to drop a ball once in awhile when you juggle what, a dozen of them? How many games does Mog have going?[X(][8D]
Hey Ron! I didn't mean to be any offensive or overcritical with Mogami. God knows how much i've learnt reading his posts and his AARs. I just stated that, under my PERSONAL and MODEST point of view, he has made a mistake.
Nothing more, nothing less.
Probably i need some more 100 pbems and some more 5,000 posts to be allowed to say that. If so i'm terribly sorry.
Ok Ron, probably i misunderstood you. Sorry for been somehow rude and unpolite.
Sincerly apologising.
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Ron Saueracker
- Posts: 10967
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- Location: Ottawa, Canada OR Zakynthos Island, Greece
RE: June 16 42
Hey, GenH, lighten up.[:)] No worries. Absolutely nothing to be uncomfortable about.
Tom, so, no chance to see a base list of the top supply concentrations from the Allied side? I'm curious to see how much was available for your projected hot spots. I'll post this in another seperate thread so we can compare. Thanks
Tom, so, no chance to see a base list of the top supply concentrations from the Allied side? I'm curious to see how much was available for your projected hot spots. I'll post this in another seperate thread so we can compare. Thanks
Yammas from The Apo-Tiki Lounge. Future site of WITP AE benders! And then the s--t hit the fan
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Tom Hunter
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June 21 42
China:
No serious fighting but plenty of manuevering, 13 Japanese units are now in the open South of Hengchow with Chinese units of the Wuchow army in chase, perhaps the Chinese will catch an inferior force in the open and inflict some damage.
The Japanese continue to dominate the air over China with 200-300 planes bombing at will.
CBI The Wellingtons at Mandalay refuse to fly against Hanoi. Allied troops and supply continue to flood into Akyab or fly into Mandalay and the first Spitfire group converts and starts making the planes ready.
In the South Pacific KB continues to threaten Port Moresby, effectively blockading the base.
Allied air attacks from PM are poorly coordinated, on the 19th 33 Beafort fly to New Ireland to attack a PG that they don't even find while 30 Allied fighters escort 4 Hudsons on a bombing raid against the Soyru. On the 20th the raids are similar, Allied air casualties are high because of a 100 Zero sweep over PM and 98 Zero CAP over KB and on the 21st all the Allied fighters are pulled out of Port Moresby though some bombers are left behind to harras the Japanese.
Net the Allies lose 130 aircraft, the Japanese lose 20 or fewer Zeros and one Japanese tanker takes a bomb. Clearly the PM defenses are not really ready for the job.
In the South Pacific the Allies are active and agressive.
Bombers hit Efate several days in a row grind up the airfield there. Today 3 Surface TFs left harbor in Noumea for Lifu, tomorrow they will steam to Luganville and bombard. If all goes well Allied bombers will follow up with air attacks.
Troops and supplies continue to poor ashore in Noumea but now instead of organizing for defense Nimitz is organizing the Lifu expidition, the first move forward against Japan in the South Pacific.
West Coast of the USA the North Carolina and Repulse leave San Francisco bound for Pearl Harbor. At the same time troops ships load the 37th US Army divisions, Seabees and other ground troops, all heading for the front.
No serious fighting but plenty of manuevering, 13 Japanese units are now in the open South of Hengchow with Chinese units of the Wuchow army in chase, perhaps the Chinese will catch an inferior force in the open and inflict some damage.
The Japanese continue to dominate the air over China with 200-300 planes bombing at will.
CBI The Wellingtons at Mandalay refuse to fly against Hanoi. Allied troops and supply continue to flood into Akyab or fly into Mandalay and the first Spitfire group converts and starts making the planes ready.
In the South Pacific KB continues to threaten Port Moresby, effectively blockading the base.
Allied air attacks from PM are poorly coordinated, on the 19th 33 Beafort fly to New Ireland to attack a PG that they don't even find while 30 Allied fighters escort 4 Hudsons on a bombing raid against the Soyru. On the 20th the raids are similar, Allied air casualties are high because of a 100 Zero sweep over PM and 98 Zero CAP over KB and on the 21st all the Allied fighters are pulled out of Port Moresby though some bombers are left behind to harras the Japanese.
Net the Allies lose 130 aircraft, the Japanese lose 20 or fewer Zeros and one Japanese tanker takes a bomb. Clearly the PM defenses are not really ready for the job.
In the South Pacific the Allies are active and agressive.
Bombers hit Efate several days in a row grind up the airfield there. Today 3 Surface TFs left harbor in Noumea for Lifu, tomorrow they will steam to Luganville and bombard. If all goes well Allied bombers will follow up with air attacks.
Troops and supplies continue to poor ashore in Noumea but now instead of organizing for defense Nimitz is organizing the Lifu expidition, the first move forward against Japan in the South Pacific.
West Coast of the USA the North Carolina and Repulse leave San Francisco bound for Pearl Harbor. At the same time troops ships load the 37th US Army divisions, Seabees and other ground troops, all heading for the front.
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Ron Saueracker
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RE: June 21 42
I must admit these lunacy games look like fun. I need to lighten up a bit and give one a whirl, CHS style of course.
Hey! June 21, 1942. In exactly 23 years I will grace the earth with my presence.![;)]
Hey! June 21, 1942. In exactly 23 years I will grace the earth with my presence.![;)]
Yammas from The Apo-Tiki Lounge. Future site of WITP AE benders! And then the s--t hit the fan
RE: June 21 42
ORIGINAL: Ron Saueracker
I must admit these lunacy games look like fun. I need to lighten up a bit and give one a whirl, CHS style of course.
Hey! June 21, 1942. In exactly 23 years I will grace the earth with my presence.![;)]
Young whippersnapper!!
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Tom Hunter
- Posts: 2194
- Joined: Tue Dec 14, 2004 1:57 am
RE: June 21 42
It is fun, but I am a bit dissapointed that Mogami did not go for Russia or make some other move that might have got him the auto victory.
In the short term I suspect we will have a battle for Port Moresby and perhaps Burma. Mogami needs to get his defensive perimeter in order and these two places are important for Japan but held by me.
I doubt I can hold PM but I am going to send more bombers to try and mess things up. The place is pretty well defended all in all and has plenty of supply but the Japanese can bring overwhelming force to bear. Unlike New Caledonia where each of the three bases can get very strong support from the other two Port Moresby is much more alone.
Thursday Island is an L2 field and climbing, Cooktown is L4 and also growning but niether of them has 250+ AV. At sea it is too dangerous for me to throw in the fleet, the Japanese have numerous bases for LBA.
I will fight hard for PM, but I suspect that in the end Mogami can bring overwhelming force to bear and take it. However if he fails to send a really powerful force it may hold.
I do plan to use any Japanese move on PM as an opportunity to hit back in the direction of Luganville or Efate. This is a general policy, Mogami can only be really strong in one place so any place he is not strong is going to see an attack.
In Burma is a better case for the Allies. Dacca, Akyab, Imphal and Ledo are all large and expanding airbases. Myitikina and Chadpur are also growing. The India airforce is mostly in the 60s for XP and the first Spitfires have shown up. Troops are flying into Mandalay via skytrain and a regular convoy is sending troops to Akyab as well. Mandalay is a 9 fort too.
Burma may turn out to be very interesting because the British are building up to take Rangoon as well. So it is possible that we will have a meeting engagement. The only downside for the Allies is a complete lack of naval support. The entire fleet is in the South Pacific or making its way there. I am hoping that the large force of LBA will be enough to keep the Japanese at bay.
One key element to fighting the IJN is long range fighters. I have kept the AVG fairly strong it has over 50 P40Bs, there are 30 Demons with XP in the 60s and substantial numbers of Buffalos and Brewsters. The Buffalos and Brewster are really one time use planes, but if they can keep the IJN CAP busy there are hundreds of Allied bombers ready to fly, most with XP in the 70s.
This is the opening of a series of limited objective offensives that will continue for at least a year. Once I have enough CVs I will start cutting a swath across the Pacific but until end of 43 it is short hops and LBA all the way. Hopefully that will work well enough to fatally weaken the Japanese by the time the CV fleet is ready to go, and then they will collapse. We shall see.
In the short term I suspect we will have a battle for Port Moresby and perhaps Burma. Mogami needs to get his defensive perimeter in order and these two places are important for Japan but held by me.
I doubt I can hold PM but I am going to send more bombers to try and mess things up. The place is pretty well defended all in all and has plenty of supply but the Japanese can bring overwhelming force to bear. Unlike New Caledonia where each of the three bases can get very strong support from the other two Port Moresby is much more alone.
Thursday Island is an L2 field and climbing, Cooktown is L4 and also growning but niether of them has 250+ AV. At sea it is too dangerous for me to throw in the fleet, the Japanese have numerous bases for LBA.
I will fight hard for PM, but I suspect that in the end Mogami can bring overwhelming force to bear and take it. However if he fails to send a really powerful force it may hold.
I do plan to use any Japanese move on PM as an opportunity to hit back in the direction of Luganville or Efate. This is a general policy, Mogami can only be really strong in one place so any place he is not strong is going to see an attack.
In Burma is a better case for the Allies. Dacca, Akyab, Imphal and Ledo are all large and expanding airbases. Myitikina and Chadpur are also growing. The India airforce is mostly in the 60s for XP and the first Spitfires have shown up. Troops are flying into Mandalay via skytrain and a regular convoy is sending troops to Akyab as well. Mandalay is a 9 fort too.
Burma may turn out to be very interesting because the British are building up to take Rangoon as well. So it is possible that we will have a meeting engagement. The only downside for the Allies is a complete lack of naval support. The entire fleet is in the South Pacific or making its way there. I am hoping that the large force of LBA will be enough to keep the Japanese at bay.
One key element to fighting the IJN is long range fighters. I have kept the AVG fairly strong it has over 50 P40Bs, there are 30 Demons with XP in the 60s and substantial numbers of Buffalos and Brewsters. The Buffalos and Brewster are really one time use planes, but if they can keep the IJN CAP busy there are hundreds of Allied bombers ready to fly, most with XP in the 70s.
This is the opening of a series of limited objective offensives that will continue for at least a year. Once I have enough CVs I will start cutting a swath across the Pacific but until end of 43 it is short hops and LBA all the way. Hopefully that will work well enough to fatally weaken the Japanese by the time the CV fleet is ready to go, and then they will collapse. We shall see.