USCG Flower class Corvettes!!!

[m10bob]

Till I saw this, I never knew the USCG had these corvettes, as did the Free French!!

http://steelnavy.com/USCGcorvettes.htm

[witpqs]

They're in CHS and RHS, unsure about stock. Very useful due to the shortage of escorts.

[DuckofTindalos]

Why were they in the Pacific? They're ASW ships only...

EDIT: In fact, according to DANFS, not a single one of the Reverse Lend Lease ships served outside of the Atlantic and Carribean.

[witpqs]

I do not have the sources to cite, but they researched individual ships' histories for inclusion in CHS and RHS.

[m10bob]

I have respected the Flower class ever since ACES OF THE DEEP.

[spence]

According to the USCG historian none of the USCG-manned Flower Class corvettes served in the Pacific.  Also, according to the same source, three of the ones shown in the link weren't even CG ships (Fury, Temptress, Tenacity - all USN ships serving in Atlantic/Caribbean). The CG Historian does list all USN and US Army ships manned by USCG crews. 

[m10bob]

At any rate, here are all of the Flower class ships..

http://uboat.net/allies/warships/class.html?ID=42

[DuckofTindalos]

ORIGINAL: witpqs

I do not have the sources to cite, but they researched individual ships' histories for inclusion in CHS and RHS.

So did I. The Temptress and Activity classes never sailed in the Pacific.

[Dixie]

I thought they were mostly in the Caribean (lucky gits [:D])  They did have some of the best names ever for combat ships though.  USS Saucy anyone? [X(]

[DuckofTindalos]

Sounds positively Hornbloweresque, doesn't it?[:D]

[el cid again]

ORIGINAL: witpqs

I do not have the sources to cite, but they researched individual ships' histories for inclusion in CHS and RHS.

Well - yes and no. If a ship gets ADDED to RHS, it was researched by someone. But otherwise it is probably inherited from CHS - which itself has a similar relationship with stock. There are quite literally thousands of ships. I ended up reviewing individual large ships - every carrier - battleship - ocean liner. I noticed the Flower class in the data base, but merely assumed it was there because whoever put it there knew what they were doing. In many cases, for smaller vessels, no one anywhere ever looked up the details, and work was done from general references. RHS began when I wanted to make corrections for IJN vessels - but here the question of "were they PTO" was never an issue? Only slowly, over time, did it become clear that many aspects of our data set have problems. There are literally thousands of missing vessels - and there was even a specific request to put in the USCG ships - which it turned out were already there. Even the requester didn't know they should not have been there. It may seem "easy" to look up ships in a place like DNFS - there is no similar source for all ships - but the TIME to look them all up and then change every record is a problem that cannot be solved quickly. In general, the smaller the vessel, the less reliable the data about it - in particular if it isn't a Japanese vessel. For one thing, few Japanese vessels served outside PTO. For another, I tend to notice issues with them and work on weeding them out. For the Allies - even if a problem is identified - it may not be corrected in our lifetime.
I have about doubled the number of USN LSTs - and got rid of about a hundred because they were not PTO at all - or they served in some non-LST role - replacing them with ones that were PTO. But I still have probably missed more than a few - wild guess - dozens. And this was known a year ago. It takes a lot of time to fix this - for just one scenario. I am managing 18 - and that takes much more time.

[witpqs]

ORIGINAL: Terminus

ORIGINAL: witpqs

I do not have the sources to cite, but they researched individual ships' histories for inclusion in CHS and RHS.

So did I. The Temptress and Activity classes never sailed in the Pacific.

So how did they wind up in CHS? (Not blaming you, just wondering.)

[DuckofTindalos]

Well that's what I was wondering...

[witpqs]

Also, are you saying all Flower class vessels were solely in the Atlantic (including British & Canadian), or just the US ones?

[DuckofTindalos]

Not at all (haven't got the data to support such a claim). The thread was about US Flower class corvettes, and that's what I was talking about.

[spence]

The USCG and USN Flower-Class corvettes all served in the Atlantic and Caribbean.

As to the USCG Cutters in WitP I can say that they were not that well researched. Only one Treasury Class cutter, the TANEY, started the war in the Pacific: not 3 as in CHS. It transferred to the Atlantic at the beginning of 1943 with a armament scheme and profile unique for its class and then back to the Pacific at the beginning of 1945 as an Amphibious Command Ship. Several of its sisterships also entered the Pacific in the same time frame (1945) configured as AGCs (they all got configured as such but not all actually went to the Pacific before the end: BIBB and INGHAM certainly did).

One of the other 2 (Taney Class) included in CHS, the HAIDA, was sort of a scaled down Treasury Class (knock off 75 ft, a few 3" guns and a third of the speed and it's the same ship though). The other (Taney Class) in CHS, the ONONDAGA, was only half the size, with half the armament and half the speed of a Treasury Class cutter. In any case all the stuff about all the pre-war USCG cutters is in a thread from about 6 months ago including data about speed, endurance, armament and refits.

I might add, and not just from picque, that the USCG experience in night and day ops seems a bit low (20s to 40s). Unlike the Navy, the USCG actually has a real job in peacetime. Not only that, the USCG took over some USN ships in the 20's to fight "The Rum War" and so actually had more recent "battle" experience than either the USN or the IJN for the type of things that PGs and PCs do.

A listing of every USCG Cutter ever and every USN and USArmy ship manned by the CG during WWII along with photos and a synopsis of service (more or less detailed depending on ship) can be found at:

http://www.uscg.mil/history/

under "Cutters and Craft"

[witpqs]

ORIGINAL: spence

The USCG and USN Flower-Class corvettes all served in the Atlantic and Caribbean.

Any idea how many of these there are in CHS and RHS?

[el cid again]

I just looked and am only able to find RCAN Flower class - based on the West Coast they are technically PTO. I found a lot of other CW frigates - but no Flowers - and no US ones at all. Many MSW and PC and other small vessels were just reworked during conversion to two ship units - but I only went through the ship list three times - and it is huge. I might have missed some.

[m10bob]

From the 2nd link I provided above in this thread, some of the Flower class (Canadian) were in the PTO.
Seems it was dependent on where they were built and the west coast ships came out of Vancouver.

[DuckofTindalos]

Yup, the RCN Flowers sailed in the North Pacific and out into the Aleutians.