Map editing question: structures

tracer · Post by **tracer** » Tue Jul 30, 2002 8:52 am

I decided to *attempt*

to update an older scenario map that doesn't display properly under v7.1 (its still included on the map and scenario lists though). Pages 150-153 of the game manual show alot of the buildings available while creating or editing maps, but several of the file locations (like the 'military multihex buildings) don't seem to work. I realize that the manual was put together back in v5.0, so is there a site or downloadable doc that contains an updated list? I remember that Fabio's site used to have new .shp files, but that area seems to have been eliminated (or maybe just moved). I also looked around Fred Chandla's site but didn't find anything.

Any help or advice would be greatly appreciated.

RockinHarry · Post by **RockinHarry** » Tue Jul 30, 2002 6:51 pm

Originally posted by tracer
I decided to *attempt* to update an older scenario map that doesn't display properly under v7.1 (its still included on the map and scenario lists though). Pages 150-153 of the game manual show alot of the buildings available while creating or editing maps, but several of the file locations (like the 'military multihex buildings) don't seem to work. I realize that the manual was put together back in v5.0, so is there a site or downloadable doc that contains an updated list? I remember that Fabio's site used to have new .shp files, but that area seems to have been eliminated (or maybe just moved). I also looked around Fred Chandla's site but didn't find anything.

Any help or advice would be greatly appreciated.

Yes..the military building shape file (Ter61) seems to be not completed concerning the centering and other issues. Don´t know why they´re left as they are. I guess unless someone tries on a fix of this shape file it should be avoided/not used in a scenario.

Other solution is to adjust the hex attributes to the off-centered building tiles with Freds Map Editor for a particular scenario/map. Off course it would be better if someone does a fix on the shape file itself in Freds Shape Editor (SP Fix)....I recall David Boutwell planned to do this, but he probably lacks time too!

_________
Harry

tracer · Post by **tracer** » Tue Jul 30, 2002 9:10 pm

Thanks Harry, you saved me alot of time.

Is there a program I can use to view .shp files? The ones I saw on Chandla's page seem to be for other SSI games, if I read the descriptions right.

I'm also trying to figure out how to change elevations, specifically creating 'height 1 and 2' hexes and making tall buildings (heights above 30). Sorry for the glut of questions; if there was a manual that explained these things I'd certainly take the time to read it.

Resisti · Post by **Resisti** » Wed Jul 31, 2002 1:03 am

Tracer, I can't give you the ultimate answers (Harry will do that

), but I can point you to a couple of places:

shp files:
in the "Chandla" folder, provided with Spwaw, there is a program called "ShpEd", I've been able to look at shp files with it (tough I don't know what to do after :rolleyes: )

elveation and other features:
these can be done with Chandla WawMap, which is in the same folder as above. To get a clue on how to do, pls look at Harry's signature above and download it's explanation document. (remember, RIGHT click on the link).

tracer · Post by **tracer** » Wed Jul 31, 2002 1:34 am

Big thanks Resisti; I had downloaded that program but when I saw 'Panzer General' in its readme.txt I didn't think it was what I was looking for. The ShpEd help file in the Chandla folder explained it all.

Jeeez...map editing sure is time consuming (y'all can stop laughing now!).

Don Doom · Post by **Don Doom** » Thu Aug 01, 2002 2:33 am

Originally posted by tracer
Big thanks Resisti; I had downloaded that program but when I saw 'Panzer General' in its readme.txt I didn't think it was what I was looking for. The ShpEd help file in the Chandla folder explained it all.

Jeeez...map editing sure is time consuming (y'all can stop laughing now!).

Tell me about it!:D

RockinHarry · Post by **RockinHarry** » Thu Aug 01, 2002 6:01 pm

Originally posted by Don Doom

Tell me about it!:D

Hooray! Doom is back!

________
Harry

tracer · Post by **tracer** » Thu Aug 01, 2002 6:19 pm

Originally posted by RockinHarry

Yes..the military building shape file (Ter61) seems to be not completed concerning the centering and other issues. Don´t know why they´re left as they are. I guess unless someone tries on a fix of this shape file it should be avoided/not used in a scenario.

Other solution is to adjust the hex attributes to the off-centered building tiles with Freds Map Editor for a particular scenario/map. Off course it would be better if someone does a fix on the shape file itself in Freds Shape Editor (SP Fix)....I recall David Boutwell planned to do this, but he probably lacks time too!

_________
Harry

Harry,
I've been using Photoshop for years, and I now know how to convert between .bmp and .shp in ShpEd. If you let me know what needs to be adjusted on the files in Ter61 I'll get started on it.

RockinHarry · Post by **RockinHarry** » Thu Aug 01, 2002 7:28 pm

Originally posted by tracer

Harry,
I've been using Photoshop for years, and I now know how to convert between .bmp and .shp in ShpEd. If you let me know what needs to be adjusted on the files in Ter61 I'll get started on it.

Aargh...I wished I would have some quick and easy answers here!

The truth is I mostly edit shapes that have already correct centering values applied! This is how I made the winter style buildings, I just needed to take the original centering values for the new shape graphics.
It´s somewhat different when editing shapes that are not yet properly centered at all. I was too lazy so far, to figure out and write up a procedure to make the centering stuff from scrtch. :rolleyes:

As said,...shape centering needs to be made in the "Fix SP Header" Window of Freds Shape Editor. You need to find out how much to shift the crosshaires to get the shape properly centered in SPWAW. That´s probably a trial and error affair by now, but I don´t know it any better..sorry.

IIRC the zoom levels for Ter61 are not yet done too. Means after shrinking the shapes to the proper zoom levels (z4=100%, z3=80%,z2=60% and z3=35%) you need to make the whole centering procedure to these files too! That´s something I don´t volunteer for...

Maybe warhorse or someone else can give some more details.

________-
Harry

tracer · Post by **tracer** » Thu Aug 01, 2002 8:10 pm

'Trial and error' it is then

I was looking at 'SP Fix' yesterday and noticed that once you figure out certain values its fairly easy. I'm sure after I get the first one corrected it'll be smooth...and monotonous!

Two values would really give me a jump start: how many pixels wide (and tall)each hex is, and how wide does a structure need to be to abut with those in adjoining hexes. Anyone know?

David boutwell · Post by **David boutwell** » Fri Aug 02, 2002 8:25 am

Tracer,

Harry was right. While I was working on my Nijmegen map, I found that I needed more variety in industrial buildings. I knew that the "military" tile set had numerous "industial" buildings, but they were not correctley centered for all magnification levels. So, I sat out to remsdy the problem. Then,while working with ShpEd, I found that I couldn't, for some reason, shift the icons far enough left or right to do what I needed to do. I had not yet figured out the solution when I found that Use1 of the multi-hex buiding button has plenty of usable buidings in it, which rendered my whole quest pointless at the time, as I was more interested in finishing the map than fighting Shpedit. And I've been busy ever since.

Maybe you could contact Fred Chalnda and ask him how to solve the problem of not being able to shift multihex buidings enough to center them at each zoom level.

If you get something going, let me know. I'd be glad to render whatever help I can manage.

Regards,

David Boutwell

"Out of Ammunition. God Save the King!"

tracer · Post by **tracer** » Sat Aug 03, 2002 9:53 am

Thanks David...I've got all weekend to devote to this, and a few ideas. If I find (or trip over!) any solutions I'll be sure to post them.

Grenadier · Post by **Grenadier** » Sun Aug 04, 2002 3:25 am

The ter 61 building are the SP2/SPWW2 building sets. SPO 2 used the upper LH corner for the data hex of the 7 hex miltihex configuration..

It has been about 2 years since I have even looked at SPFix and Shp Edit when I did the special buildings for Berlin and the map of Kharkov. The tricky thing is to change the information data from the upper LH hex to the center hex. Paul lewis and Nick papp are the only perplle I know of who are good at this type of work. You might e-mail them and ask them how to do it or put up the question on Fred'd Forum. Nick and paul (and harry ) are suppoed to be monitoring it as Fred himself has some difficulties in writing long replies.

tracer · Post by **tracer** » Sun Aug 04, 2002 4:20 am

Brent,
Its ironic you mentioned your Kharkov map...its my personal favorite and the reason I started this project. I'm aware of Fred's condition and figured he was unreachable; checking out his forum is something I hadn't tried yet, thanks. That's probably my best chance to contact Nick and/or Paul too.

Appreciate the help

tracer · Post by **tracer** » Sun Aug 04, 2002 7:36 am

I thought http://blake.prohosting.com/fchlanda/messages.htm was Fred's forum; anyone have any other links I could try?

tracer · Post by **tracer** » Sun Aug 04, 2002 10:24 am

I found the problem, and the solution, but don't know of an easy way to implement it. Normal multihex building shp's are 65 square pixels in z1, 109 in z2, 144 in z3 and 180 in z4....all of the shp's in all four Ter61 files are 215x179. If you convert each to the proper dimensions, they can be adjusted using 'SP fix' and work as advertised.

I fixed one building, but don't know how to use the 'batch file' feature in ShpEd to automate the process. It would really speed things up if I could just drop in the cropped/resized bmp's and 'hit a buton'

RockinHarry · Post by **RockinHarry** » Sun Aug 04, 2002 7:08 pm

Originally posted by tracer
I thought http://blake.prohosting.com/fchlanda/messages.htm was Fred's forum; anyone have any other links I could try?

this one is down since long time! Brent most likely meant the militarygamer-online forum:

http://www.militarygameronline.com/foru ... forumid=95

..not much trafic around there though.

select "Show threads from the last year" to see available threads!
________
Harry

tracer · Post by **tracer** » Sun Aug 04, 2002 8:00 pm

I thought only you and Don Doom used that forum

Just kidding; I see that the people who know the most about SP editing and design do check in there occaisionally. Thanks much for the link.

RockinHarry · Post by **RockinHarry** » Sun Aug 04, 2002 8:18 pm

Originally posted by tracer
I thought only you and Don Doom used that forum Just kidding; I see that the people who know the most about SP editing and design do check in there occaisionally. Thanks much for the link.

Well..you´re actually not that far from the truth!

Wished Fred (..and Nick, and Warhorse) would join in from time to time, but as said...

________
Harry

David boutwell · Post by **David boutwell** » Mon Aug 05, 2002 1:55 am

Tracer,

I don't think that the cancellation of Fred's forum by his message board provider for lack of traffic in any way reflects the ammount of use that his editors get, or our appreciation that we have for his work. His editors are to SPWAW what the Rosetta Stone was to the study of hieroglyphics!

Fred's email address can be found at the website mentioned below. But, I guess that, as stated earlier, you might not get the reply you desire. I wouldn't know, as I've not contected him personally in a while. I didn't know he had a forum , because I've either gone to his help file for clarification, or contacted people who know his work through the SPWAW forum. If you contact him, please be sure and let him know how much we appreciate his work.

Would you mind sending me a personal email with specific instructions on how to resize the builsings. I'd possibly like to give you a hand on that project.

Regards,

David Boutwell

"Out of ammunition. God save the King."

Map editing question: structures

Map editing question: structures

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