Enslavement and penal colonies

[Gregorovitch55]

I've got a situation where I've enslaved a race at their home world (and a few of their other colones) and having looked up what I can I realise their pop won't grow. This world has the Trade Bazaar and Holographic wonders, so ideally i would like to build it's population with family races. In the mean time these wonders are costing me the earth and retuning diddly squat.

1. How can you designate a penal colony so the slaves are moved there?

2. Can you destroy these wonders at their current location and rebuild them at your home world (and do you need the tech for them to be researched to do so)?

[fenrislokison]

1. select a world not too far away from the world you want to be bug-free (or monkey-free or fish-free), set its policy to assimilate/Exterminate. It will be the penal colony. Put some troops (around 1-2 per billion population) to avoid revolts.
Set the world your want to be bug-free to assimilate/resettle => passengers ships will start to pick bugs from this world and send them to the penal colony.
Set all other worlds to assimilate/do not accept to avoid the bugs to come here.

2. Yes, as far as i know. But i read there is a delay between the destruction and possibility of rebuild of a wonder (around 2 months)

[Tehlongone]

Well if you just want to clear the world out to utilize it better with your own race then resettlement by itself will be sufficient or exterminate for the fast if somewhat wasteful solution.

As I understand it penal colonies don't work unless you've selected the setting as a policy. Otherwise like Fenrislokison said, except he probably meant assimilate/enslave rather than exterminate.

[Gregorovitch55]

ORIGINAL: fenrislokison

set its policy to assimilate/Exterminate. It will be the penal colony.

Did you mean assimilate/enslave?

Also, i did not set use penal colonies at the start of the game, but I changed it later - will that matter?

Also when you say "not too far away" do you actually mean "within passenger ship range", i.e. sector range, or is there another parameter that governs how near a penal colony needs to be?

Also I take it there is not actually any indication on the UI that colony is a penal colony, just that other races are set to "enslaved"?

[Tehlongone]

ORIGINAL: Gregorovitch55

Also, i did not set use penal colonies at the start of the game, but I changed it later - will that matter?

Also when you say "not too far away" do you actually mean "within passenger ship range", i.e. sector range, or is there another parameter that governs how near a penal colony needs to be?

Also I take it there is not actually any indication on the UI that colony is a penal colony, just that other races are set to "enslaved"?

It's a policy so it'll work from the time it's enacted to the time it's repealed, makes no difference that you only activated it now.

As I understand it the penal colonies prevent the resettled races from going to foreign colonies instead of your enslavement colonies, therefore it should work within a very large range, though the close ones takes precedence I suppose.

If there aren't any penal colonies already the AI picks one or more planets and renames them to have penal colony in it's name, but if you assign enslave setting on some of your planets then I believe all such planets count as penal planets.

[fenrislokison]

hello again

sorry, i was a bit in a rush since it was lunch time, i saw my colleagues leave and my stomach started to make a ruckus [:D]

So yes, assimilate/enslave for the penal colony is sufficient, but i noticed that once the world is filled, the migration stops. By setting the policy to exterminate, you are sure there is always enough space to welcome the newcomers

There is also another positive point: the immigrants will probably be less numerous than the neighbouring assimilated population, which means they will probably be exterminated with fewer or no turmoils.

Ideally (i never really tested it but i think it's the best way) you want your penal colony to have about 1 billion "assimilated" population, then change it to "do not accept" to limit the growth in order to always have space for the future exterminated while having a accepted population more numerous than the exterminated one.

When i said "not too far away", yes i meant one or 2 sectors away, else, from what i saw, the migration will not be quick enough.

I don't think the "penal colony" name matches a game mechanic, i think even if you name your colony "bug paradise", it will work the same.

For your information, rather than setting a penal colony, i found it easier (but more costly) to garrison about 25 troops (in case of rebellion), set 0% taxes and a starport with recreational and medical center ("have confidence, this medicine is for your own good... hohoho!") and just exterminate the unwanted population.

Another faster strategy (because exterminating takes a lot of time) is to make them rebel by putting taxes to hell and no troops, then, once they are independent, nuke them to death! (it good also for your diabolical reputation, just in case people didn't understood that you're not the kind of guy to piss off).

Then recolonize the world with your own settlers, even if the planet has a bad quality since you'll be able to heal it with a terraformer.


...
...
I must say i'm worried about my own ability to establish strategies of mass murdering...

[Bingeling]

The point of penal colonies should be to use the population to generate income. If the penal colony is full, you need another one. I lack experience with that, though.

Extermination is a different policy, if you want slaughter colonies, feel free, but they are a different concept.

[fenrislokison]

eeeh.... good point!

Enslaving doesn't have a lot of advantages so i must have thought a bit too far [:D]

[Bingeling]

What? So enslaving Sipan 4 did not give any benefits?

[fenrislokison]

I surrender! please don't hurt me! i'm just your average, innocent tyrant!

I have been maliciously manipulated by all the guys on this post: tm.asp?m=3636133 who said that enslavement didn't worked well!

The fact that it matched my own observations is just a pure coincidence!

And the fact that i only tried to enslave unhappy bugs prove that i'm a benevolent oppressor! It also showed me that it wasn't very profitable...

But! It seems in this post that evilier people who enslaved happy going species seems to have better results! Maybe i should try... huh? no i didn't say anything!

Besides, i love the perfume of nuclear-grilled boskarans in the morning light.

[Bingeling]

Sipan 4 was full of nice, happy beings also known as Atuuk. Notice its population compared to my poor capital...

Beate in the image was the same, but low development and newly conquered. It never became as nice, Sipan 4 has a development bonus and became a regional capital, but was very profitable anyways.

[Tehlongone]

It looks like enslaving Sipan 4 had debatable benefit. You are running 24% taxes, why?

What is the final tax income if you remove slavery and set tax as high as the populace accepts?

If you don't have significant happiness bonuses I'm guessing you just lost money.

As for using penal colonies to exterminate, that seems wasteful, why not just kill them where you found them? Faster and easier that way.

[Bingeling]

The mighty dhayut does not play nice with the inferior species, of course. Why have multiple races if all are to be played the same way? If I was worrying about income, i would at least float some recreational and medical centers about the non-spaceport colonies in that game

At a much later date, allowing for war effects to go away (tax up from 14 to 41%). 153K tax income from 407k revenue at +9 happiness. The population was much down (7537M), I am not sure why, did they migrate away from slavery?

With some assimilation it was 54% tax at +10 happiness, and 166K income. But the population increased to 7793M in that time.

[fenrislokison]

20000 to 7000? oO

Maybe you should check if your troops didn't get fat... seems to me they eat too much snacks...

And if the snacks escaped, ehh... i mean the prisonners migrated, there are serious flaws in the security!

[Tehlongone]

You are certain they didn't repeatedly and mindlessly rebel and got shot down by your garrison?

[Bingeling]

ORIGINAL: Tehlongone

You are certain they didn't repeatedly and mindlessly rebel and got shot down by your garrison?

Yes. Happy Atuuk under slavery does not rebel. And the Atuuk are always happy...

It is my AAR game, so there are lots of nice images to be found. I noticed the revenue going down, but never checked why

From conquest and through updates, population was:

20662 (M) (during conquest battle)
20359 (first after conquest)
20026
19306
18474
17514
16921
15605
14497
13321
11505
11097
7553

A big bump at the end. Possibly due to lots of nearby colonies to move to being conquered?

[Gregorovitch55]

ORIGINAL: Tehlongone

If there aren't any penal colonies already the AI picks one or more planets and renames them to have penal colony in it's name, but if you assign enslave setting on some of your planets then I believe all such planets count as penal planets.

I am also playing the mighty Dhayut ( couldn't resist playing with battle spiders ) so the game started with all my planets set to assimilate family and enslave the rest. When I learned about this penal colony stuff I set some planets to assimilate/ensalve and changed the rest to assimilate/resettle.

The problem is no planets have had their names changed to "xxx penal colony", the slave populations are slowly falling and I can see no discernible movement of slaves from resettlement worlds to enslavement wolds.

I am very confused, and my battle spiders are getting a bit tetchy.

[Cauldyth]

Check your Empire Policy screen. There's a toggle in there for "Use Penal Colonies" which may be turned off.

[Gregorovitch55]

As I mentioned above, I realised that and turned it on shortly after my first invasion.

[Gregorovitch55]

Just a couple of supplemental questions on this:

1. Has anyone actually seen a player planet change it's name to "xxx penal colony"?

2. The economic downsides of this enslavement approach seem large: happiness on planets with slaves is rock bottom, the cost of garrisons is significant, populations don't rise, tax takes pitifully small, the advertised 50% tax bonus has nothing to bite on. In my previous game I made much more money assimilating everyone, although that was playing as democracy and on normal difficulty, I stepped up to hard this time. Is this experience of it common?