Large Infantry Unit?

[gcbisset]

I have a project for my solo gaming where Id like to add some battalion size infantry units to an estab. I see a couple of battalion size estabs, FJ Training Battalion, and in EF, an NKVD Battalion, but they are just around 250 men in size. Is there a theoretical limit to the number of men in one unit? Id like to have 800 or so if I could.

Thanks,

George

[ChrisMaiorana]

I am not sure George. I considered battalion sized combat for Stalingrad as there were so many units involved. But ended up drilling down to company level.

[BletchleyGeek]

Hi,

No, there isn't any limitation on the amount of personnel.

[jimcarravall]

ORIGINAL: gcbisset

I have a project for my solo gaming where Id like to add some battalion size infantry units to an estab. I see a couple of battalion size estabs, FJ Training Battalion, and in EF, an NKVD Battalion, but they are just around 250 men in size. Is there a theoretical limit to the number of men in one unit? Id like to have 800 or so if I could.

Thanks,

George

One way to scope the size of any unit is to build it up from the "blocks" in a typical military organization, meaning an infantry battalion isn't necessarily a specified number of personnel but a specified number of lower echelon units which start from the basic building block of crew, fire team and / or squad.

Here's a good overview of how a military formation is built up:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Military_u ... _and_units

The make up of a fire team or squad is dependent on the primary weapon being used in that formation. Infantry operations would be more dependent on weapons manned by single soldiers assembled into squads or fire teams while armor or artillery units would be more dependent on the number of personnel making up the crews necessary to operate the number of tanks and guns assigned those type units.

So, the make up of an organization is also dependent on what the US Army calls a "table or organization and equipment" (TO&E) which lays out whether the unit's tasks are accomplished more with single soldiers massing to perform tasks (as in infantry) or a combination of weapons platforms (tanks, guns, trucks, etc.) assembled to perform the tasks and thus requiring crews to operate the platforms efficiently.

Here's an overview of TO&E:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Table_of_o ... _equipment

Thus, infantry battalions might reach the 800-1000 personnel levels (after building up the number of squads / fire teams that make up a platoon, the number of platoons that make up a company, and the number of companies that make up the battalion) while a tank battalion might require "only" 250-400 personnel depending on the number of tanks in a platoon, number of platoons in a company, and number of companies in a battalion.

The training battalion you mention probably has fewer personnel because it serves at the administrative level of a battalion for command and control purposes, but is really a holding formation for individual soldiers who eventually get dispersed into individual squads, platoons, and companies as the need arises. It needs the command structure and battalion level authority to handle the administration and control inside a regiment or division, but not as many personnel to handle the paperwork necessary to manage the movement of individual replacement troops.

Hope this helps.

[gcbisset]

Thanks, Guys!

Yes, thats what I want to do, just add one battalion size unit as Caphillrat considered doing. Ill play around with the estabs/coes/xmls, which I find a little confusing at this point.

[BletchleyGeek]

ORIGINAL: gcbisset
Yes, thats what I want to do, just add one battalion size unit as Caphillrat considered doing. Ill play around with the estabs/coes/xmls, which I find a little confusing at this point.

Feel free to make any questions about that, I'll be glad to help.

[gcbisset]

I suspect my pms are not getting thru to CaptH, he sent me estabs with the Sov. battalions and they look fine and loaded into the editors, but when I tried to put them into the Tagnrog scenario or a new scenario, I got a message like "You cannot add that to that side". Can you reply here or email me at gcbisset@gmail.com?

Thanks,

George

[ChrisMaiorana]

Hi George. Sorry my replies aren't getting through. So are you trying to update my Taganrog scenario with battalions and getting the error? If so I will try and replicate.

[gcbisset]

Actually, I dont think my messages to you are getting thru, so here or email might be best LOC.

Yes, first I tried to add to a new scenario, then tried to add to Taganrog as an experiment,, since I thought that scenario would be compatible with the EF stuff, and in both got the "cant add that" message.

Thanks!

George

[gcbisset]

I really appreciate your help, but I think the scenmaker may be over my head. I suppose someone could make a more detailed tutorial (perhaps on youtube, perhaps in writing) on how to make a new scenario (I dont know how many potential scenario makers have been stopped by this problem.

But there is one thing you could do for me quickly which might be easy to do (easier than troubleshooting), Could you make me a scenario with the Battalion estab loaded onto the largest map you can find (doesnt even need to be a Russian map). I could then make several solo scenarios in the various parts of the map.

Im playing a campaign game where I use TripleA for area movement, then when I have a battle I need to adjust the estabs on the map on to the correct force levels. Then I input the results of the battle back into TripleA.

If not I understand, but thanks!

George

[ChrisMaiorana]

Hi George I will place the battalion units on my Riga map for you. Its 250 sq. km

[Arjuna]

If you develop a German unit estab you cannot then create an actual unit using that estab for the Allies.

[gcbisset]

Thats great! can you do that and send a link when it is done?

Ill then use it as a blank to make scenarios.

Thanks so much!

George

[ChrisMaiorana]

George sorry it took so long. I did this last night for you and will post a link to the files here later today.

Chris

[ChrisMaiorana]

Hi George. This is a link to an unfinished scenario called Fortress Riga 1944. It has battalion level units for the Germans and Russians placed on the map. The map is the same as my Riga map.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/hbomiqwxmpdxb ... 201944.cos

The most recent form of my estab for the Eastern Front is here:

https://www.dropbox.com/s/ykqhr1o6xemi9qt/EFSTEstab.coe

XML file is here: https://www.dropbox.com/s/8du9w6064du2hpc/EFSTEstab.xml

[gcbisset]

Thanks so much!

Ive been playing with it for a week (it took me that long to figure out I had to use beta version 6274, but now Ill see if I can modify it to make more scenarios.

Keep up the good work!

George[&o]