The Japanese Economy

[Mike Solli]

ORIGINAL: JWE

ORIGINAL: Mike Solli
No more droves of AKs sitting in port. [:(]

Damn right!!
Just to make you tear out even more of your hair, you have to be very careful when you talk about “AK/APs”. There’s 3 different kinds.

An xAK (or xAP) is a typical commercial carrier; it has 2-5 ton cranes, a crew of 30-40, and is in general “commercial” service; cargo ‘trash’ haulers, or passenger ‘slave’ ships. They can carry stuff, but load/unload PAINFULLY slowly unless in a port with “facilities”. Some of these had a ‘deep tank’ or a forepeak tank that carried a liquid cargo (av-gas, kerosene, etc ..)

An AK (AP) is a navalized ship, with 10-15 ton cranes, a crew of maybe 300, integral lighters (LCs), and is designed/converted/constructed to haul military cargoes into harms way. Because of their integral deck facilities, crew, and lighterage, they are “relatively” independent of port size restrictions.

An AKA (APA) is a fully navalized assault transport: 15-40 ton cranes, crew of 340-400, Welling davits, LCI, LCVP, LCM up the wazoo. These are the sharp end of the flaming telephone pole looking to be inserted into the bad people’s … well.

You will need to be very, very, very, very, judicious in your selection of just which types are going to perform what sorts of functions.

Thanks! That explains a lot. I've noted the absense of the last two categories for the Japanese at the war's start. That also explains why there is the ability to convert certain xAK classes into AKs.

[Mike Solli]

Oh yeah, what's your definiton of "facilities"?

[Andy Mac]

Good sized ports

[Mynok]

Very interesting.....I wonder what they are using for their invasions without AK/AP types..... [&:]

[Mike Solli]

There are 0 APs or AKs at the start of the campaign.  You can convert a total of 7 xAKs to AKs (Yusen A Cargo Class) at the start.  Other classes can convert, but not for a few months (at least).  Also note that if you convert from xAK to AK, you lose capacity. [:(]  For the Yusen A, your troop-cargo-fuel capacity goes from 480-6010-0 to 385-4808-0. [8|] Again, I haven't looked at reinforcements, so I have no idea what's going on there.

[Mynok]

Ya know....the learning curve of this game is going to be greatest in this area of transport, if only because the OOB is so overhauled.

[JWE]

ORIGINAL: Mike Solli
I recall reading that the Japanese diverted a fair percentage of their merchant shipping to enable them to perform many of the early war invasions.  That will definitely happen here.  We're going to have to look at each xAK class to see what conversions are able to be made (0-5 different conversions depending on class) and figure out what can be spared from cargo hauling to perform other functions.  Very interesting.

And to accommodate that, we retained the “type push” for Japan for the first few months of the war. So, Jap xAKs and xAPs function (with respect to assaulting load/unload rates) in a manner very similar to AK and AP data values.

Also, because of the Japanese utilization and habitability philosophy, Japanese commercial xAKs are easily converted to carry troops (the –t thing) and are easily converted back again for efficient merchant service (I think it only takes a week, for either way).

So Japan gets a poopload of “quasi” AK/APs for a few months. But, as you may have noticed, if they try to use them all for ops, the economy will screech to a halt. So use them well, use them wisely, and convert them back to trash haulers as fast as you can.

[Mike Solli]

Thanks John!

[Mynok]

ORIGINAL: JWE

And to accommodate that, we retained the “type push” for Japan for the first few months of the war. So, Jap xAKs and xAPs function (with respect to assaulting load/unload rates) in a manner very similar to AK and AP data values.

Hmm..what does this represent historically? Did they really load up these guys with troops and LC?

[JWE]

ORIGINAL: Mike Solli
There are 0 APs or AKs at the start of the campaign.  You can convert a total of 7 xAKs to AKs (Yusen A Cargo Class) at the start.  Other classes can convert, but not for a few months (at least).  Also note that if you convert from xAK to AK, you lose capacity. [:(]  For the Yusen A, your troop-cargo-fuel capacity goes from 480-6010-0 to 385-4808-0. [8|] Again, I haven't looked at reinforcements, so I have no idea what's going on there.

Yes, that’s right. There are certain “classes” of Japanese merchant ships (xAKs) that are able to “convert” or upgrade to navalized AK/AP standards. Those classes that can are those classes that actually did. The timing is set so that Japan does not lose all capability when the “magic push” times out.

But, the ships that are “convertible” or upgradeable, are your most valuable resource haulers. Once again, you have a choice. When you navalize a ship, you lose a bit. It’s no longer a trash hauler with a supercargo placing every bale in the most efficient spot.

[Woos]

Guys you are aware that an utility is included with WitpAE (in the tools/WitpStaff directory) which does a lot of the calculation for you on e.g. the "Storage" "Industry" and "Map Overview (Naval Transport)" tabs?

[Mike Solli]

Yup.  I haven't gotten that far yet.  Just looking things over trying to get a feel for the magnitude of the Japanese dilemma. [:D]

[JWE]

ORIGINAL: Mynok
Hmm..what does this represent historically? Did they really load up these guys with troops and LC?

You have to think on Japanese philosophy and actual utilization. Yes, they loaded these guys up with troops; to the gunnels. No, they did not load them up with LCs. Only certain ships were provided with LCs and the crews to man them. They formed a pool.

You must understand that when you assault, the "Dog Meat Division" only puts about 20-40% of its power ashore in the assault waves. The rest is sitting on board, 'waiting'. It took days to unload the Malaya TFs. Heck, when Turner had to leave the 'Canal, he took 27% of his his load with him, after 2 and a half days of off-loading; and Turner had "real" AKs and "real" APs.

[JWE]

ORIGINAL: Mike Solli
Yup.  I haven't gotten that far yet.  Just looking things over trying to get a feel for the magnitude of the Japanese dilemma. [:D]

Not so much magnitude, as scope, Mike. Shoot me a pm, I'll give ya some hints.

[Historiker]

I want some, too!

[Mike Solli]

That's what this thread is for.  Start digging and blabbing here.  We'll figure it out. [:D]

[Historiker]

Just tell me how I can get my Shinano and Kii Yamatos before 1943!

[Mike Solli]

[:D]

[Historiker]

One can NEVER have enough Yamatos!

[ny59giants]

Not so much magnitude, as scope, Mike. Shoot me a pm, I'll give ya some hints.

That's what I was hoping would become public knowledge on this thread to decrease the slope of the learning curve. I would rather do my cliff climbing with as many safety lines as possible. [:D]