Great Patriotic War - Rework

[bwheatley]

Myself and abulbulian have been playing GPW lately and we noticed a few issues that we wanted to address.

We found that certain german HQ staff started with 0 XP. We also realized with the map scale we needed to up flak ranges and other variables. So we're working on a new GPW that will hopefully cut back a little more towards the middle so that germans have a better chance of thriving. We'll be posting here about the forthcoming updates.

[Bamilus]

Awesome, I like that mod.

Can't wait! [:)]

[bwheatley]

Changes we're working on
Changes for more realism and bug fixes:

- Finland got some buffs: better exp units, 2 more fighters, more starting supplies, bit more inf.
- Axis have research breakthrough in divebombers II and staff II
- German staff have exp from 70-75 depending on if panzer or inf HQ type (experience from fighting in many campaigns before Russia)
- Supply for blitz added to Army Groups North, Center, and South: 15,000 each.
- added a few more 88 flak units to major German HQs
- fixed some axis units that had 0 experience.
- added few more trucks to some German mobile HQs
- brought down Russian arty units from 3 to 2 pieces and thus are now mobile (10 inf, 2 Arty, 3 Horses)
- added three more factory towns (to offset Russian lose of arty and objectives for axis): Kharkov, Kursk, and Rostov
- added a bit more SS reserves for axis NVKD reserves for Russians in the training HQ

[bwheatley]

We're going to play test a bit and then if we're more happy we'll push out the new version.

[bwheatley]

version 7.01
--------------------------------------
- Finland got some buffs: better exp units, 2 more fighters, more starting supplies, bit more inf.
- Axis have research breakthrough in dive bombers II and staff II
- German staff have exp from 70-75 depending on if panzer or inf HQ type (experience from fighting in many campaigns before Russia)
- Supply for blitz added to Army Groups North, Center, and South: 15,000 each.
- added a few more 88 flak units to major German HQs
- fixed some axis units that had 0 experience.
- added few more trucks to some German mobile HQs
- brought down Russian arty units from 3 to 2 pieces and thus are now mobile (10 inf, 2 Arty, 3 Horses)
- added three more factory towns (to offset Russian lose of arty and objectives for axis): Kharkov, Kursk, and Rostov
- added a bit more SS reserves for axis NVKD reserves for Russians in the training HQ
- katusha rocket launchers had ranged increases to 2

version 7.02
------------
- fixed some Russian HQs that had 0 exp --> now set to 25
- reduced effectiveness of naval units vs air
- minor increase in air effectiveness vs naval
- reduced starting Axis Army Group HQ 'blitz' supply stockpile from 15,000 to 7,500 (blitz only 4 turns)
- upgraded all German (not axis) HQ staff to tech II
- upgraded all German non-fighters to tech II
- increased CAII and above to have significantly better better air attack

** note it's not advisable to put your fleets out in harms way unless you have air superiority without CAII or better.  However, since this is a ground war type campaign, it's not advisable to use precious pts on ship tech. 
Planes

Basing
Max of 10 fighters per base
Max of 10 bombers (dive or level)

Plane Attacks
Max of 10 Fighters per sortie
Max of 10 bomber (dive or level) per sortie

Russian Tech Restrictions
41: no tech, except armor II no sooner than Sept.
42: max tech II in all categories
43: no restrictions

Axis Tech Restrictions
41: max tech II in all categories, except no armor tech
42: max tech III in all categories
43: no restrictions

* Axis may not build 'Heavy Tanks' until 43, only Russia can (KVI and KVII).

[bwheatley]

We'll be uploading the new scen for approval shortly.

[bwheatley]

http://www.advancedtactics.org/scenario.php?nr=116

This is the scen that is up for approval.

[british exil]

Will upload ASAP, will have to wait till 03.06 though as we have visitors sleeping in the room (bunker) where my pc is.

Sounds great that GPW has been worked on. Thx in advance for the work.

Mat

[bwheatley]

ya ara and i have put some changes into it. There were a few bugs with things and some of the german units didn't start out with enough supply for the 4 turn dash.

We'll probably do some more updates to it if there is demand. We just wanted to get it more stable.

[Rander]

Nice work

I played this scenario and the Archduke variant (I liked this one a little bit more). Now let's see your's.

Bye.

[bwheatley]

What did archduke change? I didn't know he made a variant we are just trying to fix a few things broken in the original scen. It's a huge scen so its easy to have over looked little things.

[Rander]

Here is the variant:

http://www.advancedtactics.org/scenario.php?nr=84

There was a thread talking about it but I can't find it.

The changes (that I remember):

1. Production System changed:
    - All production based on factories. No cards for buying troops.
    - 3 kind of factories: Supply depots (they only produce supply), recruitment centers (they only produce infantry) and factories (they produce vehicles, artillery and aircrafts). If factories are captured production is halved for the other side. Captured recruitment centers don't produce anything.
    - Number of factories increased a lot.
    - No PP production on factories. Every city and town gives you PP (I think that they gave the value of his Victory Points).
    - PP's are used for: research or increase industry production (buying the only one avaiable card).

2. Blitz period shortened to only the first turn. But attack (and movement?) values are increased by 4.
3. No conscripts. And no conscrpits raise in turn 5.
4. Didn't remember the effect of Soviet Winter, sorry.
5. Russians can't develop Fighters IV.
6. Rail avaiable (to increase the landcap capacity).

That's all that I remember. Maybe if Archduke reads this can say something more.

Bye.

[bwheatley]

hrm i kinda dig the cards. I like that you have a way to keep an out of supply area in the fight if you have the pp too. In a game my opponent encircled kiev but i was always to keep it fighting for awhile with the cards. 

[srndac]

Hello!

I have just finished the 2nd 'fight' vs. AI - which is waaaaaaay too weak in this scenario.
In the first fight, the German AI never even crossed Daugava River (Me as AGN vs. NW Front AI), and completely stopped there after it began to load it's units with mines and trains. After that I simply swarmed one piece of the front at a time, until I reached Konigsberg - in November 1941 ...
The story repeated itself in the second fight (Me as AGC vs. W Front AI), where the AI overloaded it's units with mines - which are fairly easy to destroy BTW - and I took Moscow in October 1941 ...
So ... do you see any way to fix this?

Another thing: what's with the SS Freiwilligen? Shouldn't they be SS? Instead of Axis Minors and/or (mere) Germans?
OTOH that's probably something to ask the original maker of the scenario ...

Overall - great work, guys! Keep it up! AT forum needs more men like you!

Cheers!

[british exil]

what's with the SS Freiwilligen

If I'm not mistaken the SS Freiwilligen would have been "inferior" units that were made of soldiers of Countries that the Germans had conquered. The Dutch and Danes and quite a few others, no books here at the moment to get the correct info about where the freiwilligen came from, had a few SS members. They would have been the Freiwilligen that are in the Scenario. They were given the SS title but that was about all. Inferior weaponry plus they weren't inclined to fight to the death as the real SS units were. But they still put up quite a fight and most units were either disbanded as WWII came to an end, or they were encircled and destroyed.

There was even a muslim SS unit. Can't remember much about them, where they were stationed.

Mat

Mat

[bwheatley]

Yea we're playing through some test games now with our latest changes before we work on more. I really really really like ostfront & case blue (grymme) style of making units more individual but that might be too much work so hopefully we can spice it up to still make it fun. In our game right now it's our first go through and man its a bear. I've been playing poorly i think as the soviets but i did some things differently then our first (pre work) game of gpw. I kept my reserve armies ... in reserve. One was south east of leningrad because ara liked to cut leningrad off from supply asap.

And the other armies i kept SW of moscow. So major highlights to this point. I've kept the germans probably 3 turns of full movement away from leningrad to the south west with some blocking armies. He moved his panzers to the SE of leningrad to cut us off and that's very scary. Around moscow i have 4th panzer army north of moscow but i think i have them pretty much in a holding pattern now by showing my tank armies on their flanks. On the west of moscow i have them stopped at the river just SW of moscow (forget the name).

And the southern approach to moscow we have fortified and expect to meet the enemy in a few turns (hopefully by winter).

In the south/central. Kharkov and kursk both fell last turn giving the germans 2 new factories. Sevastopol fell as well (it's not a factory so no biggie) though it does free up a romanian army for use near rostov.

The germans were pushing their 11th army spearhead towards rostov but we had an army that was able to come and almost cut off the germans flank so the 11th army and romanians have pulled back. That for now will save rostov.

We have a reserve army building in stalingrad to help train up my units. We have a very very experience russian tank army thats east of kharkov hiding in woods from german air power ready to pounce. This is probably the most decorated unit in the russian military at this point. Early in the invasion this tank unit was able to escape the german onslaught and take up positions near kiev. When the germans captured kiev the tank unit along with other conscripts were able to destroy 80% of the german spearhead and cause a retreat. The tank unit was very spent after that she didn't lose any tanks but she was in need of some R&R. We strat transfered her south west of kursk to get some R&R and await her next chance for combat. That chance came in september when the 11th panzer divsion, a german motorized division and a german infantry division were holding an important cross roads after fighting through the soviet hordes. The tank unit came up the road and along with 2 flanking conscript divisions hit the soviets and completely shattered all 3 german divisions destroying all by 1 of the enemy tanks. This unit was then evacuated to the area east of kursk to again refit.

Thats the story so far. We're almost to october when i should get my first siberian army.

[Jeffrey H.]

It'll be intersting to hear about the results.

[bwheatley]

We noticed that it was super hard to stop germany at moscow even with 100% of production dedicated there. That was with myself and ara both playing the germans so we're pushing out 7.0.3 shortly which will have some better enhancements to help the soviets a bit. 

[bwheatley]

here is the changelist for 7.0.4

version 7.03 -
------------
- Increase flak effectiveness outside of your own hex from .5 to .75
- Turned on counter artillery fire
- Added flak to siberians
- Added fighters and divebombers to siberians
- Made the finns fight better against soviets then germans
- Make siberian people (give them color) make them fight well aganist axis
- Give siberians more equipment.
- Siberians start with all tech 2 equipment (even if soviets have not researched it)
- Give NVKD color.
- Trains and trucks both have 2000 transcap we upped train transcap significantly
- make sure units created with cards start with 10 xp
- Upped german base morale to 65 since axis minors base is 50
- Also fix the few friewillian ss places some of them make germans when they should make axis minors
- research blocks are all fucked up
- put recon plane into the mix (testing)
- recon planes can be produced now
- Gave siberians hq units with planes and bombers and arty
- battleships shore bombardment range increased to 2
- gave partisans some blow points so they can blow bridges if presented with the chance
- dropped partisan supply usage so they can move for 12 turns without supply
- gave partisans antisupply points for land to show how they interfere with supply
- increased river crossing  penalty so vehicles won't be able to cross a river without a bridge (streams can still be forded rivers can not)
- made new units 0 PP to create (this is just a test to see how it plays out) still recommend house rule with a minimum of 2PP per unit
- increased pp for hq to 5pp to offset not having cost for inf
- changed mud to give 60% readiness loss for everyone not just 50% random chance per unit.
- Gave mud a very negative offensive combat modifier (80%, and 85% for minors) to account for difficulty in fighting in mud.
- Gave mud a negative defensive modifier (50% and 60% for minors) to account for difficulty in fighting in mud
- Give soviets a bonus to fighting in snow and give siberians a bigger bonus to fighting in snow. (10% bonus 30% siberians) (increased during severe winter)
- We are modifying the hex stacking limits to be more in line with divisional combat. We are taking the average of a division in the opening of the game to determine when the defensive stacking penalty hits. (It appears to be about 80-110, some tank divisions are a bit more).
** So if you want to make sure not to suffer crazy losses do not stack more then a typical division into a hex or it will suffer higher losses even against a weaker force.
- making FOW a little more intense now that we have recon planes.
- Making unit size required to capture a hex be about 1/4 the size of a division (100pp).
- enabled antisupply losses over land (since partisans will affect antisupply)
- placed fortresses around leningrad, moscow, kiev and sevastopol for balancing.
- cut destroyer Anti Supply range from 100 to 50 since the scale of the game is different then WAW.

[bwheatley]

after a little work the past few days

version 7.04 -
------------
- Mud readiness penalty reduced from 60% back to 20% as was originally
- Winter Combat penalties below
Severe Winter Regular Winter
German -50%AT/-40%DEF -25%AT/-20%DEF
Minor -60% -30%
Soviets -30% -15%
Siberians -10% 0%
- Siberian HQ's toned down a bit
- Siberian Divisions are toned down a bit as well
- Siberian unit xp reduced to 70 (was 80)
- Recon planes were given HQ's