Semi OT, Italy in the Med, a good book

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RE: Semi OT, Italy in the Med, a good book

Post by warspite1 »

ORIGINAL: warspite1

The book arrived today - hurrah! First impressions, not good value for money, just over 200 pages only - Horroo!

Oh well, time to get stuck in
warspite1

First comment:

Well I’ve got to say that I am really enjoying the book, no real surprises (and a few bits of welcome detail) so far in terms of content or delivery, but O’Hara writes really well and so his books are easy to read – this one is no different.

One thing that grates though (as always) is the interpretation he chooses to put on things that betray his, imo, mis-placed bias. Here is an example when the author seeks to provide a summary of the situation in early 1941:
O'Hara
…nor did the results validate the assumptions behind the War Cabinet’s decision to make the Mediterranean the focus of Britain’s war effort. Despite the Italian Army’s failures, the Regia Aeronautica’s ineffectiveness at sea, and Rome’s short-sighted policies…….the strategic situation in January 1941 remained much the same as in July 1940…..

So basically the British are throwing everything at the Mediterranean and the Italians are holding them off with apparent ease despite making mistakes of their own. There are two problems with this; a) no mention of the Regia Marina’s failings in the summary (although in fairness some of these had at least been acknowledged earlier) but, more importantly is b). I will re-write the above paragraph above to illustrate what I mean by this.
warspite1
…nor did the results validate the assumptions behind the War Cabinet’s decision to make the Mediterranean the focus of Britain’s war effort. That said of course it needs to be recognised that the British armed forces (as ever in particular the navy) and industry had been somewhat pre-occupied during the period, and that the Mediterranean was barely receiving the resources it needed. To put this into context the British had:

- The urgent need to train and re-equip the army in case of invasion of the UK following the losses in Norway and France, while at the same time reinforcing and supplying the garrison on Malta and the army in Egypt.
- The urgent need to replace the losses of modern fighters in France and to build up the RAF for the Battle of Britain (which of course took place during this period)
- The need to replace the RN losses off Norway and France as well as the Atlantic – and repair the great many damaged ships – which took up valuable dockyard space and resources.
- To switch construction from battleships and carriers to building ASW vessels to counter the U-boat threat
- To cope with the disruption to industry from the Luftwaffe bombing of cities
- To cope with the halting of the build-up of the Fleet Air Arm to ensure the RAF was as large as possible
- To build up a bomber force to take the war to Germany
- The incredible strain on shipping (and their escorts) as the British had to transport men and resources from all over the globe – Canada, South Africa, Australia, New Zealand, India et al
In addition, like the Italians, the British had their own fair share of strategic folly. During this period badly needed ships were sent to Dakar on an ill-thought out operation to depose the Vichy Government.

So in the face of the above the British were not only holding their own, but by the end of the following month, the British desert offensive – Operation Compass - by ‘Wavell’s 30,000’ would wipe out the Italian 10th Army in Libya, costing Italy almost 150,000 casualties, including 133,000 captured.

Fairer, more balanced?

British intention may well have been to put effort into the Med - where else where they going to fight the Axis on land? - but I think it fair to say that if the Mediterranean was the no.1 priority then a few more Spitfires, a few more modern battleships, carriers and a few more troops would have been sent there. However, with the Germans threatening the Atlantic sea-lanes and invasion of the UK, things were not that simple. For O'Hara to discount that seems a tad inequitable....

And I haven't even mentioned that the Italians are essentially fighting 'at home'. The British forces are split across miles of ocean from Gibraltar to Malta to Egypt. The Italians have the internal lines of communication, they have the central position and can pick their ground and defeat either British force (Force H or the Mediterranean Fleet) in detail - should they choose to attempt it.


Now Maitland, now's your time!

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MakeeLearn
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RE: Semi OT, Italy in the Med, a good book

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You added a lot of info and that's good. I believe it would give it a more expressive timbre by having the info be presented in a way that it includes someone there at the time, or a exact happening .

Each nugget of info tied to a specific experience and/or happening.


If I make sense[&:]






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RE: Semi OT, Italy in the Med, a good book

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To summarize...in a war with the Royal Navy - don't bet on Italy regardless of how good they look on paper. [:)]
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RE: Semi OT, Italy in the Med, a good book

Post by warspite1 »

ORIGINAL: MakeeLearn

You added a lot of info and that's good. I believe it would give it a more expressive timbre by having the info be presented in a way that it includes someone there at the time, or a exact happening .

Each nugget of info tied to a specific experience and/or happening.


If I make sense[&:]
warspite1

No - at least not to me - but I am keen to understand what you do mean please?
Now Maitland, now's your time!

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RE: Semi OT, Italy in the Med, a good book

Post by warspite1 »

ORIGINAL: Zorch

To summarize...in a war with the Royal Navy - don't bet on Italy regardless of how good they look on paper. [:)]
warspite1

[:)]

But in all seriousness, this is my point. I think given the circumstances, Italy - or at least their navy - should have given the Royal Navy a major bloody nose.

One thing that does come across very clearly is that, apart from sending supplies and troops to North Africa (which as seen have to a large extent been swallowed up during Compass) the Italians have achieved nothing tangible in this period (up to February 1941). That all changes only when the Germans arrive - and that is true of aircraft, submarines and ground forces.

But anyway, I will read on.....
Now Maitland, now's your time!

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RE: Semi OT, Italy in the Med, a good book

Post by MakeeLearn »

ORIGINAL: warspite1

ORIGINAL: MakeeLearn

You added a lot of info and that's good. I believe it would give it a more expressive timbre by having the info be presented in a way that it includes someone there at the time, or a exact happening .

Each nugget of info tied to a specific experience and/or happening.


If I make sense[&:]
warspite1

No - at least not to me - but I am keen to understand what you do mean please?

To be clearer than I was, you were showing that info had been left out that would have made the original statements balanced and shed more light on the subject.
And well done that was. I took it beyond to the next level, as to how the info should be presented to the reader. I'am not saying you are wrong or incomplete.
Your coverage is excellent. I just wanted to show how it would be best to connect the reader to that info had this been going to be put into a book.

Bookgamming[:)]









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RE: Semi OT, Italy in the Med, a good book

Post by Buckrock »

ORIGINAL: warspite1
One thing that grates though (as always) is the interpretation he chooses to put on things that betray his, imo, mis-placed bias. Here is an example when the author seeks to provide a summary of the situation in early 1941:
O'Hara
…nor did the results validate the assumptions behind the War Cabinet’s decision to make the Mediterranean the focus of Britain’s war effort. Despite the Italian Army’s failures, the Regia Aeronautica’s ineffectiveness at sea, and Rome’s short-sighted policies…….the strategic situation in January 1941 remained much the same as in July 1940…..

So basically the British are throwing everything at the Mediterranean and the Italians are holding them off with apparent ease despite making mistakes of their own.
Perhaps it would have been fairer to the author to accompany O'Hara's extract with some indication of his original context.

The section of O'Hara's book from which that extract is taken does not suggest the British were throwing "everything" at the Italians or that the
Italians were "holding them off with ease". Neither does the quoted extract when put in context.

That section covers the first six months(ish) of Britain's Mediterranean War with Italy. In it, O'Hara attempts to make the equivalent of a cost-benefit
analysis of British efforts to date, using Britain's substantial commitment of forces and war resources to that theatre during the period as the cost
and the War Cabinet assumptions as to what could be gained strategically as the benefit.

O'Hara in your quoted extract is just pointing out that despite Britain's effort and successes there during this period, the hoped for strategic gains
(ie. sea control of the Central Med) that would validate the original commitment were not yet forthcoming. In other words, O'Hara is suggesting it
was not going to be as easy to achieve as they first hoped.

Other than the implied naivety of the War Council's expectations, there actually was very little criticism I saw of the British performance in this
section that should require excusing.
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RE: Semi OT, Italy in the Med, a good book

Post by warspite1 »

ORIGINAL: Buckrock
ORIGINAL: warspite1
One thing that grates though (as always) is the interpretation he chooses to put on things that betray his, imo, mis-placed bias. Here is an example when the author seeks to provide a summary of the situation in early 1941:
O'Hara
…nor did the results validate the assumptions behind the War Cabinet’s decision to make the Mediterranean the focus of Britain’s war effort. Despite the Italian Army’s failures, the Regia Aeronautica’s ineffectiveness at sea, and Rome’s short-sighted policies…….the strategic situation in January 1941 remained much the same as in July 1940…..

So basically the British are throwing everything at the Mediterranean and the Italians are holding them off with apparent ease despite making mistakes of their own.
Perhaps it would have been fairer to the author to accompany O'Hara's extract with some indication of his original context.

The section of O'Hara's book from which that extract is taken does not suggest the British were throwing "everything" at the Italians or that the
Italians were "holding them off with ease". Neither does the quoted extract when put in context.

That section covers the first six months(ish) of Britain's Mediterranean War with Italy. In it, O'Hara attempts to make the equivalent of a cost-benefit
analysis of British efforts to date, using Britain's substantial commitment of forces and war resources to that theatre during the period as the cost
and the War Cabinet assumptions as to what could be gained strategically as the benefit.

O'Hara in your quoted extract is just pointing out that despite Britain's effort and successes there during this period, the hoped for strategic gains
(ie. sea control of the Central Med) that would validate the original commitment were not yet forthcoming. In other words, O'Hara is suggesting it
was not going to be as easy to achieve as they first hoped.

Other than the implied naivety of the War Council's expectations, there actually was very little criticism I saw of the British performance in this
section that should require excusing.
warspite1

Thanks for the input (always welcomed from you) - we have different interpretations of what the author is saying - maybe because I have greater knowledge of O'Hara(?) or that I am ahead of what I have commented upon and know more about what is coming next (I recall you saying you only read about the convoys and not the other elements of the book)? Or maybe we just disagree, however I will expand upon your comment in due course.

Plenty more to comment upon on this and other points [:)]
Now Maitland, now's your time!

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RE: Semi OT, Italy in the Med, a good book

Post by warspite1 »

ORIGINAL: MakeeLearn
ORIGINAL: warspite1

ORIGINAL: MakeeLearn

You added a lot of info and that's good. I believe it would give it a more expressive timbre by having the info be presented in a way that it includes someone there at the time, or a exact happening .

Each nugget of info tied to a specific experience and/or happening.


If I make sense[&:]
warspite1

No - at least not to me - but I am keen to understand what you do mean please?

To be clearer than I was, you were showing that info had been left out that would have made the original statements balanced and shed more light on the subject.
And well done that was. I took it beyond to the next level, as to how the info should be presented to the reader. I'am not saying you are wrong or incomplete.
Your coverage is excellent. I just wanted to show how it would be best to connect the reader to that info had this been going to be put into a book.

Bookgamming[:)]



warspite1

I think the important thing is that the info just needed to be presented to the reader. This gives context when looking at the position at the time and thus performance is being compared on an equal basis. How this is presented is interesting and has given me an idea for a little project - namely to try and track every vessel during the war to have a greater understanding of what was where at any given time. That should keep me out of mischief for a few months.....[:)]


Now Maitland, now's your time!

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RE: Semi OT, Italy in the Med, a good book

Post by Buckrock »

ORIGINAL: warspite1

Thanks for the input (always welcomed from you) - we have different interpretations of what the author is saying - maybe because I have greater knowledge of O'Hara(?) or that I am ahead of what I have commented upon and know more about what is coming next (I recall you saying you only read about the convoys and not the other elements of the book)? Or maybe we just disagree, however I will expand upon your comment in due course.

Context again. What comes next is the section covering the period January-July 1941. The quote you used is from the final paragraphs of the section
covering the previous six months and only related to assessments of that period. It would only be fair to the author if we were to judge that extract
based on the section of Chapter 2 that it was in, along with the relevent War Cabinet assumptions laid out in Chapter 1. I would have thought the
author intended it that way when he laid out his narrative, to make his case sequentially.

But it's just my opinion. Don't let me stop you having fun.[:)]
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RE: Semi OT, Italy in the Med, a good book

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I've always been told size isn't everything....
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RE: Semi OT, Italy in the Med, a good book

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ORIGINAL: dr.hal

I've always been told size isn't everything....
warspite1

Well that's good to know [;)]
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RE: Semi OT, Italy in the Med, a good book

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ORIGINAL: Dili
Fighters from Rodi don't have range and time on station from Rodi to the Western/South of Crete. The mission was to be in North of Crete, but then was changed to be South of Crete.

See the map where the hits were made.
https://www.ibiblio.org/hyperwar/UN/UK/ ... d-II-6.JPG

The air cover was not "wishful thinking": during all March, 27th 1941 the Italian squadron was supposed to be covered by the X Fliegerkorps. Not even a propeller materialised.

Regarding the range of the potential air cover, when on the 28th the first flight of six Albacore attacked the Italian fleet, the AA didn't fire immediately because they were mistaken for six Italian Fiat C.R.42 operating out of Rhodes - so for the Italians it was not strange to have fighters operating so far out. Even more important was the attack that two S.M.79, also based in Rhodes, had launched against the HMS Formidable. These two airplanes were operating under normal patrol orders. Had the Regia Areonautica not flunked again, instead of two stray planes they could have launched a full attack against the British fleet - with unknown but better-than-nothing results.

One last thing about another factor mentioned here. True, the Italians were aware that the British were equipped with RADAR, but the full potentiality of this equipment has still not been appreciated (not even by the allies: it is worth mentioning how, at Savo Island, the RADAR-equipped and hopefully trained American ships gurgled down just fine). Also, in 1941 RADAR was not so common on British ships. In the British squadron who fought the night action at Matapan, only the Valiant was RADAR-equipped. Cunningham actually got notice of the incoming Italian cruisers from a officer on the Warspite who sighted them by using binoculars - go figure.

One last thing is worth mentioning: during the inquest which followed the disaster, Admiral Iachino (who had no political cover) ended up being absolved after he based his defence on three objective points:

- His squadron was to be covered, according to the operational plans, by Italian and German planes. None actually appeared.
- The naval intelligence had assured him that the British had only one Battleship available; instead they had three plus a carrier.
- He was unable (as all Italian Admirals were) to take "important operational/strategic decisions" - this task belonging to Supermarina.

The commission absolved Iachino, and, closing the matter the Italian way, decided that no one had to be punished (!)

Truth is, everyone had to be: Supermarina/Superaereo for the superficiality with which the operation had been planned; Iachino for the crazy idea of sending a cruiser division not trained (or even ready) for night fightning back to the Pola; and Cattaneo (the commander of the cruiser squadron - who was killed in the battle) for the equally crazy idea of steaming into the night with his own destroyers' screen behind the cruisers. But that was Italy in WWII for you.
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RE: Semi OT, Italy in the Med, a good book

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ORIGINAL: RFalvo69

ORIGINAL: Dili
Fighters from Rodi don't have range and time on station from Rodi to the Western/South of Crete. The mission was to be in North of Crete, but then was changed to be South of Crete.

See the map where the hits were made.
https://www.ibiblio.org/hyperwar/UN/UK/ ... d-II-6.JPG

One last thing about another factor mentioned here. True, the Italians were aware that the British were equipped with RADAR, but the full potentiality of this equipment has still not been appreciated (not even by the allies: it is worth mentioning how, at Savo Island, the RADAR-equipped and hopefully trained American ships gurgled down just fine). Also, in 1941 RADAR was not so common on British ships. In the British squadron who fought the night action at Matapan, only the Valiant was RADAR-equipped. Cunningham actually got notice of the incoming Italian cruisers from a officer on the Warspite who sighted them by using binoculars - go figure.
warspite1

As far as the RM were concerned, avoiding night engagements was key because the British had proven more capable than the RM - the Battle of the Straits of Otranto in November 1940 being the one that would have directed their thinking.

Obviously I have no idea exactly what was going though Iachino's mind, but I should be on safe ground in suggesting that his mind-set would not have been:

I don't know where the British are, that is true, but:
- Even if they are close by, RADAR is relatively new technology so maybe theirs won't work
- Maybe not all RN ships have RADAR and maybe none of the ones that might be close by have it

..or maybe it was, because something led him to believe that sending the rest of 1st Division + destroyers at night was a sensible move.

As you say, Iachino was partly responsible for the loss of the entire 1st Division (if not Pola herself) - and Cattaneo appears to have contributed to the debacle.
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RE: Semi OT, Italy in the Med, a good book

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I have finally read the book and comment as follows:

Before I do just a word on the book itself; I agree this is a good book – as expected from the pen of O’Hara. As said above, the author writes in a very easy to read, logically ordered style. If one has an interest in naval warfare in World War II then the Mediterranean, like the Pacific (and indeed the Atlantic) provides the student with much to read about and ponder over.

For those aware of O’Hara’s work there is nothing really new here in terms of the central point he makes (namely that the RM performed well in WWII and indeed got better as the war progressed), and by focusing on the three 1942 Malta convoys, he seeks to add some detail to his thoughts on the performance of the Regia Marina and attempts to prove his point about their improved capability. I note that various comments made in this book do appear slightly inconsistent not only with other comments within the book, but also with his other works. That said, make no mistake, I do not consider O’Hara in any way shape or form a ‘shock jock’ who spouts nonsense to sell a book. The author has clearly researched his subject and has his interpretation of events.

It is always good to get views from all sides and O’Hara’s work gives one that and I would recommend this book too.
And so to the main question about the performance of the Italian armed forces – and particularly the Regia Marina and Regia Aeronautica.
It also might change your view of the Regia Marina and the Regia Aeronautica during the latter stages of Italy's participation in the war as a part of the Axis powers.
But before I comment on this, there is one key question that needs to be taken into account. Who is one judging? Mussolini? Supermarina? The Admirals? The officers and crews of the ships and aircraft? The fighting forces do not set the political agenda. Admirals and Generals can give to the politicians advice and the benefit of their ‘expertise’ but they cannot direct policy. In other words, they have to deal with the consequences of what is decided by others.

And the obvious example with regard to the Mediterranean War is Malta and the decision on whether to hold this. As the OP said, this is a debate for another thread (or later), but the fact was that decision was made and – as throughout history – it then falls to the poor servicemen to follow through in practice on political decisions.

In judging the performance of the RM, it is important to take into account what they were actually tasked with. The Italian navy’s key war plans, specified on 29 May 1940, states at the outset:

- A defensive orientation in the western and eastern basins and an offensive or counter-offensive posture in the central Mediterranean

Also stated are:

- Impeding the union of the enemy’s eastern and western forces by blockading the Sicilian Channel
- The operation of insidious and light forces against the enemy’s most important lines of communication
- The seizure and exploitation of every opportunity to fight under conditions of superior or equal strength
- To employ, as soon as possible, the battle fleet against the enemy before his Mediterranean force could be reinforced and while battles can be fought closer to friendly bases than those of the enemy.
- To protect communications with the islands, Libya and Albania

I think it is clear that the second and last on this list were successes for the RM. Only three British convoys were passed through the Mediterranean from west to east in the opening 3-years, and as stated earlier (post 18) the percentage of supplies (I have always assumed O’Hara’s numbers are correct) of 98% (personnel) and 90% (supplies) delivered to North Africa is impressive.

But as per the RM plans above, these were not the only objectives of the RM and therefore it is wrong to assess their performance based on these achievements alone. Regardless of the point that O’Hara tries to make – that the Mediterranean was identified as where the British main effort would be - as per post 6, the British (and especially the RN) had plenty of other things to worry about too. For the Italians however, with a few exceptions such as aircraft being sent to fight the Battle of Britain for a short period or a small percentage of submarines being sent to the Atlantic, there was little if any such distraction for the RM/RA.

The RM had many advantages – and these are actually evidenced in the book, so hard to ignore – by virtue of Italy’s central positon and internal line of communication. For example during Harpoon / Vigorous, having the central position, the RM was able to easily switch targets from the Western Mediterranean to the Eastern. The movement of aircraft between Italy, Sardinia and Sicily was also relatively easy. For the British to re-supply Malta with aircraft was a major undertaking as was forming the ships in the first place.

In addition, through the decision to defend Malta, the British played right into the RM’s hands by tasking the RN with having to venture into the central Mediterranean. Had the RM been more robust in following through on their plans (above) the RN could have been heavily defeated.

But it is important to remove hindsight and I think that to malign the RM for not being aggressive in the early months of the war is, on reflection, unfair. After all, Mussolini declared war because he knew it was pretty much over. By declaring war the Italians would therefore reap the benefits without putting themselves at risk. In April 1940 the naval Chief of Staff, Cavagnari, prepared a memorandum to Mussolini that confirmed that in a full-scale naval battle there would be large losses on both sides – but that the British could make good their losses, whereas the Italians couldn’t. As Cavagnari was the CoS in the opening months of war the RM’s cautious mindset – notwithstanding the war plans detailed - is perhaps more understandable.

However, when that assumption regarding the length of the war was pretty quickly seen to be totally false, the RM mindset should have changed. In post 43 it was questioned what events post Spartivento had to do with Mussolini – well the removal of Cavagnari and his deputy confirms exactly what Mussolini thought of the RM’s inability to beat the RN, even when at an advantage. Mussolini expected more from his fleet where circumstances allowed.

Per the plans above, these did not mean the Italian navy could not be aggressive if the right opportunity presented itself. But Campioni’s replacement, Iachino, never took full advantage of his situation and O’Hara makes the point that the Italian rank and file view was perhaps that this Admiral was not up to the job. He confirms that the wrong, overly timid, calls were still being made in 1942 - by Supermarina not just Iachino. The Harpoon and Pedestal convoys could have been finished off by the RM – but the ships were recalled (or never committed)….

The simple truth is that the Italians were heavily reliant upon German assistance and the performance of both the RM and the RA is inflated by the Luftwaffe and U-boat contribution. Until the arrival of the Luftwaffe in January 1941 the number of sinkings of Malta-bound merchant vessels was precisely 4 out of 59 – or less than 7%. One only needs to look at the exposed position of Malta to realise that this is hardly an impressive performance.

Things began to change only with the arrival of the Luftwaffe in January 1941 and they immediately made their presence felt both on Malta and to the RN during the Excess convoy. Malta became untenable as a naval base – certainly for surface warships.

Indeed when the Luftwaffe was withdrawn three months later Malta became effective once more and toward the end of 1941 cruisers were able to base on the island. This Malta Striking Force caused serious losses to Axis supply convoys during this period, whilst Malta was re-supplied.

O’Hara makes the point that the Italian performance rose sharply in 1942 and yes, as was to be expected, years of war and battle experience does lead to improvements. But more than this December 1941 also marked the return of the Luftwaffe.

To be fair to the RM, the one human torpedo attack that succeeded during the war (by removing Queen Elizabeth and Valiant for repairs) was achieved at a vital time and removed the last battleships from the eastern Mediterranean. However, look at the ships sunk by the Germans and then compare this to those sunk by the Italians – of particular importance is the vessel type. The Italian navy (inc. torpedo boats) did not sink anything larger than a cruiser in World War II. Compare that to the much smaller number of German U-boats, and their victims included the carriers Eagle and Ark Royal and the battleship Barham.

The Allied warship losses to all causes are as follows – Germans 56% - Italians 44% and this is made up a follows: German aircraft 30%, Italian surface forces + mines + Shore batteries 28%, German U-boats 21%, Italian aircraft 9%, Italian submarines 7%, Other German 5%. It is clear from this that the RN’s position would have been significantly different without the German armed forces intervention.

So no, I do not entirely agree with O’Hara’s view of the RM/RA performance during World War II. They were most certainly not useless and they did not lack for bravery. However, in terms of what they did achieve and what they should (or could) have achieved, there is too large a gap.

My 2 cents.


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RE: Semi OT, Italy in the Med, a good book

Post by Dili »

Italy had only 2 battleships when war started. If we can call rebored 320mm guns battleships instead of battlecruisers. 3 in July with Dullio, 2 Littorios were only op in mid -August so 5, the last Doria only late October. Btw Regia Aeronautica was forbidden by Mussolini of attacking Alexandria until August/September when he finally realized that the war was to go on.
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RE: Semi OT, Italy in the Med, a good book

Post by warspite1 »

ORIGINAL: Dili

Italy had only 2 battleships when war started. If we can call rebored 320mm guns battleships instead of battlecruisers. 3 in July with Dullio, 2 Littorios were only op in mid -August so 5, the last Doria only late October. Btw Regia Aeronautica was forbidden by Mussolini of attacking Alexandria until August/September when he finally realized that the war was to go on.
warspite1

Indeed, and with the problems that the Littorios encountered on entering service, lets call them late autumn. IMO, thereafter, post-Spartivento and the change of personnel, the excuses run out.
Now Maitland, now's your time!

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JeffroK
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RE: Semi OT, Italy in the Med, a good book

Post by JeffroK »

True or False, the Fuel oil situation cramped the RM actions?
Interdum feror cupidine partium magnarum Europae vincendarum
Dili
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RE: Semi OT, Italy in the Med, a good book

Post by Dili »

Yes since begin of 1942. It was practically the last time big ships went of to sea.
Dili
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RE: Semi OT, Italy in the Med, a good book

Post by Dili »

ORIGINAL: warspite1

ORIGINAL: Dili

Italy had only 2 battleships when war started. If we can call rebored 320mm guns battleships instead of battlecruisers. 3 in July with Dullio, 2 Littorios were only op in mid -August so 5, the last Doria only late October. Btw Regia Aeronautica was forbidden by Mussolini of attacking Alexandria until August/September when he finally realized that the war was to go on.
warspite1

Indeed, and with the problems that the Littorios encountered on entering service, lets call them late autumn. IMO, thereafter, post-Spartivento and the change of personnel, the excuses run out.
I found an excuse :)
In autumn they were back to 3 battleships due to Taranto, Taranto attack indeed stopped a naval bombing of Souda bay by the 8"inch cruisers protected by the battleships.
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