One reason Japanese (and Soviet) AAA are ineffective

[el cid again]

Undertaking a comprehensive review of device file records, I discovered the amazing data in various national denominations of the French 75, a classic WWI era AAA weapon widely used in WWII - and the principle Japanese heavy AA gun in terms of numbers. The signature fields indicating this weapon are caliber and ceiling - which as always in WITP is set to maximum ceiling when the gun is pointed at 90 degrees (and has zero range).

Astonishingly, the listed ranges for these identical weapons are radically different. In US service you get a range of 11,000 yards! [Now that is fictional. While a shell fired at an elevation of 42 degrees - that is not a misprint - 42 degrees yields max range for this weapon - WILL reach 11,000 yards, it is only after going to full altitude and returning to Earth. It only reaches that range at zero altitude, and even in ideal circumstances the gunners could not actually see a target at that altitude at that range!] But in Japanese service the range is only 3,000 yards! And in Soviet service only 2,000 yards! The real effective range in all cases might approach 7,000 yards - that is - equal to the real ceiling. For reasons unclear, the US version is also credited with a ceiling of 25,000 feet = 8,000 meters - fully 1,000 meters above the real absolute ceiling. When Japanese bombers made the famous run on Clark AAF they came in at 25,000 feet - and saw below them AAA bursts at 22,000 feet - the maximum reach of this AAA gun. If you tried the same altitude in WITP the AAA would be effective!!! But ONLY if it was American gunners.

Now lest someone say this was an attempt to compensate for bad gunnery on the part of the Japanese, allow me to point out that Japan LED THE WORLD in AAA technique before WWII. NO NATION AT ANY TIME DURING THE WAR devised a comparable AAA simulator for training. NO NATION through at least the 1960s (when I witnessed US AAA training) devised a training regime that was used in all lighting conditions. Japan created a rather amazing AAA simulator system, with full size AAA directors, and actual AAA computers, hooked to scoring machines rather than guns. These were placed inside what amounts to a planetarium, where optical devices could simulate any lighting conditions. Inside that room scale model planes "flew" along wires invisible to the gunners. The gunners would try to engage the aircraft using the actual instruments on the actual directors. Nor was this system ineffective: consistently, throughout the war, AAA brought down more enemy aircraft than the more famous fighter planes did combined. Even B-29s lost more of their number to AAA than they did to fighter planes or any other enemy countermeasure. Only nationalistic hubris combined with technical ignorance allows anyone familiar with either the technology or the combat record to claim Japanese AAA was so ineffective it should be rated as a threat only within one nautical mile of the target.

[Wallymanowar]

ORIGINAL: el cid again

Undertaking a comprehensive review of device file records, I discovered the amazing data in various national denominations of the French 75, a classic WWI era AAA weapon widely used in WWII - and the principle Japanese heavy AA gun in terms of numbers. The signature fields indicating this weapon are caliber and ceiling - which as always in WITP is set to maximum ceiling when the gun is pointed at 90 degrees (and has zero range).

Astonishingly, the listed ranges for these identical weapons are radically different. In US service you get a range of 11,000 yards! [Now that is fictional. While a shell fired at an elevation of 42 degrees - that is not a misprint - 42 degrees yields max range for this weapon - WILL reach 11,000 yards, it is only after going to full altitude and returning to Earth. It only reaches that range at zero altitude, and even in ideal circumstances the gunners could not actually see a target at that altitude at that range!] But in Japanese service the range is only 3,000 yards! And in Soviet service only 2,000 yards! The real effective range in all cases might approach 7,000 yards - that is - equal to the real ceiling. For reasons unclear, the US version is also credited with a ceiling of 25,000 feet = 8,000 meters - fully 1,000 meters above the real absolute ceiling. When Japanese bombers made the famous run on Clark AAF they came in at 25,000 feet - and saw below them AAA bursts at 22,000 feet - the maximum reach of this AAA gun. If you tried the same altitude in WITP the AAA would be effective!!! But ONLY if it was American gunners.

Now lest someone say this was an attempt to compensate for bad gunnery on the part of the Japanese, allow me to point out that Japan LED THE WORLD in AAA technique before WWII. NO NATION AT ANY TIME DURING THE WAR devised a comparable AAA simulator for training. NO NATION through at least the 1960s (when I witnessed US AAA training) devised a training regime that was used in all lighting conditions. Japan created a rather amazing AAA simulator system, with full size AAA directors, and actual AAA computers, hooked to scoring machines rather than guns. These were placed inside what amounts to a planetarium, where optical devices could simulate any lighting conditions. Inside that room scale model planes "flew" along wires invisible to the gunners. The gunners would try to engage the aircraft using the actual instruments on the actual directors. Nor was this system ineffective: consistently, throughout the war, AAA brought down more enemy aircraft than the more famous fighter planes did combined. Even B-29s lost more of their number to AAA than they did to fighter planes or any other enemy countermeasure. Only nationalistic hubris combined with technical ignorance allows anyone familiar with either the technology or the combat record to claim Japanese AAA was so ineffective it should be rated as a threat only within one nautical mile of the target.

I am not saying that the numbers don't need to be corrected, but range and ceiling in game terms apply to two different things. Range applies to ground and naval targets, ceiling applies to air targets. In this case if you look at the database the three 75's have ceilings of 25,000 ft (American), 30,000 ft (Japanese), and 28,000 ft (Soviet) - so in contrast to your supposition, the Japanese and Soviet 75's are actually superior anti-aircraft weapons than the American 75.

Another thing to consider before you start changing the AA values is that the Allied (American and Commonwealth, not Soviet) had a huge advantage when it comes to AA later in the war with the introduction of the proximity fused rounds.