Ne4w game v Desertwolf

[Andy Mac]

OK I am going to try and dig in on the more exposed line

2nd Red Banner Army with 36th and 57th Motor Rifle Divs and 61st and 111th Tank Divs will be my mailed fist reserve supported by 7 Tank and Armoured Car Bdes it will also cover the centre section south of Kyaktah

17th Army with 103rd, 12th 210th Rifle Divs, 51st Cavalry Div and 39th 17th 226th, 227th Rifle Bdes will hold the West Flank centred on Kyaktah with the Cavalry and a Rifle Bde holding the mountains to the north and a larger covering force to the South a couple of Bde covering the Northern mountains

36th Army with 68th Mountain, 3rd 35th, 94th and 209th Rifle Divs will hold Ulan Ude and Petrovsky

The newly re constituting 79th Rifle Div, 2 Mongol Cav Divs and 2nd Rifle Bde also reconstituting will as they reach 80% TOE be rotated into the line

If the Japanese destroy 101st Rifle DIv and the three cutoff Rifle Bdes eventually these will also be reconstituted as a reserve.

[Andy Mac]

Interesting turn as my forces stepped back from Chita I tried an attack on the 2 Divs on my LOC had 3,000 AV backed by Arty and Air and plenty of supply his 2 Divs of 800 AV beat me easily despite 4:1 AV advantage

A bit irritating but probably achieved the objective which was to make him wary of following too closely whilst the next phase of my plan takes shape.

[GetAssista]

ORIGINAL: Andy Mac
Interesting turn as my forces stepped back from Chita I tried an attack on the 2 Divs on my LOC had 3,000 AV backed by Arty and Air and plenty of supply his 2 Divs of 800 AV beat me easily despite 4:1 AV advantage

It is x3 terrain. 2 divisions would have around 800-900 AV if they did not take part in heavy fighting, so you are looking at 2400-2700 adjusted AV with not a lot of potential to reduce it via artillery barrage (again, terrain). There was not much hope for you to get 2:1 in this situation on the first try, cause defenders rarely get AV maluses in a favourable terrain and in supply.

Successive attacks would erode his AV and thus bring adjusted AV down but do you really need it? I suppose your aim should be to make him get a bloody nose over your strong positions not the other way around

[Andy Mac]

Agreed but it was worth a go not hanging around to try again

I have never played with the Soviets before a few lessons I have learned tactically

Bombers are actually pretty good
Fighters are terrible - I suspect the fighters would be good against 1st Gen Japanese Fighters but v 2nd gen not so much.
AA is brilliant when massed
Arty on open ground is fearsome
Soviet Inf Divs are pretty good
Tank Bdes are vulnerable to air and ground attacks

Strategically
I think I have mishandled the campaign not to the extent its a disaster but I fell into a few traps of following my own plan and not reacting enough to his - not sure if I am being over critical but for example I really underestimated the strength committed to the North and the extent he pushed me there has surprised me

[Andy Mac]

Status of Army Group South

Voroshilev lvl 6 Forts
Vladivostock lvl 9 Forts

Supply Status 800,000

1st Red Banner Army 4 Rifle Divs, 3 Rifle Bdes
15th Army 13 Rifle Bdes
25th Army 2 Rifle Divs and 7 Rifle Bdes

Supported by 35 Artillery Regts and many AA Bns !!!!

All 100% prepped for Voroshilev.....

So 7000 AV with a fearsome arty train plenty of supplies and inf sqads that upgrade to double the firepower in January.

This to me is the danger in attacking Russia - Vladivostok i to all intents and purposes impregnable
Its all very quiet in the south

[Andy Mac]

He hasnt even nibbled at my perimeter fortresses

[Andy Mac]

I am going to feint towards the northern border of the southern pocket no intention of attacking be see if he moves forces in response

[Andy Mac]

In the north I have c 7,000 AV and in 4 weeks they get massively stronger

2nd Red Banner Army with 36th and 57th Motor Rifle Divs and 61st and 111th Tank Divs will be my mailed fist reserve supported by 7 Tank and Armoured Car Bdes

17th Army with 103rd, 12th 210th Rifle Divs, 51st Cavalry Div and 39th 17th 226th, 227th Rifle Bdes

36th Army with 68th Mountain, 3rd 35th, 94th and 209th Rifle Divs

The newly re constituting 79th Rifle Div, 2 Mongol Cav Divs and 2nd Rifle Bde also reconstituting will as they reach 80% TOE be rotated into the line

101st Rifle Div and the three cutoff Rifle Bdes eventually these will also be reconstituted as a reserve.

Over the next year I get 7 more Rifle Divs in the north
I get round out Artillery units for about 4 other Rifle Bdes converting them to Divs

And I will have 35th Army with 3 re constituting Divs in the north from the southern Army Group in 5 ish months

My best guess is 7 months before I will be ready to knock him back in the North

[Andy Mac]

Last couple of turns have been tough not going to lie

My last 2 Carriers were transiting between Aden heading to Mombasa on map for one turn behind Socotra where I have extensive search assets working this time... and a sub screen and who pops up at 2 hex range full KB and sinks em both my guys never had a chance and did no damage

next day a large element of the rearguard was retreated on the road back from Ulan Bator - the incessant japanese air attacks slowed me down just long enough for the Japanese Army to catch me and force a retreat and will probably do so again in a day or so so those Divs will either surrender or be totally wrecked

This puts a totally different complexion on the northern situation - I have no choice but to bug out back towards the Irkutsk Road and dig in with everything I have - not really sure what to say except really dissapointing couple of days

[Andy Mac]

My plan for Army Group North may be in a spot of bother if I get retreated again and I suspect I will

I now need to get probably 6,000 AV dug in on the road and use the other 1,000 to hold the mountains all air needs to pull back apart from recon and strong LOC troops allocated basically concentrate 2.5 of my three armies in one hex in bad terrain and make him take it off me that hard way - can he do that probably not BUT what I really wanted to avoid was having to attack myself in that bad terrain in 6 or 7 months

So the plan now unfortunately is to wait for my Inf Squad upgrade and the destroyed troops to arrive and in 5 1/2 months I get the 25th Army that I disbanded in Vladivostock back so 3 Inf Divs 2 Arty Bdes and 2 Motorised Bdes plus the base forces I disbanded laughingly to support my AF in the north fat lot of use thats been

I also get round out units for the 4 Inf Bdes turning them into Divs and the destroyed units in 20 - 30 days respawned so maybe a total force in Divs of 25 Divisions

I will have a powerfull force but I could easily wreck it getting through the bad terrain

Andy

[Andy Mac]

So 12 Divs in North now plus NKVD Div and a Cav Div on LOC Duty will now need to move up in support as 2 of the Divs I susepct will be wrecked

7 Reinforcing Divs in 7 months
2 Destroyed Divs respawning
4 Rifle Bdes converting to Divs
3 Disbanded Inf Divs of 25th Army re forming in the North

So 26 Divs total 4 to be rebuilt now and 3 to be rebuilt in 5 - 6 months even divided to get to 80% TOE the rebuilt Divs will take 2 months and be v low exp when rebuilt until they get some combat action

So probably use them to hold the road and pull back experieced Divs to refit for my offensive

Its going to take a while !!!

[Andy Mac]

4,000 Soviet Rifle Squads in the pool and enough devices to rebuild 20 Divs !!! (was 3,000 but I disbanded 3 Divs to the pool !!) with 600 a month being added I would love a few more shell Divs to rebuild would trade half the surplus for some Yaks or Kingcobras to help my AF !!!

I missed a trick rather than disbanding I should have suicided 3 or 4 Divs from the South deliberately got them cut off and wiped out then I dont need to wait 6 months to rebuild...would have had them back in a month but its a bit too gamey to deliberately destroy part of your own army - it would be so easy to launch a spoiling attack and allow myself to get 'destroyed' taking some of the japanese down with me

But no I decide to do the proper thing and wait 6 months I hope i can hold long enough.......

[Andy Mac]

4 games going and no turn......boring

Reading an old book I used during the original build fascinating reading

[Andy Mac]

He hit karachi hard today high level sweeps with zeros v a layered CAP and wiped the floor with me

Good news looks like I may just avoid getting retreated again if my Divs can race away fast enough

[Andy Mac]

I really hate having to go to stupid altitudes how much combat really happened at 30,000 feet in the pacific but thats what you have to do extremely annoying

[BBfanboy]

I think the benefit to disbanding rather than being wiped out is that the unit comes back with a higher experience level than a unit bought back from the grave.

[Andy Mac]

Its a wash after you fill a unit with 1,000 Devices of all kinds its exp is in the tank anyway whatever happens it either needs to go into the front line and be part of some bombardement combat in a static supported front or sit a prep to 100 in a rear area

In either case its a couple of months to fill up the div even if you split it into 1/3s and the same time to get it up to national xp level

[Andy Mac]

Hindsight being what it is I should probably not have disbanded anything and as soon as I realised his commitment to the north I should have attacked to divert him and make him sent troops south - had i done that maybe i hold ulan Bator

But I disbanded a lot of mobile units early and moved others north before the rail net closed so I committed to a turtle strategy in the south too early - basically I had a plan and I implemented it to hell with what the japanese did - that was a strategic mistake

Dont get me wrong he has had months to prepare for this so fort levels will be high his airforce is ferocious and mine has been terrible so it might not have worked and may have cost me the south BUT I didnt even leave myself the option and that was a strategic mistake

I over focussed on making the North the main theatre and waiting for the upgraded squads by doing so I made his strategic calculation exceptionally easy and thats never a good thing.

Personally I still dont think an attack from the south with say an extra 1500 AV would have made a difference given what I expect to be defence in depth and high forts backed by air - but we will never know because by my decisions I removed even the option of doing it and thus I suspect released forces to crush me in the North

In essence whats happening in the North is my own fault - it may have been inevitable given the correlation of forces - but my decisons certainly didnt help prevent it

[Bif1961]

Another side effect from disbanding vice losing them in combat is the experience your opponent gains by destroying your units in combat. Of course he doesn't lose anything when you disband so for each decision there are unforeseen consequences.

[BBfanboy]

ORIGINAL: Bif1961

Another side effect from disbanding vice losing them in combat is the experience your opponent gains by destroying your units in combat. Of course he doesn't lose anything when you disband so for each decision there are unforeseen consequences.

Are you saying the enemy troops get an experience boost with every unit withdrawn or disbanded? Have you tracked that?