2nd Yokosuka SNLF

[PzB74]

Probably discussed this before, but no luck finding a thread.

Quote:
The 1st Yokosuka SNLF (Special Naval Landing Force) was formed 20 September 1941, at Yokosuka Naval District, round a battalion of 520 paratroopers, this force had taken Menado as part of the Sasebo Raiding Force. The 2nd Yokosuka also formed at the Yokosuka port area, 15 October 1941, with 746 men and trained as such, took no part in any airborne operations and became an island defensive base unit. End Quote

Questions: The 2nd Yokosuka SNLF was obviously equipped with trained paras. The fact that they were not deployed as such doesn't mean that they were not capable of performing para operations!

In AE Only the 1st and 3rd Yokosuka SNLF's are para drop capable while the 2nd SNLF is sitting in Cam Ranh Bay at the outbreak of hostilities and can only be used in amph operations.

My 2c is that the player should have the option of using this unit in para drop operations as well.

[jwilkerson]

Our data indicates 2YOK were not trained as paras, so like all good historians (even amateur ones![:D]) we must be true to our sources! [:)]

Our main man for IJA details was one "TAKI" as he is known on the internet. The formalization of his input regarding Japanese paras was his book:

Rottman, G. and Takizawa, A. Japanese Paratroop Forces of World War II, Osprey, 2005

[PzB74]

Ok info on this is obviously a bit conflicting.
Your source is probably better than mine as of yet since I've only been using the Internett:
http://www.9thimperialmarines.com/JSNLF.html

As a good JFB I will examine this further [;)]

[jwilkerson]

Sources were contradictory (that's were the fun comes in) ... for instance Underwood, who relies havily on Madej, stated that 2YOK was para trained. However, Taki is Japanese and cited a number of Japanese language sources, so we weighted his evidence more highly. The Underwood->Madej link is based on captured US Army data as well as post war debriefing material and hence is quite old and 3rd hand.

[Zebedee]

'Taki' is considered to be a leading authority on the Japanese (and Manchurian) forces of WW2. He's occasionally wrong. But then so's my wife. I just can't recollect when the last time was for either.

Lovely to hear that he was involved in the Japanese OOB. He's a gentleman and a scholar who aided me greatly with some information on the Manchurian Navy that I was searching for.

[jwilkerson]

Er, lest I allow possible misunderstanding, Kereguelen and I must take full responsibility for the IJA (and IJN) land OOBs.

We did however, consult 'Taki' on a number of detailed questions, another area were the Independent Engineer Regiments, which in stock seemed to all be represented as "Flame thrower assault" regiments [:D] ... in reality they were of several flavors and 'Taki' definitely helped us sort these out. The "shipping engineers" and other variations you will see are much more representative of these units. The one type we still struggle with are the bridging units as still in AE there is no function for bridging engineers [:(] ...

[Scott_USN]

Anyone used Paratroopers in that fashion yet? Not sure how to do it just airlift them to a enemy base?

[PzB74]

Yep, just drop them over any dot base or bigger.
- they are shock troops and will immediately attack the target.

ORIGINAL: Scott_USN

Anyone used Paratroopers in that fashion yet? Not sure how to do it just airlift them to a enemy base?

[jwilkerson]

ORIGINAL: PzB

Ok info on this is obviously a bit conflicting.
Your source is probably better than mine as of yet since I've only been using the Internett:
http://www.9thimperialmarines.com/JSNLF.html

As a good JFB I will examine this further [;)]

Actually your "website" cites Taki as a contributor. If you want to drill further, shoot Taki a question, maybe he got some new data and changed his mind from what he presented in his book. If he changes his mind, so will we!!!

[Zebedee]

ORIGINAL: jwilkerson

Er, lest I allow possible misunderstanding, Kereguelen and I must take full responsibility for the IJA (and IJN) land OOBs.

We did however, consult 'Taki' on a number of detailed questions, another area were the Independent Engineer Regiments, which in stock seemed to all be represented as "Flame thrower assault" regiments [:D] ... in reality they were of several flavors and 'Taki' definitely helped us sort these out. The "shipping engineers" and other variations you will see are much more representative of these units. The one type we still struggle with are the bridging units as still in AE there is no function for bridging engineers [:(] ...

Sorry jwilkerson, I didn't mean to imply that he'd done the work you and Kereguelen should take the plaudits for (and the flak [:D]), but the fact that he seems to have helped clarify some of the finer points to allow you to make a decision on how to implement things. [:)]

The lack of bridging engineers (for both sides) is something I'd love to see implemented should the functionality ever be added to this engine or another, possible, maybe, future one [;)]

[jwilkerson]

Well as all "authors" do ... I am happy to give credit to those who advised us - such as Taki - but Kereguelen and I must bear the responsibility for all errors.

[PzB74]

Taki's home page:
http://www3.plala.or.jp/takihome/

Can send him a mail, can't hurt!

[jwilkerson]

Aye, that's how we found him in the first place. You gonna ask, or you want me to?

[Iridium]

ORIGINAL: jwilkerson

Aye, that's how we found him in the first place. You gonna ask, or you want me to?

Why not send him a copy of your land OOB and let him give it a once over while he's at it? Maybe throw in a free copy as his fee, if he's willing.[:D]

[Brady]

Rottman, G. and Takizawa, A. Japanese Paratroop Forces of World War II, Osprey, 2005

Mentions on page 27. The 2nd Yokosuka SNLF, howeaver it simply refers to it disbanding after operations in British Borneo, with no other mention of it, which is interesting, since it did not conduct a paradrop it is obvious why the operational part of the book does not mention it, but it also does not mention it when it covers the forming of the 1st and 3rd.

My asumption is that it just was not deployed as a paratrooper unit per say, but did exist as such???, it will be intersting to see what Taki has to say.

[PzB74]

Already sent him an e-mail! [:)]

Btw: Could it be a good idea to include a "para sign" on the para drop capable units in AE like you did in WitP?

When I was fidling with the para units I of course tried to organize a para drop with the 2nd SNLF and couldn't understand why it wouldn't work [;)] Took me a few min to figure out that only 1st and 3rd were drop capable, and the only indication was the inclusion of para squads in the unit.

ORIGINAL: jwilkerson

Aye, that's how we found him in the first place. You gonna ask, or you want me to?

[jwilkerson]

Hum, there is supposed to be a different symbol for the para units.

[jwilkerson]

Hum, the para SNLFs seem to have a para symbol in my game - not yours??

[Brady]

Caught up with Taki over at Axis History:

Report this postReply with quoteRe: Yokosuka 2nd SNLF
by Akira Takizawa on 15 Aug 2009 19:52

> Was this formation Para capable?

No

> Thier are some referances that mention that it was trianed at the same time as the 1st and 3rd, but never conducted a para drop.

They are wrong.

Taki
Akira Takizawa
Member

[oldman45]

ORIGINAL: jwilkerson

Hum, the para SNLFs seem to have a para symbol in my game - not yours??

To my old eyes it looks like a marine symbol [:(]