PT Boats are... not that awesome.

This new stand alone release based on the legendary War in the Pacific from 2 by 3 Games adds significant improvements and changes to enhance game play, improve realism, and increase historical accuracy. With dozens of new features, new art, and engine improvements, War in the Pacific: Admiral's Edition brings you the most realistic and immersive WWII Pacific Theater wargame ever!

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Dili
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RE: PT Boats are... not that awesome.

Post by Dili »

The problem with a 0.5 and a DD is that you need to be too close and will not make much damage. Penetrating doesn't mean big damage since 0.5 bullets doesn't explode.
I can't remember the book because I sold it but I read in the Solomons some skippers would use ash cans and roll them off the back just incase a DD got on their heels. I know it doesn't pertain to this game but just thought I'd share a note on just how resourceful these guys were.

All italian PT's had depth charges to do that since WW1.
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Fallschirmjager
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RE: PT Boats are... not that awesome.

Post by Fallschirmjager »

ORIGINAL: Dili

The problem with a 0.5 and a DD is that you need to be too close and will not make much damage. Penetrating doesn't mean big damage since 0.5 bullets doesn't explode.
I can't remember the book because I sold it but I read in the Solomons some skippers would use ash cans and roll them off the back just incase a DD got on their heels. I know it doesn't pertain to this game but just thought I'd share a note on just how resourceful these guys were.

All italian PT's had depth charges to do that since WW1.

But fires and crew casulties would be horrific. And I think you guys are overstating a ships ability to hit a 77 foot target moving at 35+ knots with a 4.7" or 5" shell.
I am not saying PTs should be used against DD's. But if the game happens to put them up against one another at close range the DD should take some significant damage from a PT with high crew EXP. Dual .50 mounts would tear the superstructure of a DD to shreds.
Against a slow moving transport the PT could make slashing attacks or simply circle it's prey and probably mow everyone topside down in a hail of .50 cal bullets.
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Panther Bait
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RE: PT Boats are... not that awesome.

Post by Panther Bait »

I am thinking that concentrating fire on a DD from a .50 cal from 500-700 yards (about 1/3 of a mile) when shooting from a PT boat moving at 35+ knots in a even light chop is probably not that easy.  Add in the other guys shooting back at you, and it probably gets worse.  Make it nighttime, and it probably gets impossible.
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Dobey455
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RE: PT Boats are... not that awesome.

Post by Dobey455 »

Yeah but Destroyers have HMG's too. (or a light AA equivalent in the 0.5 cal - 20mm range) and probably far more of them than a PT boat.
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RE: PT Boats are... not that awesome.

Post by Jones944 »

ORIGINAL: medicff
ORIGINAL: FOW

ORIGINAL: briny_norman

They were from Kodiak.
I couldn't see any other way to get them to the South Pacific where they were sorely needed.
Just wanted to get them to Pearl and then let them island-jump from there.
But then these two idiot BBs show up and ruin everything.

This is the last time I put all my eggs in one TF, though. [:)]



There is away.
You can now 'disband' PT Boats back to the pool. Several days (more likely a week) later they appear in the pool so you can recreate them elsewhere.
Rather than sail my PH ones to SOPAC I returned them to the pool and then later recreated them at PagoPago (had to have shipped sufficient supplies there first of course).

Ok I have look at screen to check for disband but never can find it. What are the requirements to disband back into pool?

thanks

Only PT boats can disband back to the pool. Not the Catalina squadrons that were being transported as mentioned in the original post.
"Cry 'Havoc,' and let slip the dogs of war" - William Shakespeare, "Julius Caesar"
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crsutton
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RE: PT Boats are... not that awesome.

Post by crsutton »

ORIGINAL: Fallschirmjager

ORIGINAL: FOW

ORIGINAL: Fallschirmjager

Probably the biggest nerf is the .50 cal M2
They are worthless now. They penetrate but do next to no damage and do not start fires at all.
Even if your PT force catches a thin skinned vessel they hardly damage it since their MGs do nothing.

You need to wait until they upgrade to include 20mm and 40mm guns.

I have noticed that my PTs even flee from porrly escorted AKs in base hexes at night [:(]

A twin .50 mount would tear up the superstucture of a DD or transport pretty good if the distance was close and it could hit with long sustained bursts. The .50 cal is an extremly powerful bullet and the tracer ammunition would also probably start some fires.
I fear that the gun was probably nerfed a little too much in the patch.


Not at high speeds or in any kind of seas. All mounts on PTs were manually sighted. Have you ever been in a 50 foot craft going 30 knots and making hard manuevers. (Well, me neither to be honest [;)]) No way you can hold a target for any length of time. Plus a sustained burst at close range at a DD was going to most likely be rewarded by sustained burts from multiple light and heavy automatic weapons. Lets see, plywood vs half inch steel.....I think we have a winner [:D]

50 cal could shoot up a merchant superstructure a bit but the steel is still there and fairly thick. Might set a fire or two but there is really very little to burn on the upper deck of a merchant ship. Against motor launches and barges, that is another story.
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Dili
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RE: PT Boats are... not that awesome.

Post by Dili »

I am not saying PTs should be used against DD's. But if the game happens to put them up against one another at close range the DD should take some significant damage from a PT with high crew EXP.

Germans sunk 11 destroyers with PT's, one of them was American in Mediterranean. The British prefered lighter guns like 6pdr as a gun to face PT's.
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RCNVR
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RE: PT Boats are... not that awesome.

Post by RCNVR »

Remember that PT boats, MTBs and E boats (or S boats) relied primarily on torpedoes against larger surface vessels. They would usually turn and run after firing the torpedoes. MGBs were a different story but they were mainly to fight smaller ships (trawlers, schooners, barges & coastal vessels) and enemy torpedo boats. The later MGBs were fairly well gunned 2 57mm (6lb) 2 20mm cannon, 4 50cal and 4 303.
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eMonticello
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RE: PT Boats are... not that awesome.

Post by eMonticello »

After the Marine SBD's sunk the supporting Light Cruisers earlier in the day, LCDR Gilbert (A careful and promising officer[Leadership 71; Inspiration 44; Naval 78) and his intrepid PT Boat Squadron engaged the remnants of the enemy transport fleet during the night...

---------------------------------------------------------
AFTER ACTION REPORTS FOR Nov 01, 42
Morning Air attack on TF, near Tassafaronga at 113,137

Weather in hex: Moderate rain

Allied aircraft
F4F-4 Wildcat x 16
SBD-3 Dauntless x 30

No Allied losses

Japanese Ships
CL Kashima, Bomb hits 1, on fire
CL Kashii, Bomb hits 3, heavy fires
xAK Yodogawa Maru
xAK Toa Maru
PC Ch 11, Bomb hits 2, and is sunk
----------------------------------------------------------
2nd Morning Air attack on TF, near Tassafaronga at 113,137

Weather in hex: Moderate rain

Allied aircraft
F4F-4 Wildcat x 16
SBD-3 Dauntless x 30

No Allied losses

Japanese Ships
CL Kashima, Bomb hits 1, on fire
CL Kashii, Bomb hits 3, heavy fires
xAK Yodogawa Maru
xAK Toa Maru
PC Ch 11, Bomb hits 2, and is sunk
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Final Attack: Afternoon Air attack on TF, near Tassafaronga at 113,137

Weather in hex: Thunderstorms

Allied aircraft
F4F-4 Wildcat x 16
SBD-3 Dauntless x 30

Allied aircraft losses
SBD-3 Dauntless: 3 damaged

Japanese Ships
CL Kashima, Bomb hits 1, heavy fires, heavy damage
CL Kashii, Bomb hits 6, and is sunk
xAK Yodogawa Maru
PC Ch 10
DD Hatsukaze
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
AFTER ACTION REPORTS FOR Nov 02, 42
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Night Time Surface Combat, near Tassafaronga at 113,137, Range 1,000 Yards

Japanese Ships
PC Ch 16, Torpedo hits 2, and is sunk
xAK Soyo Maru, Shell hits 6, Torpedo hits 2, and is sunk

Allied Ships
PT-60
PT-61
PT-64
PT-66
PT-109
PT-114

Japanese ground losses:
372 casualties reported
Squads: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled
Non Combat: 1 destroyed, 49 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 13 disabled

Allied Ships Reported to be Approaching!
Japanese TF suspends loading operations and begins to get underway
Reduced sighting due to 25% moonlight
Maximum visibility in Overcast Conditions and 25% moonlight: 1,000 yards
Range closes to 7,000 yards...
Range closes to 2,000 yards...
Range closes to 1,000 yards...
PT-114 engages PC Ch 16 at 1,000 yards
PT-114 engages xAK Soyo Maru at 1,000 yards
Range increases to 2,000 yards
PT-114 engages PC Ch 16 at 2,000 yards
PC Ch 16 sunk by PT-66 at 2,000 yards
Range increases to 3,000 yards
PT-114 engages xAK Soyo Maru at 3,000 yards
Range closes to 2,000 yards
xAK Soyo Maru sunk by PT-114 at 2,000 yards
Combat ends with last Japanese ship sunk...

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
2nd Attack: Night Time Surface Combat, near Tassafaronga at 113,137, Range 1,000 Yards

Japanese Ships
PC Ch 18, Shell hits 17, heavy fires, heavy damage
xAK Yamahagi Maru, Shell hits 5

Allied Ships
PT-60
PT-61
PT-64
PT-66
PT-109
PT-114

Japanese ground losses:
9 casualties reported
Squads: 0 destroyed, 1 disabled
Non Combat: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled

Allied Ships Reported to be Approaching!
Japanese TF suspends loading operations and begins to get underway
Reduced sighting due to 25% moonlight
Maximum visibility in Overcast Conditions and 25% moonlight: 1,000 yards
Range closes to 8,000 yards...
Range closes to 4,000 yards...
Range closes to 1,000 yards...
PT-114 engages PC Ch 18 at 1,000 yards
PT-114 engages xAK Yamahagi Maru at 1,000 yards
PC Ch 18 engages PT-66 at 1,000 yards
PC Ch 18 engages PT-64 at 1,000 yards
Range increases to 2,000 yards
PT-114 engages xAK Yamahagi Maru at 2,000 yards
PT-64 engages PC Ch 18 at 2,000 yards
Range increases to 3,000 yards
PC Ch 18 engages PT-64 at 3,000 yards
Range closes to 2,000 yards
PT-114 engages PC Ch 18 at 2,000 yards
PT-61 engages PC Ch 18 at 2,000 yards
Range increases to 3,000 yards
PC Ch 18 engages PT-66 at 3,000 yards
Task forces break off...

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Swayin
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RE: PT Boats are... not that awesome.

Post by Swayin »

My PI PTs chewed through a ton of AKs before ventually being ground down by escorts.
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