--The great 2003 Tank Challenge--

Squirmer · Post by **Squirmer** » Sat Apr 05, 2003 8:26 pm

You can count me in on this as a M4 driver, whatever the format is

I think Bernie's CTF map would be great.

In case anyone is interested though I have made a list of what you can get for 120 points. This is with fixing morale at 70.

jphamel · Post by **jphamel** » Sat Apr 05, 2003 8:39 pm

I'm away for the week-end got a phone call for a contract for the week-end(Programming), be back monday night.

TTYL

JPHamel

Bernie · Post by **Bernie** » Sat Apr 05, 2003 8:55 pm

IMHO we are trying too hard to make things "equal" between the M4's and the Kats. Isn't the whole purpose of this to finally prove which is better? I say we should just let each competitor choose his/her favorite tank, let the game choose some random stats for it, and have at it. With a "best 2 out of 3" prelim, and a "best 5 out of 7" semi-finals, the laws of averages should make it even, without our having to jump through hoops to "manufacture" an even match, yet still keep each tanks inherent good and bad points.

Goblin · Post by **Goblin** » Sat Apr 05, 2003 9:06 pm

Also, Kat=Panther or Tiger, by definition.

Goblin

Belisarius · Post by **Belisarius** » Sat Apr 05, 2003 9:23 pm

So what should we call the PzIV?

Kitten?

Bernie · Post by **Bernie** » Sat Apr 05, 2003 9:37 pm

Originally posted by Goblin
Also, Kat=Panther or Tiger, by definition.

Goblin

I'd expand that to include any German armor the player cares to use, up to and including the Tiger.

Squirmer · Post by **Squirmer** » Sat Apr 05, 2003 9:41 pm

Well OK but what if all the Katz players get Kingtigers ... ? M4 drivers stand very little chance.

How about any M4 variant versus either a Panther or a standard Tiger?

Goblin · Post by **Goblin** » Sat Apr 05, 2003 9:46 pm

Hold on guys. The Kat guys have always claimed that just about any tank can kill M4's. The you get the M4 guys that say their M4's can kill any Kat out there (of course, for some reason, they always take the E8:rolleyes: ). They made the boastful claims, let them back it up. If they say they can kill Kats, then they should fight Kats.

Goblin

PS- Bel, I call a PzIV useless as far as the game goes. It is not very well represented in the game, ask Orzel, he agrees.

Bernie · Post by **Bernie** » Sat Apr 05, 2003 9:47 pm

Note that I said "...up to and including the Tiger"

The King Tiger came after. Of course, this is all open to debate amongst the competitors. If the M4 contingent thinks they can handle a King Tiger, and want to allow it...

Bernie · Post by **Bernie** » Sat Apr 05, 2003 9:52 pm

Originally posted by Goblin
Hold on guys. The Kat guys have always claimed that just about any tank can kill M4's. The you get the M4 guys that say their M4's can kill any Kat out there (of course, for some reason, they always take the E8:rolleyes: ). They made the boastful claims, let them back it up. If they say they can kill Kats, then they should fight Kats.

Goblin

PS- Bel, I call a PzIV useless as far as the game goes. It is not very well represented in the game, ask Orzel, he agrees.

By that reasoning, any German tank of the war is eligible. Even that venerable Kat toy, "The Maus"

(Listening to cries from the Kat Kontingent, "Yes! Let them eat Maus!")

Squirmer · Post by **Squirmer** » Sat Apr 05, 2003 9:59 pm

I will willingly take on a Kingtiger given 3 M4s :rolleyes: 1 on 1 no way. You might get lucky 1 time in 10 ...

Methinks Jess should have the say on this really

BTW do you get any form of spotters or is it literally 1 tank vs 1 tank?

Goblin · Post by **Goblin** » Sat Apr 05, 2003 10:43 pm

I disagree. Maus is 'Mouse', and therefore no Kat. The PzIV is the PzIV. Tiger, Panther, King Tiger.

I have seen Jess kill two of my King Tigers from the front with an Easy 8, while I bounced (BOUNCED!) four 88mm rounds off of it. In our 1 on 1, I put 6 or so 88's into an Easy 8, all BONK, BOINK, and KaPING's. Anyone who thinks the game accurately reflects the M4's armor is smoking strong stuff....

Goblin

Squirmer · Post by **Squirmer** » Sat Apr 05, 2003 11:14 pm

OK OK whatever

As long as I can have a Firefly :rolleyes:

I see that thing with the 88s bouncing off a lot, on all kinds of vehicles too. It's only with the L71 though

Gimme a JPz-IV/70 anyday ...

Orzel Bialy · Post by **Orzel Bialy** » Sun Apr 06, 2003 1:35 am

Originally posted by Goblin
PS- Bel, I call a PzIV useless as far as the game goes. It is not very well represented in the game, ask Orzel, he agrees. [/B]

Until 6.something came out I loved the Pzkw IVg/h/j models. They were faster than the Tiger...more reliable than the early Panthers...could take some punishment and could hit hard in return!

Then that suddenly changed...overnight they became quite frankly the German version of the M4. All of a sudden they were getting knocked off left and right by 45mm and 57mm guns at long range...let alone a 75mm or 76mm gun!

My poor Pzkw IV's!!!

PS...Katz should be Tigers / Panthers / or their Assault gun spin offs...in my book that is.

Goblin · Post by **Goblin** » Sun Apr 06, 2003 2:58 am

Originally posted by Squirmer
OK OK whatever As long as I can have a Firefly :rolleyes:

Lol, another 'I like the tank, but not with the original equipment' guy...

I want to see you billy b@d@$$ M4 guys say I want my M4A1 one of these times!!

(Jess or Hawk, I meant you:p )

Goblin

Ironfist · Post by **Ironfist** » Sun Apr 06, 2003 3:58 am

They were the main work horse of the day, I too have noticed that their quality has been lowered and I too have seen 88's bounce right of tanks within 20 hexs using all 6 shots while they kill me with one shot. By the way are they ever going to do anything about the dancing tank bug ? You know where the whole tank turns to fire instead of the turret so your opponents wait for the side and rear shots so they dont have to close assault like I have to do. Well atleast thats what I end up doing.

Personally I think we should let the game pick ratio and all Im sick of opponents with hopped up units. And why only one tank ? why not one platoon or one Section ? If its going to be one tank vs one tank lets go open country no hidding. Then agian there's alot to be said about tactics. Last note I vote for the M4 75mm vs Panzer IV 75mm. sounds more fair. If not I'd go with a Jadpanther or Panther "G" or "HUH".

Goblin · Post by **Goblin** » Sun Apr 06, 2003 4:02 am

Ironfist,

Orient your tank in the direction you want it. Then hit 'T', and use the Next and Previous buttons to cycle thru until you get the target you desire, and select that target. Now use the 'F' key, and your tank will fire at that target without turning its hull towards it (unless it is adjacent to you). If you just put your crosshairs on the enemy and fire, the tank always turns its hull and turret into alignment on the target.

Goblin

Ironfist · Post by **Ironfist** » Sun Apr 06, 2003 4:12 am

I mean when the tank is in defensive role and I have no control. Not durring my turn:D I have lost four armor units alone durring WC2003 to this one bug other wise my opponent would not have killed any tanks.

Goblin · Post by **Goblin** » Sun Apr 06, 2003 4:17 am

The tank shouldn't rotate its body... unless you mean Tank Destroyer with no turret? I don't see a way to avoid that; the vehicle must turn to fire. The only time my tanks actually turn their hulls on defense is if the enemy gets adjacent. If that is what you mean, then YES, they need to change it, lol. I understand the desire to put your heavy armor towards the adjacent threat, but if it is a sniper setting you up for a Wolverine, then I know where I want my armor...

Goblin

Orzel Bialy · Post by **Orzel Bialy** » Sun Apr 06, 2003 4:30 am

I have to AGREE WITH GOBLIN ONCE MORE....

I'm a Kat lover....when asked to take up a challenge I don't ever demand the King Tiger...nor even the late model over the early model...and I WILL NEVER ASK OR AGREE TO A RESTRUCTURE OF THE POINT VALUES!

I believe that you take what you are given and play with it...let the computer play the fickle hand of fate. Besides...I think highly enough of my commander skills that I go into each battle with the belief that I can navigate any commander rating to victory!:D :p

As far as some brave soul taking an M4A1 into battle Goblin....

U R a funny guy!!! There is a better chance of monkies flying out of Jess and/or Hawks backsides!!!

--The great 2003 Tank Challenge--

Tanks

Away for the next 2 days

Panzer IV's

You miss understand

Hmmm...AGAIN!!!!