Thoughts on a paratroopers and British surrender

From the front lines in France and Russia to the deserts of North Africa and the airfields and convoys of Britain, the campaigns of World War II are yours to command in WW2: Time of Wrath! This turn-based grand strategy title, the highly improved and expanded sequel to WW2: Road to Victory, puts the player in charge of the political, economic and military decisions of one or more Axis or Allied nations, including minor nations.
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Fintilgin
Posts: 195
Joined: Thu Apr 14, 2005 12:45 am

Thoughts on a paratroopers and British surrender

Post by Fintilgin »

Two seperate things I've thought of, as I've started seriously digging into this game (which is a lot of fun so far).

First off it seems like paratroopers are a bit too cheap, powerful, and easy to use. I can buy six or eight paratrooper units and drop them all the same turn. For example, as Russia, I delayed my war against Finland to the spring. I declared war, dropped a paratrooper unit on every unoccupied city, took them all, and surrounded and besieged Helinski with paratroopers, which immediately surrendered. Then it was a couple turns for my Leningrad strike for to take Nyborg and Finland was annexed. A couple months later I had redeployed them, declared war on Persia, and on the first turn took all the open victory cities with paratroopers as well as completely surrounding and besieging Tehran which fell quickly. Then it took just a couple turns for my main forces to take the last garrisoned VP city and Iran surrendered. If it hadn't joined the Axis I was about to rinse and repeat on Romania.

In my current game as Germany I did similar fun stuff with Sealion. In February(!) I dropped all over the place in Britain. I took ungarrisoned Norwich and Manchester, as well as grabbing all the industry across Wales and the Midlands. I didn't intend for these guys to survive until Sealion launched in the spring (although they largely did), but just to deny all that production at a critical time. (Perhaps the British AI should make a point of ALWAYS keeping a cheapy 6pp division in every city and on all their resources in range of a paradrop? Similarly, I suppose the Russian AI should do the same. You should only really be grabbing cities for 'free' from minors, IMHO.)

I guess I'd increase the cost of airbone units a touch, and disallow you from beseiging with paratroopers. I'd also require you to purchase Airborne Transport Capacity. Why is this free? We have to pay for sea transport and strategic transport, but I could drop conceiveably drop fifteen, twenty, even thirty paratroopers in a single turn, wreaking havoc, blocking supply, preventing retreats. Not cost effective, maybe, at that scale, but right now they're just too good/easy to use.

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I conquered Britain and offered them peace, and was surprised at the result. I got to keep Cornwall and Edinburgh, while they kept Egypt, Malta, and Gibralter. Also Iraq remained at war with me as the bold, sole member of the allies (lol). This seems a bit off to me. Anyone else have thoughts on what should happen on a British surrender? It seems far more plausible to me that something like this should happen:

1.) All Axis units vacate England/Wales/Scotland. No weird little German occupied enclaves.
2.) Northern Ireland is ceded to Ireland. Ireland becomes either an Axis minor or strongly pro-Axis.
3.) Gibralter is ceded to Spain and Spain joins the Axis/becomes much more strongly in favor of the Axis.
4.) Malta and Egypt are ceded to Italy if Italy is part of the Axis. Otherwise only Malta is ceded, and Egypt becomes a pro-axis/neutral minor.
5.) Iraq becomes a neutral minor or pro-Axis minor and peaces out if at war with the Axis.
6.) Certain colonies lost in WW1 are ceded to Germany. Germany gets a small 'Colonial Income' PP bonus every turn. This can be blocked by allied/American units in the Atlantic the same way Axis units block British convoys.


It might even be fun to give the victorious Germans some fun multiple choice events to 'dictate the peace'. For example you could have an events like:

Determine the fate of Gibraltar:
Now that Great Britain has asked for terms we can finally humiliate them the way we were humiliated at Versailles! How should we dispose of Gibraltar, the gateway to the Mediterranean?
1.) Give it to the Spanish.
Cede Gibraltar to Spain. Small drop to Italian war economy.
2.) Give it to the Spanish... if they agree to join the Axis.
Cede Gibraltar to Spain. Spain gets event allowing them to chose to join Axis or refuse the gift. Small drop to Italian war economy.
3.) Give it to Italy
Cede Gibraltar to Italy. Small bonus to Italian war economy.
4.) It is all for the Reich! Keep it for Germany!
Cede Gibraltar to Germany. Big drop in Spanish pro-Axis level, small drop to Italian war economy.

Determine the fate of Egypt:
With the surrender of Great Britain, the ancient land of the Pharaohs has fallen under the German thumb. What should we do with this rich prize?
1.) Give it to the Italians.
Cede Egypt to Italy. Small boost to Italian war economy.
2.) Make it a German colony.
Cede Egypt to Germany. Moderate penalty to Italian war economy (Hitler has betrayed us!)
3.) Make it an independent nation.
[/i]Egypt becomes pro-Axis minor. American war entry drops a bit, as Germany is being less 'expansionistic'.[/i]



Anyway, just some thoughts. :)
SeaMonkey
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Joined: Sun Feb 15, 2004 3:18 am

RE: Thoughts on a paratroopers and British surrender

Post by SeaMonkey »

Crap!  Does this ever sound familiar.  Yeh Fintilgin you have hit on some desirable features, one called "Decision Events" and the other is "build limits", both already been incorporated, tested, and instituted in another game design.
 
Wasteland .....are you listening?
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JFalk68
Posts: 223
Joined: Mon Nov 05, 2007 3:15 am

RE: Thoughts on a paratroopers and British surrender

Post by JFalk68 »

Just curious,

How does supply effect the airborne units? Dropping units behind enemy lines are they considered out of supply? A loophole in the ai like this would be a deal breaker for me getting the game.
Fintilgin
Posts: 195
Joined: Thu Apr 14, 2005 12:45 am

RE: Thoughts on a paratroopers and British surrender

Post by Fintilgin »

I think they go out of supply and generally get shredded if the enemy has any real forces nearby.  However, in the case where I took Manchester and Norwich I was getting limited supply from those cities.  It was enough that I could partially reinforce my units.  That's mainly what allowed me to hold on to Manchester for several turns against the Brits.  They never moved in force against Norwich.  They didn't have a lot of troops, so I assume their priority was guarding London and the coast.
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JFalk68
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RE: Thoughts on a paratroopers and British surrender

Post by JFalk68 »

Well that makes sense they get a partial supply from the city. I would think that the paratroops would scavenge or take what they needed from the general population for food, and fuel I can see them getting also. I think ammo should not able to be supplied or replacement bodies
gwgardner
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RE: Thoughts on a paratroopers and British surrender

Post by gwgardner »

Playing against a human opponent would be a different story, probably. Then all those paratroopers would probably get cut up.

Playing against the AI, why not simply make some common sense house rules. To make it more challenging, I mean. Not even the US in WWII had that many paratroop units, so to build that many is an exploit of the game system. Or go into the game files and up the costs of paratroops.

In RtV the cost of a paratroop unit was approx half the cost of an air army, I believe. It was impossible to build many of them for that reason alone.

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willgamer
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RE: Thoughts on a paratroopers and British surrender

Post by willgamer »

ORIGINAL: Fintilgin

dropped a paratrooper unit on every unoccupied city...


Seems like an AI oversight to me. [;)]

Easy to fix- code high priority to garrison each city in para drop range to the nearest enemy border.
Rex Lex or Lex Rex?
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