Two questions

[Hasardeur]

Hallo,

which szenarios can we expect and how many turns will it have ?

when can we expect the release of the game ? (hopefully very soon ! )

Regards

[Gregor_SSG]

ORIGINAL: Hasardeur

Hallo,

which szenarios can we expect and how many turns will it have ?

when can we expect the release of the game ? (hopefully very soon ! )

Regards

There is one main scenario with ten mystery variants as explained in the article. I can't give a precise release date yet, so its better if I don't speculate.

Gregor

[Hasardeur]

One scenario with 16 turns ? Well, this is not much ! People who will buy the game will have to hope for user made scenarios - something, which have not worked with Battlefront.

This is a serious reason not to buy the game before some more scenarios are relesased !

Greats

[HercMighty]

Yup getting worse, now you only get 1 scenario. Really with the variants you still only get one scenario you just get to play it differently.

No Thanks.

[Erik Rutins]

Ok, I'm disappointed to see these comments. Let me ask you wargamers a question. If you saw a board game tomorrow that covered the 2nd Battle of Kharkov in detail and with excellent research and great play balance (along with 10 "variants") would you consider buying it? My guess is that the answer is yes. Yet with computer wargames, that's not enough?

I think a key point to be made in SSG's favor is that they really do their research and play the heck out of these battles before releasing them. You can take quantity over quality, but how many other scenarios have you played where it was clear the designers did not do their research or did not play through from both sides for balance or both?

Quite simply, if you want the best operational depiction of the 2nd Battle of Kharkov, along with a bunch of variants and the best rules from Decisive Battles as well as Battlefront, this is the game to get. If you also want a full new editor and an engine that supports both battalion and regimental scales, this is the game to get.

This is a game designed and balanced by a veteran team of designers, with an outstanding track record of quality. Such games are not exactly a dime a dozen in the computer wargaming world.

Regards,

- Erik

[Ola Berli]

Gents,
 
this is a huge battle. The unit density is big. With the variants I think this game will give many months/years of gaming.

[Hasardeur]

Hallo Erik,

you may be right - we should give the game a chance and I think I will do so but maybe SSG can do something for the gaming community and release some add ons with further scenarios for this new game engine - and I am willing to pay for it.

This whould be the only way for somebody like me who is untalented in making scenarios to get some experiences with other scenarios.

[Duck Doc]

Battles In Normandy did quite well with one campaign imltho.

Where did you get 16 turns? Regimental & battalion level at one turn a day? I would suspect it is more than 16 turns.

ORIGINAL: Hasardeur

One scenario with 16 turns ? Well, this is not much ! People who will buy the game will have to hope for user made scenarios - something, which have not worked with Battlefront.

This is a serious reason not to buy the game before some more scenarios are relesased !

Greats

[Duck Doc]

You nailed it!

I'm sold & stoked.

ORIGINAL: Erik Rutins

This is a game designed and balanced by a veteran team of designers, with an outstanding track record of quality. Such games are not exactly a dime a dozen in the computer wargaming world.

Regards,

- Erik

[Hasardeur]

Take a look on the screenshots - you will find turn 1/16 at different places. I have Battles of Normandy and I love it but it contents more than one scenario and 2 campaigns (the second is the Ardennes one).

Greets

[TheHellPatrol]

[8|]Not again....no thanks

{One scenario with 16 turns ? Well, this is not much ! People who will buy the game will have to hope for user made scenarios - something, which have not worked with Battlefront.

This is a serious reason not to buy the game before some more scenarios are relesased !

Greats }

ORIGINAL: HercMighty

Yup getting worse, now you only get 1 scenario. Really with the variants you still only get one scenario you just get to play it differently.

No Thanks.

[HercMighty]

ORIGINAL: Erik Rutins

Ok, I'm disappointed to see these comments. Let me ask you wargamers a question. If you saw a board game tomorrow that covered the 2nd Battle of Kharkov in detail and with excellent research and great play balance (along with 10 "variants") would you consider buying it? My guess is that the answer is yes. Yet with computer wargames, that's not enough?

I think a key point to be made in SSG's favor is that they really do their research and play the heck out of these battles before releasing them. You can take quantity over quality, but how many other scenarios have you played where it was clear the designers did not do their research or did not play through from both sides for balance or both?

Quite simply, if you want the best operational depiction of the 2nd Battle of Kharkov, along with a bunch of variants and the best rules from Decisive Battles as well as Battlefront, this is the game to get. If you also want a full new editor and an engine that supports both battalion and regimental scales, this is the game to get.

This is a game designed and balanced by a veteran team of designers, with an outstanding track record of quality. Such games are not exactly a dime a dozen in the computer wargaming world.

Regards,

- Erik

And personally I think this is where you went wrong. Your pushing this on us. Where we have asked for variety, you have gone the opposite direction. You try to mask this with the mystery variant thing but sorry I don't see it that way. So you've made your decision and maybe it will work out, but for me this is where my support of these games end.

[HercMighty]

ORIGINAL: Erik Rutins

I think a key point to be made in SSG's favor is that they really do their research and play the heck out of these battles before releasing them. You can take quantity over quality, but how many other scenarios have you played where it was clear the designers did not do their research or did not play through from both sides for balance or both?

And to this, look to Panther Games....

[Erik Rutins]

ORIGINAL: HercMighty
And personally I think this is where you went wrong. Your pushing this on us. Where we have asked for variety, you have gone the opposite direction. You try to mask this with the mystery variant thing but sorry I don't see it that way. So you've made your decision and maybe it will work out, but for me this is where my support of these games end.

I'm not pushing it on you, but I'm trying to show you the positive side of things. I do think the board game comparison is a good one to think over. Yes, I'd love to have more scenarios and more content in general, but I think there's also some degree of underestimating the amount of work these games and scenarios actually take, when done right. Given SSG's track record, I feel that Kharkov is good value for the money wargame-wise, if you're at all interested in the battle.

The mystery variants in other games would likely be extra scenarios - in this one they're folded into the options for a single scenario. If we'd said "1 Historical Kharkov Scenario + 9 Kharkov Variants for 10 Total Scenarios" would that have helped?

Regards,

- Erik

[Terminus]

Excuse me, but could you show me where Matrix is putting a gun to your head and forcing you to buy this or any other game? Just curious...[8|]

[HercMighty]

ORIGINAL: Terminus

Excuse me, but could you show me where Matrix is putting a gun to your head and forcing you to buy this or any other game? Just curious...[8|]

No where. And I did not imply that is what they were trying to do. And maybe my wording was a little strong, but they have decided to go down a road I have decided not to follow. It is of my own free will. Maybe for others, and maybe even to further for lots of others this will be what they want and will be happy with. I feel though it was a bad decision.

[Kung Karl]

I think the game looks sweet. Love the ideo of AO. Just hpoe it will work out ok. Sure, more scenarios would be great it will still be a quality title I am sure.

[Llyranor]

I'm okay with one scenario if it's very well researched and executed. I'll be up to supporting this game once I finish the previous ones (I bought KP/AtD/BiN/BiI/BF on a binge during the latest sale) - or once I'm convinced I should just keep supporting the series indefinitely (haven't played enough to decide that yet). The DB games didn't seem to have that many scenarios either (aside from the sub-scenarios that are just part of the main one). But first, to clear that backlog...

[HercMighty]

ORIGINAL: Erik Rutins

If you saw a board game tomorrow that covered the 2nd Battle of Kharkov in detail and with excellent research and great play balance (along with 10 "variants") would you consider buying it? My guess is that the answer is yes. Yet with computer wargames, that's not enough?

Regards,

- Erik

No the answer is no. I don't buy boardgames for this reason. Also single battle games, board or computer have a certain shelf life.

No matter how you spin it we are buying one scenario. The fact that it can be setup differently does not change that basic fact. So unless you have a great interest in that one scenario how much replay value is there? Same map, same units, same over all end objective....

Sorry just how I see it.

[Ola Berli]

Erik Rutins,
 
how many turns have the full campaign game? Could You also say a bit about the number of units on each side? Are we talking many hundreds?