[DONE] Scenario for testing: Battle of the First Salvo

[Yokes]

This is the first scenario I am working on from the book The War That Never Was. This battle takes place in the eastern Mediterranean Sea at the outbreak of the war. The Soviet Baltic Fleet has broken out into the Aegean and is closing in on a lone US CVBG. Lots of air and surface warfare.

I had lots of fun learning about the event system. What a wonderful way to add "smarts" to the AI. Outstanding!

Have fun. As always constructive criticism is welcome.

Yokes

[Primarchx]

I'll give it a try. Love Med scenarios!

[tommo8993]

A bit too easy, just launched my A-6's with harpoons and took out half the soviet SAG. Thought their was a bit more to the scenario with the NATO SAG in the Aegean(Why are they their?). Good scenario, maybe needs a soviet carrier.

[Yokes]

Tommo:

Did you violate the ROE and shoot first? Or did you wait for the Soviets to start the fight? I'm pretty sure starting WWIII is grounds for a court-marshall...

Did you sink all 4 Soviet capital ships? (There are 3 Soviet SAGs.) That seems difficult to pull off with just one A-6 strike.

However, I do agree that it is a pretty easy scenario. (The order of battle was set by the book.) I think the challenge is in killing all the capital ships within the time/munitions limits while minimizing losses.

Thanks for trying it out!

Yokes

[tommo8993]

Ok, it turns out my first strike doctrine might not work...
Having re thought it and put an extra 2 real hours into the scenario, I can safely say its one of the best scenarios Ive come across. I hope you make more because this one was great. Also adapting to the soviet viewpoint would be pretty cool. Loved it 10/10

[mikmykWS]

Yokes gave it a shot tonight. Very nice work! I'll send you a pm at some point with a couple of points.

Thanks!

Mike

[Maromak]

Started playing your scenario. I have barely started but what I've seen so far looks good. I've been getting a LOT of freezes during this scenario. Will post savegame file to new thread.

[Yokes]

So apparently the trigger conditions are "OR" and not "AND". You should be getting very premature "you win!" messages...

Fixed.

[Maromak]

ORIGINAL: Yokes

So apparently the trigger conditions are "OR" and not "AND". You should be getting very premature "you win!" messages...

Yep got a 'win' message after sinking the main ship of the initial threat group.

[AndrewJ]

Hi Yokes,

I'm just starting this up, and I have a quick ROE question.

Is it a matter of "if they take a shot or two, go ahead and start the general conflict" (i.e., if they turn red, they're fair game), or should I be expecting some sort of "We are at war" message from command before I begin the engagement?

Thanks,

Andrew


Ah.... A message. Do you think they'll look the other way about that tattletale at the bottom of the Med? After all they were marked as hostile, and their buddies on the Slava had shot down two of our drones and opened fire on our innocent S-3.

[Gunner98]

Yeah I did the same - the Slava took a swipe at a couple of Tomcats, they went hostile and the snoop ship was quickly feeding fish, about an hour later I got the message, just as my strike to hit the Slava was on its final approach [:D]

[Yokes]

ORIGINAL: Gunner98

Yeah I did the same - the Slava took a swipe at a couple of Tomcats, they went hostile and the snoop ship was quickly feeding fish, about an hour later I got the message, just as my strike to hit the Slava was on its final approach [:D]

Andrew and Gunner98,

I am having a heck of a time trying to keep the AI from shooting too early. I have to set the US as "unfriendly" otherwise the AI won't open fire. (They won't shoot at neutrals, even when "engage non-hostiles" ROE is active.) It seems that ships will shoot at "unfriendly" aircraft that get too close.

One solution in my updated version of the scenario (coming soon) is to just set all the carrier's aircraft with a ready time that prevents them from launching prior to the first shots. Not perfect, but it helps.
I also thought about putting something in the orders about "don't fly too close to the Slava", but who reads the instructions? [8|]
I would like to create no-navigation zones so the AI would stay away, but I would need them to be enabled/disabled by event triggers.

I welcome any other suggestions!

Yokes

[Gunner98]

Yokes

I don't think I'd worry about it. Perhaps put in the orders something like 'No offensive engagement until authorized, basic self defence only' or something like that. It would be pretty poor form for a CAG to have his entire air group grounded in a time of high tension. The worst that can happen is that things start getting hot early and when the message does come (I assume it is a timed event) the player might have to admit he jumped the gun a touch. It would be unlikely that the Slava is sunk prior to that, you probably have his missiles ready to fire at the same time but when I did jump the gun in an early run through, the Slava unloaded its SSMs the moment it contacted the Tomahawks inbound anyway. Just a thought.




[[Spoiler]]








BTW, some leakers got through from the bomber strike, I got them all with a little help from the Turks, but not before they sent a flock of Kitchen's my way, one got through and the San Jacinto caught it - not nice [:(] - but nicely done[8D].

BB

[AndrewJ]

Ahh, the bomber strike. There I was all smug and confident, and ready to feed the stream of blindly approaching helpless bombers into the Turkish meatgrinder, and then... [X(] [X(]

Got them all, but heaven help me if there's a second wave! [:(]


The occasional potshots from the enemy before formal hostilities are actually very effective at generating a realistic amount of tension and confusion. "They just shot down a second drone Admiral, what should we do?" I think if you just added a statement about the initial ROEs to the opening briefing it would work very well.

I'm really enjoying this scenario so far. Thanks for writing it.

[Yokes]

Thanks everyone for the feedback.

Here's my (hopefully) final version. You can play as the Russians now. (Good luck!)

Yokes

[Gunner98]

Just noticed one thing. An Israeli mission 'Israeli Slava Strike' was too late to do anything for the Slava so re-directed itself to the Kirov group, did a little damage, a couple turned back due to lack of fuel, but on the way home they all ran out of gas and splashed. I like the idea that they are helping but they shouldn't be on a kamikaze mission, not sure if they can mid-air refuel, if so I would put some tankers in support (perhaps USAF), or if they cannot I would restrict the area that they can strike in. Perhaps move the mission earlier so that It goes in just after declaration of hostilities.

B

[Gunner98]

OK Just had time to finish before work. Good game. A couple observations.


-The NATO SAG does not have any Helo's, that is unlikely, but I think I know why you did it, giving them the Helos would make the last group too easy to find. Perhaps a note in the intro about a distraction (perhaps a NEO (non-combatant evacuation), or some other task that is keeping them busy)

-The Brits on Cyprus would certainly be involved in this party, as a minimum the SigInt base at Episkopi, but also the F-4 base at Akrotiri and other radars. Perhaps have them help the Israeli's or write them out of the scenario somehow. Its not too difficult now so if you put them in you need to beef up the Syrians to counter them

-The Israeli TF that pops up wasn't much use because I had sunk the Syrian msl boats with some LDGBs earlier. Perhaps if the Syrians were further NE protected by their air cover the player would not risk resources on them, thus putting the Israelis into play, maybe a clue in the Side brief that they might be available would help.

-I would put a sub threat in the game just to keep the player on their toes, keeps the CV & BB from racing around at Flank speed anyway.


Really enjoyed the game, sorry this is a bit late as you have already put out your 'final' version, these are minor points and its a good game. Thank you.

BG

Results


SIDE: US
===========================================================

LOSSES:
-------------------------------
6x F/A-18A Hornet
4x A-6E Intruder
1x CG 56 San Jacinto [Ticonderoga Baseline 3, VLS]


EXPENDITURES:
------------------
81x 127mm/54 HECVT
31x Generic Chaff Salvo [5x Cartridges]
49x AIM-7M Sparrow III
20x RGM-109B Tomahawk TASM
27x AGM-88A HARM
12x Sea Dart Mod 1
149x RIM-66H SM-2MR Blk II
48x RIM-66J SM-2MR Blk II
20x AIM-9M Sidewinder
28x AGM-84C Harpoon IB
16x GBU-10E/B Paveway II LGB [Mk84]
12x AIM-54A Phoenix
20x AGM-62B Walleye II ER/DL
8x 20mm/85 Mk15 Phalanx Blk 0 Burst [200 rnds]
14x RIM-67B SM-2ER Blk I
10x 20mm/85 M61A1 Vulcan Burst [100 rnds]
6x RIM-7M Sea Sparrow
8x Mk214 Sea Gnat Chaff [Seduction]
24x RGM-84C Harpoon IB
8x Otomat Mk2 Mod I
8x RGM-84D Harpoon IC
8x RGM-84A Harpoon IP



SIDE: USSR
===========================================================

LOSSES:
-------------------------------
1x SSV Mirnyy [Pr.393A]
12x Yak-38M Forger A
2x EM Sovremenny I [Pr.956]
1x RKR Slava [Pr.1164 Atlant]
1x PRTB Amga [Pr.1791]
1x SKR Krivak II [Pr.1135M Burevestnik-M]
2x BDK Ropucha I [Pr.775]
1x VT Dubna [Kerch]
12x MiG-31 Foxhound
23x Tu-16K-26PM Badger G Mod
8x Ka-25Ts Hormone B
1x BPK Kashin Mod [Pr.61M]
1x SKR Krivak I [Pr.1135 Burevestnik]
1x BPK Kresta II [Pr.1134A Berkut A]
1x PKR Moskva [Pr.1123 Kondor]
1x TAKR Minsk [Pr.1143 Krechyet]
1x RKR Kirov [Pr.1144 Orlan]

SIDE: Turkey
===========================================================

LOSSES:
-------------------------------
10x F-4E Phantom II
6x F-16C Blk 30 Falcon


SIDE: Isreal
===========================================================

LOSSES:
-------------------------------
6x F-15A Eagle [Baz]
8x F-15C Eagle [Baz]
12x F-16C Blk 30 Falcon [Barak]
12x Kfir C.7
10x A-4N Skyhawk [Ahit]
2x Mastiff UAV


SIDE: Syria
===========================================================

LOSSES:
-------------------------------
36x MiG-21bis Fishbed N
10x RK Osa II [Pr.205ER/U]
22x MiG-23ML Flogger G
10x MiG-29 Fulcrum A

[Yokes]

Gunner,

Thanks for the great feedback!

Overall, my goal is to be true to the book. Where the book was silent (forces out of Greece/Crete for example) I made the scenario silent. That's also why some of the events don't seem to "fit" together well. (The Isreali flotilla and air strike for example. In the book the US SAG does not attack the Slava and instead goes after the Kirov/Minsk group. The Isrealis take out the Slava.)

I kept subs out because the book has them not playing any meaningful role. Also, I think subs are pretty much broken right now. I have another scenario from the book that is a sub vs. ship and it is totally impossible. The subs are totally blind (except for the periscope) and the ships (even without helos) find and kill the subs every time. There is also the issue with the lack of sprint/drift by the escorts. Once all these get fixed I'll release that scenario.

Thanks again for trying it out. I have a bunch more coming...

Yokes

[Gunner98]

Super, I look forward to them.

B

[mikmykWS]

ORIGINAL: Yokes

Gunner,

Thanks for the great feedback!

Overall, my goal is to be true to the book. Where the book was silent (forces out of Greece/Crete for example) I made the scenario silent. That's also why some of the events don't seem to "fit" together well. (The Isreali flotilla and air strike for example. In the book the US SAG does not attack the Slava and instead goes after the Kirov/Minsk group. The Isrealis take out the Slava.)

I kept subs out because the book has them not playing any meaningful role. Also, I think subs are pretty much broken right now. I have another scenario from the book that is a sub vs. ship and it is totally impossible. The subs are totally blind (except for the periscope) and the ships (even without helos) find and kill the subs every time. There is also the issue with the lack of sprint/drift by the escorts. Once all these get fixed I'll release that scenario.

Thanks again for trying it out. I have a bunch more coming...

Yokes

Why are subs broken right now?

The snorkel thing or something else?