Question about CHS experimental and nikmod modified scenarios.

[String]

Do they, in addition to A2A modifications, also use the nikmod AAA modifications?

[m10bob]

If you mean has the AAA been enhanced, yes,(If you are referring to CHS/Nikmod)..
Nik gave a lot of thought and effort into his mod..

[Andrew Brown]

ORIGINAL: m10bob

If you mean has the AAA been enhanced, yes,(If you are referring to CHS/Nikmod)..
Nik gave a lot of thought and effort into his mod..

Nik certainly did, but remember that it was I that made the "Nikmod" version of CHS, by applying most - but not all - of his general A2A changes to the CHS scenario, not Nik.

To be more specific, I did add the AA effect adjustments that are designed to counteract the changes made to aircraft durability, but I did not make the AA weapon ceiling modifications that were, I belive, designed to reduce or eliminate the so-called "flak gap". So the mod contains a partial implementation of the Nikmod AA changes, rather than a complete one.

The same applies to the "experimental" scenario versions, which contain similar A2A adjustments as the Nikmod itself.

Needless to say, if there is any sort of problem introduced by the partial, rather than complete, implementation of the Nikmod alterations to CHS, then the fault is entirely mine, and nothing to do with Nik.

Andrew

[m10bob]

ORIGINAL: Andrew Brown

ORIGINAL: m10bob

If you mean has the AAA been enhanced, yes,(If you are referring to CHS/Nikmod)..
Nik gave a lot of thought and effort into his mod..

Nik certainly did, but remember that it was I that made the "Nikmod" version of CHS, by applying most - but not all - of his general A2A changes to the CHS scenario, not Nik.

To be more specific, I did add the AA effect adjustments that are designed to counteract the changes made to aircraft durability, but I did not make the AA weapon ceiling modifications that were, I belive, designed to reduce or eliminate the so-called "flak gap". So the mod contains a partial implementation of the Nikmod AA changes, rather than a complete one.

The same applies to the "experimental" scenario versions, which contain similar A2A adjustments as the Nikmod itself.

Needless to say, if there is any sort of problem introduced by the partial, rather than complete, implementation of the Nikmod alterations to CHS, then the fault is entirely mine, and nothing to do with Nik.

Andrew

Andrew, IMHO the Nikmod itself has horrific(frightening) AA fire..Is the Nikmod/CHS using the same AA stats?? I thought it was the same????[;)]

[ChezDaJez]

Judge for yourself. Brad and I are playing CHS experimental scenario 159. The date is 2/23/42. Air-air combats vs bombers are nearly bloodless in this scenario but losses due to flak are far greater than with the stock game.

Most airstrikes get through without air-air losses on both sides. Many get damaged but few are downed. Heavy bombers especially are virtually impossible to down. Out of dozens of intercepts I have shot down maybe 1 B-17E and 3 (IIRC) B-17Ds. Even Blenheims and Lilys routinely punch through heavy CAP without loss.

Chez

[m10bob]

Betty's oughtta fall like lit torches..Any word on them to share??

[JeffroK]

I'm playing Scen 155, is that one being talked on??
 
I am up to Oct 43, and find that things run pretty well in A-A & AAA combat. There has been 1 or 2 "Turkey shoots" but they are very rare.  AAA keeps up a steady toll.
 
I do think the Betty is a bit too "durable" but this could be as much pilot skill as durability as they now are copping some heavy losses.
 
For the JFB, AI managed to run a number of 200+ Betty/Nell raids from Truk. Most succeded but one did try it on a hex with 6 US CV's, not pretty.

[ChezDaJez]

Betty's oughtta fall like lit torches..Any word on them to share??

Yeah, they are pretty durable...

I think the mod has gone a bit too far in the opposite direction. I have a feeling that there will be no carrier survivors when the first CV-CV duel occurs. Right now, everything gets through with few actual losses. Many planes are damaged and some are lost to ops for that reason but very few actually get shot down in air-air.

The large number of Buffalos shot down is the result of a series of fighter sweeps I made against Singapore prior to its capture. Fighter to fighter combat seems to be pretty realistic in terms of losses overall. Its the fighter to bomber combat I am finding unrealistic... even Sonias and Anns get through!!!

Chez

[Sardaukar]

ORIGINAL: JeffK

I'm playing Scen 155, is that one being talked on??

I am up to Oct 43, and find that things run pretty well in A-A & AAA combat. There has been 1 or 2 "Turkey shoots" but they are very rare. AAA keeps up a steady toll.

I do think the Betty is a bit too "durable" but this could be as much pilot skill as durability as they now are copping some heavy losses.

For the JFB, AI managed to run a number of 200+ Betty/Nell raids from Truk. Most succeded but one did try it on a hex with 6 US CV's, not pretty.

Scen 155 is the Standard CHS Scen. Experimental version is Scen 159/160.

[Sardaukar]

Later in war when P-38 etc. arrive Betties start to go down in droves in 159/160 too. 

[m10bob]

IMHO, with Betty's in particular having such A to A survivability, I believe that rascal needs to be tweaked..[:)]

[Nikademus]

While there are some differences between the CHS (w/NM) and regular flavor NM, the simularities are enough for me to comment. In the early portion of the game, bombers in particular will probably be a tad more on the durable side. But as you get into the mid-later levels of the game you'll see increased lethality as experience and firepower values go up (and exp values drop for the defender) G4M's are far more vulnerable than armored bombers but that does not equate to "going down in droves" because for the most part, they didn't in RL. ("droves" defined in the WitP world as a dozen to two dozen + per round)

I've been spending alot of time calibrating the latest NM version (9.1 not yet released) using the soon to be released Guad scenario, and for the most part, G4M losses to fighters over Lunga has been close to what was experienced vs. well trained value 18 Wildcats.

[Helpless]

Current CHS-NikMod based on NikMod v8. I'm playing a couple of games with it and found that fighters are nearly useless (I'm still in early 42). NikMod v9 should have some improvements in that area (haven't tried it yet).

[ChezDaJez]

In the early portion of the game, bombers in particular will probably be a tad more on the durable side.

Hi Nik,

Right now bombers are getting through virtually unscathed on both sides. The allied bombers are relatively ineffective due to lower experience ratings but as they go up, I foresee them becoming excellent fighter killers as they currently damage or drive off my fighters in droves.

I've only lost one Betty to A-A but that is not an accurate picture as I've had most of them striking undefended land and sea targets. The Nells have been the ones that have encountered most of the air opposition and I've lost ten of them to A-A. But I've only lost one Sally to A-A despite dozens of missions against defended targets in Malaya and PI.

On the other side, the B-17s were difficult to down in stock. They are downright impossible now and I don't see that changing as the game progresses. IRL, they were difficult to down but not impossible. I have intercepted numerous small raids of 3-6 B-17s with up to 2 Daitai of very experienced Zeros yet they have only downed one. Japanese fighter armament does not improve that substantially and their experience levels are the best they will ever be in the game right now so I think we will continue to see an uber bomber syndrome.

This CHS mod is good, much better than stock. I am expressing only concerns at the moment, feedback if you will. But I think I would prefer bomber durability all around to be reduced by about 10%... or at least by an amount to allow a slight increase in losses.

Chez

[Nikademus]

well i'm continuing to tinker so we'll see. The guad scn makes for a good playtest and me and my cohort in crime are punching out alot of turns....arguing over the results and then punching out some more.